Snacko
Level: Smiter
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This is not a usual contest, this is a hold audition for the DROD Flash Project.

Rooms must be 24 rows by 28 columns, we don't know how many winners there will be (that depends on whether or not we will be able to implement save support, how much space we have how many elements are going to be coded).

The element limit so far is:
Roaches
Wraithwings
Oremites
Force Arrows
Green, blue and yellow doors.

We will eventually have more, but we don't know what so these are the current allowed elements.

Preferably holds will be a single level with at least 5 rooms and will land somewhere around the range of 4 or 5 brains.

____________________________
Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions

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[Last edited by Snacko at 07-26-2008 10:01 PM]

RoboBob3000
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I don't mean to be a Negative Nellie, but don't you need to worry a little bit more about the development side of things for this project before you start assembling the content? It seems to me that you guys are working on the last 10% of the project first.

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http://beepsandbloops.wordpress.com/

calamarain
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I have to agree. Worry about the engine first - designing the levels for it is the comparatively easy part.

"If you build it, they will come"

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My Holds

Snacko
Level: Smiter
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Well, we aren't going to have that many holds and to cut down on dev time we aren't going to program all the elements. I'm going to make a list of things I think would be tough to develop, and those will be forbidden. The testers will choose four or five holds and we'll program the elements in those into the game.

Forbidden elements:
Brains
Seep
Spiders
Goblins

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Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions

Monkey
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 190
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Why seep? Aren't they basically roaches on walls?
And why spiders? Aren't they basically roaches that go invisible sometimes?


____________________________
lurking

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[Last edited by Monkey at 07-29-2008 05:03 PM]

Fafnir
Level: Smiter

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Just chiming in here: intuitively I'd say the problems we're going to have will be more with monsters that are "special" in some way other than movement. Coding goblin movement would be fairly straightforward, since it works according to a known algorithm that doesn't require any information not available to your average roach. Seep could be a problem if the fact that monsters can only move along the floor is hardcoded, but other than that they're just roaches. (And we'll need to change that anyway if we're adding wraithwings, since they can move over pits.) On the other hand, coding oremites could potentially be downright unpleasant if we don't design them in from the start.

I think it's a bit early in the game to tell, to be honest. There are a few things that would obviously be a pain to implement (brains and tarstuff mothers come to mind) but beyond that I have no idea. I agree that doing level design now is jumping the gun a bit...

____________________________
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Absolute stupidity
Kills absolutely.

zex20913
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Seep are not just roaches. When *monster* wants to move diagonally, but can't, roaches prefer vertical movement. Seep prefer the move that gets them closer to their target.

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Someone Else
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I think that Wraithwings should be left out, as they are extremely infuriating, and we're trying to get new people to come.

Snacko
Level: Smiter
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We already have one level, it's the right difficulty and the right length, it has both one wraithwing as well as Oremite. Would it be easier if we only coded single wraithwings?

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Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions

Someone Else
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I think that single wraithwings, while difficult at times, are much more predictable and nicer than multiple wraithwings. So, yes, that is a good idea.

Jatopian
Level: Smitemaster
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Goblins shouldn't be hard to code... I do agree with leaving out spiders, though.

____________________________
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Make your pressure plates 3.0 style!
DROD architecture idea generator

Jeffrey0
Level: Delver
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Goblins are hard to explain to a new player though. If you look at KDD then you'll see that there's a lot of really simple goblin rooms which essentially function as tutorial rooms. Yet anyone who started with KDD will probably remember having loads of trouble with those rooms.

General advice: keep the amount of game elements down to a low number. People don't like having to learn loads of stuff for a short flash game. Even if it isn't short, there's no way for them to know that it isn't short.

mxvladi
Level: Smitemaster
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File: DROD Flash project rooms.hold (1.9 KB)
Downloaded 119 times.
License: Public Domain

Here's my entry to this audition. A five-puzzle wraithwing-themed hold.

Rheb
Level: Smitemaster

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File: Drod Flash 1.hold (1.8 KB)
Downloaded 69 times.
License: Public Domain

I'd also like to volunteer to create some puzzles for the hold

I think it would be better if you had restrictions on which elements we are allowed to use. The holds first level should introduce all (most) of the elements as good as possible, and then it would be good if it was clear what elements are going to be included in the flash game.

My personal favourites, (which I vote for including.)

Walls, Pits, Roaches, green doors, blue doors, (naturally).
Force arrows, yellow doors, orbs, one type of pressure plates, (good puzzle potential, and simple).
Wraithwings, (They get a bit complicated when there's more than one around, but when there's only one it's easy to understand and wraithwings are very different from roaches).
Oremites, Hot tiles, (they shouldn't be too complicated, and they have great puzzle potential. They're also quite different from things I've seen in other puzzle games).

Here's a quick level containing roach and wraithwing manipulation rooms. (It include most of the elements I mentioned above, but if you don't like that I use a particular element I think it can easily be removed.)

I'd like to make some more puzzles for this project, but first I'd like to know how things are going to be arranged.

____________________________
Voligner is my very own DROD-like game. Please check it out!

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[Last edited by Rheb at 08-06-2008 06:47 AM : Updated hold.]

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3664
Registered: 10-06-2005
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Here's an updated version of my DROD level. This really only has two changes from the last version:

*A template room has been removed from the actual level, so the blue door can now actually be dropped

*An unintended solution to Thrice South, Once East has been fixed by adding one force arrow to one particular square.

Other than that, this level is just the same, and I've just moved it to this thread so that all the levels are in one thread.

In addition to all the elements Rheb mentioned, I'd like to add orthosquares, trapdoors, and on-off pressure plates, if only because the latter two are already in this hold and the first would be easy to include compared to other things.

EDIT:

See Chaco's latest post in this thread for the new hold.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

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[Last edited by Chaco at 08-31-2008 09:54 PM]

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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File: Chacos DROD Flash Project Rooms.hold (7.9 KB)
Downloaded 121 times.
License: Public Domain

I'm double posting so as to bump this thread to the top of the board and notify others that something new has occurred.

Specifically, I've finished a second level for the DROD Flash Project, and imaginatively titled it "Second Level". This level uses the first level's roaches, oremites, wraithwings, pressure plates, etc. but adds two new elements: namely, the trapdoors from the previous level are given much more attention, and I've added the Evil Eye.

The hold attached here has the second level placed after the first in normal DROD style (i.e. the staircase at the end of the first level goes to the beginning of the second level) but the hold is Anyone-Edit, so it's possible to check it out without first conquering the first level.

I believe this is good quality, so I'd like it to be run through. Hopefully there won't be any problems regarding unintended solutions.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

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Mxvladi: While I am quite impressed by your hold, especially 1S1W, I do believe that your rooms are in general too difficult for the project. I didn't have too much trouble with them, (I consider myself a rather good smitemaster) but I think that new people would find them overwhelmingly difficult. Of course, it may be a good idea to include some difficult rooms to show the true magnificence of DROD. It's not my call, so I'll leave it up to others.

Rheb: Same thing. The first room was great, but then it was a bit too hard (I'm not sure 1N is possible).

Chaco: Great work, great difficulty. 3S1E was a bit much, but other than that I loved the first level. I'll get to the second level in a bit.

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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Someone Else wrote:
Rheb: Same thing. The first room was great, but then it was a bit too hard (I'm not sure 1N is possible).

1N is possible if you're willing to discard the silly notion of staying outside the box until all roaches are trapped. (You can trap one, but you have to trap the other by luring it from inside.)

Of course, the remaining rooms aren't any easier (but there's no blue door in front of the staircase either )

Chaco: Great work, great difficulty. 3S1E was a bit much, but other than that I loved the first level. I'll get to the second level in a bit.

Hm, I think First Level 2S1E is harder than 3S1E. But I see your point, and am glad that you think the level is high quality. If you like the first level, I think Second Level will be alright too.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

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[Last edited by Chaco at 09-01-2008 07:11 PM]

Someone Else
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Chaco wrote:

Someone Else wrote:
Rheb: Same thing. The first room was great, but then it was a bit too hard (I'm not sure 1N is possible).

1N is possible if you're willing to discard the silly notion of staying outside the box until all roaches are trapped. (You can trap one, but you have to trap the other by luring it from inside.)

Oh, I couldn't get either of them in from inside or outside the box.

techant
Level: Smitemaster

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Well I don't know if this is what I was to do, but I imported the chacos level in my TCB and it looked interesting.
I will play it a little and see how it feels.

I do worry that some will have a hard time making it easy enough for new users. What made the KDD popular was it was easy to start with and then got harder. Remember just becasue killing a line of roaches is boring to you it is NEW to the newbe.

You want to hook new players and for that you need a broad approach. Encourage those who what more complex challenges to come and get the real thing.

____________________________
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[Last edited by techant at 09-03-2008 11:51 AM]

Rheb
Level: Smitemaster

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I was really hoping to get more time to work on this... but it's not looking very good. Hopefully I'll be able to do something more, and look over my old hold.

____________________________
Voligner is my very own DROD-like game. Please check it out!