Keiya
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When will this madness end!? Or, more seriously, could we get an update to kdd 2.0 to either pin down the styles, or at least make the ones which currently *are* pinned to something other than the rest of the level float like the rest of the level?

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Jacob
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I could be completely out of line here, and talking nonsense since I've not yet re-imported KDD 2.0 into DROD4, but...

KDD 2.0 is a DROD2 hold (JtRH), and the styles of JtRH/DROD2 are a subset of those in TCB/DROD3, which are a subset of those in GatEB/DROD4. So why should there be any re-mapping at all?

If I'm wrong, can you give us an example of a remapping?

(wasn't me who downmodded you, btw)


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[Last edited by Jacob at 04-03-2012 09:34 PM]

gamer_extreme_101
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KDD non-2.0 would theoretically have nine styles mapped to it, wouldn't it? Is it possible you downloaded the non 2.0 version?

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TFMurphy
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AE Holds stored their styles as numbers:
1 = Cavern, 2 = Cliffs, 3 = Slime, 4 = Voids, 5 = Ice, 6 = Lava, 7 = Palace, 8 = Catacombs, 9 = Sanctum.

When JtRH was released, it still stored styles as numbers:
1 = Foundation, 2 = Deep Spaces, 3 = Iceworks.

Naturally, some conversion was necessary to get AE holds to import into JtRH. Only, it didn't convert the numbers. It simply left the numbers unchanged, and remapped those numbers when it saw them in the hold data:
1 = Foundation, 2 = Deep Spaces, 3 = Iceworks, 4 = Deep Spaces, 5 = Iceworks, 6 = Foundation, 7 = Deep Spaces, 8 = Foundation, 9 = Iceworks.

When TCB was coded, style IDs finally dropped the number system, and were just the names of the style used (thus allowing for custom styles). However, we now had two sets of 1-9 to map from: AE and JtRH. And they actually map *differently* depending on whether you're importing from AE or JtRH.

And now that GatEB is released, those maps have been updated again, allowing the new styles to show up in the old mappings.

Now, all this does *NOT* affect holds that were solely created in JtRH and used just the original JtRH styles (in other words, 1-3 in JtRH *always* map to Foundation/Deep Spaces/Iceworks). However, if you created a hold in AE, then imported it to JtRH, made a few changes, and then exported the result, many of the styles may still be using Style IDs 4-9. And these have to be remapped.

Long story short: KDD2.0 was built by expanding the original KDD hold file, so it still has KDD style IDs. And these result in things looking different in GatEB.

Keiya
Level: Delver
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I've thought some more about how to correct this, and I think it depends on whether or not Caravel feels KDD 2.0 should stay usable in 2.0.16 or if it's okay to make it not. If they want to keep it usable in 2.0.16, then changing the style IDs of the secret rooms to those of the rest of the rest of the level is the better solution. If not, updating the hold and hand-choosing styles from all the ones now available to fit the level is better.

Jacob wrote: (wasn't me who downmodded you, btw)

No worries, we can sit here and laugh at whoever it was. (I'm making the assumption they downmodded because they thought I was making things up or something. TFMurphy explained why that's not the case. If it was because they don't like my tone, well, that's fair enough.)



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[Last edited by Keiya at 04-04-2012 02:09 AM]

Jacob
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That's really interesting - I hadn't realised KDD 2.0 was a JtRH hold that used the AE IDs. It all makes sense now.
So, yeah, Keiya definitely has a point.

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coppro
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AE looked weird enough as it was; I don't think there's a particular reason that we should consider the new mappings unusual!

Keiya
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But going from Beach to Foundation on the same level with no explanation *is* weird.

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[Last edited by Keiya at 04-04-2012 07:31 PM]

Jatopian
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Two styles on the same level? That is odd. KDD isn't A Quiet Place.

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Keiya
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Right. The secrets and other added rooms, and a few others (ones that appeared in JTRH, for instance) are tagged with the 2.0 style that it used to map to. When the rest of the level *isn't*...

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Jatopian
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Would it be so hard to update KDD2.0 I wonder?

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mrimer
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Are you talking about Level 10? That one always had two styles, iirc.

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Keiya
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Ah, then in level ten it's not an issue.

Examples I know of. Most of the problems are in secrets, so spoilered, and also not complete (I haven't even CONQUERED KDD 2.0, much less mastered):



On another note, Level 13 is Forest. This one is fine, I just wanted to mention that I like the look for it.

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[Last edited by Keiya at 04-05-2012 03:49 AM]

RabidChild
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Adding to Keiya's list:



I think that's all of them.

On a related note, in JtRH, Level 7, 1N1W and 2N1W are Deep Spaces rather than City.

Dischorran
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Schik says that I should mention that I like having the new styles represented in KDD2.0, because I like having the new styles represented in KDD2.0.

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RabidChild
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I don't have any problem with the new styles appearing in KDD. In fact, I think it's kind of cool that AE holds retain their style mapping, but I would like to see those secret rooms updated to match the styles of their respective levels. I get the impression the devs have pretty much moved on from KDD, but it seems like it would be a pretty easy fix.

Keiya
Level: Delver
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Right, my issue is the secret rooms not matching, not the other rooms getting the new styles

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