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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
Please don't make "[Employees Only] : 1N 1E" as a secret room if you want the hold is set to "You and Masters."

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[Last edited by Resert On at 08-13-2017 06:14 AM]
08-13-2017 at 06:14 AM
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Xindaris
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The postmastery section obviously won't have secret rooms when the hold is finished. It's set up that way now so that whenever it gets published to Holds nobody will just be credited with "already mastered it".

Hey, do you want to contribute a post-mastery room?

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 08-13-2017 02:30 PM]
08-13-2017 at 02:29 PM
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quote:
Xindaris wrote:
Hey, do you want to contribute a post-mastery room?

?????

What do you mean?
I can't understand.

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[Last edited by Resert On at 09-09-2017 12:59 PM]
08-14-2017 at 12:02 AM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (+1)  
Hi Xindaris,

I don't know if this is still under active development, but I was curious and played through it anyways.

Wonderful work on the blocks. Really like them. Couple of discussion points perhaps on how they *should* behave (as seen in the comments above), but that's a matter of taste and hence completely your decision.

Opens up much potential, although I haven't bothered really playing with them myself (yet).

Rooms are generally very nice, with the difficulty level helping to cruise through the levels without too much time consuming puzzles. I think that is a very good approach for new elements. For a next hold, it could be certainly made more difficult (if anyone desires so).

Found a couple of bugs, though:
1) Confirmed your bug of "stepping out of shallow water and the block disappears" (1st level, could not reproduce this and have not demo)
2) My sword disappeared a couple of times. I actually had difficulty in finishing the secret room with the TeleBlock until I realized this bug was the source of my troubles. Demo attached, move 269 is key.
But this happened also in other rooms.
3)Floating/Unfloating does not work properly with TeleBlocks (at least in the entry room of the antechamber level). Demo attached.

I do hope this work will continue! I already had much fun.

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12-06-2017 at 10:56 AM
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2-This has nothing to do with the blocks themselves. The floor tiles in the basement (and in general everywhere before the antechamber) are supposed to be filled with oremites. The intended rules are "stick means weapon is on because that contains no metal, sword means weapon is off because oremites". You are not supposed to be able to use your sword in that room, and basically found a leak in the room that makes the scripting behave in an unexpected way. I think I can fix it by adding an orthosquare at (20, 6) so you can't just leave without killing the snakes first, and maybe an open green door somewhere in the hallway leading northward, like maybe (19,29).

3-The problem isn't to do with floating, the issue is that some change or other that I made at some point has caused the teleblock's code to basically hang indefinitely when it encounters a golem corpse. It's also misbehaving with construct corpses, which breaks the entrance to the Exit Garden, so don't even try that yet. It'll take me a very detailed look at the code to fix this, I suspect, given how long it's been since I've even glanced at it :no.

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12-14-2017 at 04:15 PM
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HOTFIX UPDATE:
-The issue reported above with Tele Basement 2N has been hopefully fixed with a couple of leak plugs
-I rolled back teleblock code to an earlier version I found in another hold, and now golem/construct corpses no longer break it. I think it should work as intended in such situations now without breaking anything else, hopefully. As far as I can tell, whatever I did since then was an effort to make the teleblock stop at weapons or something like that, but an incomplete one. Rolling it back broke Exit Garden 1E so I went back to the noisy, disarm-token-involving workaround for that specific room.

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 12-14-2017 06:06 PM]
12-14-2017 at 06:05 PM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
quote:
Xindaris wrote:
2- You are not supposed to be able to use your sword in that room


Blast! Now I need to find a way to clear it without sword nonetheless :-(

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12-23-2017 at 10:40 AM
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UPDATE!?:

I have uploaded a new version to the first post. I don't know if there are any other changes, but the main one is that CubEOS (the "computer voice" of the laboratories) is fully voiced now. Aside from one place where it's supposed to play a recording of Beethro's voice and the postmastery section. Next step is to look into getting Beethro voiced, either using Insoluble's stuff and/or looking for someone else to do it.

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 06-14-2018 10:00 PM]
06-14-2018 at 09:59 PM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (+1)  
Hello Xindaris, nice work you made on this hold ! And I love the voice of the robot !

I think I found a bug, which looks like one you mentioned on your first post. I've attached a demo. If I push a block when I'm on trapdoors, the block can disappear.

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06-14-2018 at 11:39 PM
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Ahh, I see. The problem there doesn't have to do with trapdoors at all; it's that you're pushing it onto a pressure plate, and the block's script says "If I'm on a pressure plate, disappear and reappear with a different appearance." And for some reason the "appear" command waits until there is not a weapon on top of that tile to execute. It has to do that to handle pressing down a plate correctly, so there's no real way to fix it. But the block should appear as soon as you move the stick, freeing up the tile it's trying to appear on, so at least it doesn't horrifically break the room.

This kind of thing is a much bigger problem in rooms involving block-affecting tokens because if a block is in this weird "Trying to appear" state then it won't poll the variables set by the tokens correctly. I tried my best to avoid situations where that can lead to an unintended solution, and I think at the very least that kind of thing should be rare.

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 06-15-2018 12:13 AM]
06-15-2018 at 12:12 AM
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UPDATE:
-At some point it seems Exit Garden 1E was crippled for testing purposes, and I forgot to un-cripple it. The one-use button goes all around the teleblock like I'm pretty sure it's supposed to again.
-While re-running the hold for myself, noticed momentum and gravity blocks run on stairs. This is weird so I went ahead and added a bit of code so they will stop at stairs like literally everything else in the game does; fingers crossed this doesn't break something else. There were also some unnecessary tracing commands left over in two of the three momentum block scripts; I removed them.

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 06-16-2018 12:24 AM]
06-16-2018 at 12:22 AM
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Dying Flutchman
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Hi Xindaris,

As far as I can see, most bugs are now solved. If you still like the idea, I'd love to build a contribution to your post-master level.

Should be able to work on our somewhat within the next weeks.

Just let me know if I should take a shot. Can't promise anything good will come out of it and inclusion in your hold fully on your discretion of course.

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06-16-2018 at 03:12 PM
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Xindaris
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
Sure, if you have some kind of idea I'd be happy to have it. I'm trying to push the hold toward completion, but there are still some things I'm waiting on (voice acting for Beethro mainly) that could easily take that long.

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06-16-2018 at 04:05 PM
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Xindaris
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
UPDATE:
-Discovered a dearth of checkpoints in Exit Garden 1W while playing through the hold for demo production, corrected that.
-More importantly, the hold is now FULLY VOICED, thanks to the help of disoriented! I'll be adding a credits scroll soon. I also edited the level descriptions a bit and narrated those myself too!
-On an annoying note, all those vocals make the file too big to upload to a post now. So instead there is a dropbox link to the file at the top of the first post.

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06-19-2018 at 01:04 AM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (+1)  
Hi Xindaris,

Discovered that I had no progress/demos saved from earlier version, so replayed the hold.

Couple of comments (later this week, I'll build you a room). Demos included as well.
Yes, some critical comments, but generally, I think this is a wonderful hold, full of nice new puzzles. And if you feel it's too late for any changes, so be it. One must publish sometime I guess.

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06-19-2018 at 08:14 AM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (+1)  
Back again. Block room attached.

Have some more ideas, but those require time. This one seemed nice enough to be different than what you did already, while still presenting a decent challenge.

Hope you like it.

If you need a demo, I'll send you one.

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06-19-2018 at 04:45 PM
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Thank you for the feedback and the room! I'll take a look at it soon.

GF 1S2E has a solution that doesn't involve timing your steps while recording the timeclone at all, which I think largely gets rid of any sense of tedium the room has from the larger spiral. If the player enjoys counting turns they'll do that, or if they don't then I'm reasonably confident they'll figure out that other solution and not have to. As for the darkness, I don't really want to mess up the level's aesthetics by removing it from one specific place. I suppose I could move the platform to the east end of the room and make it bigger so it surrounds the tunnel on that side or something if it's really that big of a problem.

I have it in my head already to perhaps replace FA 1N1W/1N2W with smaller, simpler rooms built on the same concept and move them to postmastery along with the old EG 1W, another sort of nasty room. So, I'll work on that.

The exit garden is intended as a collection of horde rooms and tough puzzles, so having some chaos makes perfect sense to me. I don't really agree that the hedge walls are all that hard to see, especially with the flowers/grasstiles clearly marking where the player can't/can be. In response to EG Entrance, I think you forgot about the teleblocks being able to telefrag certain things..? This would also explain any difficulty you're having understanding 1S1E, which has like two interactions you need to understand, at most. Also I don't really understand what you mean by saying 3S shouldn't be a secret.

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06-20-2018 at 12:17 AM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (+1)  
quote:
Xindaris wrote:
GF 1S2E has a solution that doesn't involve timing your steps while recording the timeclone at all...
ok, after noting the obvious (?) solution involving counting, I didn't even look further and thought: that's it apparently. Perhaps other players have a more persistent drive to make things easier for themselves :)

About the randomness in EG: it's of course a matter of taste, but for me, it felt that the solutions to the rooms where clear (not 1S1E, but ok). Execution of the solutions felt however pretty much random and very open-ended with many options. This is quite a contrast with the earlier levels, where funding the solution tends to be hard, and execution tends to be straightforward. I just tend to like those levels more. If the EG "chaos" is deliberate: you succeeded very well! After all, this is your hold, not mine :)

In response to EG Entrance, I think you forgot about the teleblocks being able to telefrag certain things..?
So this is basically a shooter game then? Will have another look.

Also I don't really understand what you mean by saying 3S shouldn't be a secret.
Well, shouldn't be is perhaps too strong. But for me the room was actually one of the most accessible ones in the level. Difficulty-wise, I would thus not secretize it personally. But that's a matter of opinion of course.



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[Last edited by Dying Flutchman at 06-20-2018 07:05 AM]
06-20-2018 at 07:02 AM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
MAJOR UPDATE:
-Postmastery has been more or less properly organized. There are leftover "script fussing" rooms inaccessible from the entrance but things are laid out, separated into "guest rooms" and "reject rooms", both of which the player can get to easily.
-More importantly, the old FA 1N1W/1N2W pair have been moved to the postmastery "reject" section and replaced with hopefully FAR less messy rooms exploring the same concept. Please, please, and especially if you had trouble the original versions, try the new versions out and let me know what you think!

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 06-21-2018 07:42 PM]
06-21-2018 at 07:41 PM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (+1)  
Hi X,

For me, the new FA rooms work much better!

Tnx for including my room. I discovered a cosmetic error. Symmetry is broken! Oh noes!

If you feel like toying around with tiny, eenyweeny little details, you could consider changing the room as per the picture attached.

But don't bother too much.

Hope this goes through HA soon.

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06-21-2018 at 09:51 PM
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This hold is in the process of going to HA, and at this point the only demo I'm missing is for your room, Dying Fluthchman. I know I ignored the offer before, but if you still have it could I have the demo for it? Just the one for the standalone "DF's Blocks" level would be enough.

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07-30-2018 at 04:51 AM
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Sorry, I holiday now for next three weeks. Can't possibly help you now. Will send you the demo when I get back.

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08-01-2018 at 12:09 PM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
Here's an up-to-date demo for Exit Garden: 1N, since Xindaris' old one was invalidated by version updates.

[Last edited by Doom at 08-02-2018 03:40 PM]
08-02-2018 at 03:37 PM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
Confirmed Employees Only 2E is solvable (possibly by breaking it with the help of
Click here to view the secret text
).

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[Last edited by Chaco at 08-08-2018 10:59 PM]
08-08-2018 at 10:55 PM
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Hi Chaco,

Thanks for checking. I have not seen you demo, but the approach you took is intended.

quote:
Chaco wrote:
Confirmed Employees Only 2E is solvable (possibly by breaking it with the help of
Click here to view the secret text
).


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08-20-2018 at 10:06 AM
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icon Re: Blockerture Science Laboratories (0)  
Hi Chaco,

Thanks for checking. I have not seen you demo, but the approach you took is intended.

quote:
Chaco wrote:
Confirmed Employees Only 2E is solvable (possibly by breaking it with the help of
Click here to view the secret text
).


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08-20-2018 at 10:06 AM
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