Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
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Thanks for your comment!

But if you want to play the whole thing, you should start with Gredgedon Mines. The puzzles might be hard, though, so be
warned.

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mxvladi
Level: Smitemaster
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Registered: 02-11-2008
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Oh, yeah, I have already started. Nothing solved for now.

---

[Last edited by mxvladi at 06-04-2008 07:05 PM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
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Yay! New version.
This time I was able to get all the way up to Poxipon 4N4W before I got stuck (never ending cut scene). I'm going to comment just on things that were changed since I saw this hold last.

Gredgedon Mines - All my old demos survived.

Barrel Keep
1W - I see you reduced the golems to the minimum needed. This room this works well.
1S2W - This time my solution involved knotting the rattlesnakes in the places where the roaches shouldn't go.
1N - I know you didn't change this room, but my demo broke due to 3.2. I have no idea why. I resolved it, and it seemed the same as before.

Eastern World - Still works okay.

Flooded Crevasse
1N1E - Now I can't blow up the nest, but I still ended up solving it by switching to the clone every 10 turns. It seemed cleaner than letting a mess of waterskippers build up.
1W - My demo broke, but this room seems the same as before.

Tar Forest - All my old demos survived. The new filler room at 1W looks just right.

Eastern World - Now I'm back as Beethro and can continue.

Historical Hallways
2N - This has turned into a nice puzzle. I needed to use the mirror, the decoy, an eye, and the giant. The hot tile wasn't necessary.
2N1W - This puzzle is much less repetitive now.
3N - I saw this room for the first time. The trick was keeping Beethro all the way to the side.

Tormel
This is a new level for me. I didn't get to see it before because of the problem in Historical Hallways. I wasn't allowed into the mayor's house, but I did find the guide and went into the arcade with him. The game in Arcade 1E works well and I beat it! I didn't understand the point of the game at Arcade 1N. The stalwart killed the goblin and I was transported back to the main room of the arcade, where I was still a slayer (which is a problem). According to the information guy in the arcade, I will be able to return later in the hold and new games will be unlocked? In 1N1W, I had a tough time finding the correct square that would take me to the next level. It turns out it was on the bridge, but I had dropped the bridge and was standing on the raft in the wrong place. I was able to walk around the *outside* of the walls of Tormel.

Crumbling Sanctum
Entrance - The events here take place more smoothly.
2S - Thanks for taking out some of the seep, but oooops! The room is now impossible because the pressure plate doesn't open the mimic's door.

Roach Shelter - Still works fine.

Mellasten - All my old demos survived.

Pit Village - All my old demos survived.

Crater of the Dead
1N2W - This is now possible. The NW roach committed suicide. I used the decoy to lure the southern roach onto the force arrow, and I killed the queen with the mimic.
1N1W - This one is tough now. While Beethro doesn't have enough moves to stop the bad bomb from going off, the snake can just barely do it.

Mirror Mansion
This is a new level for me. It needs more checkpoints!
Entrance - I got the mirrors off the plates with plenty of time to spare.
1E - Tricky! I had to be careful to step on the fuse on the full turn.
1S1E - Trivial solution. Light the fuse with a decoy.
2E - Just the right timing was needed to avoid getting killed by the goblin.
1N1E - It took me forever to get this one right. It's a tough one.
1N - I got the rope. It would be nice to have some reassurance here that I am indeed supposed to take the rope back to crater of the dead. Once I was back there, it was obvious what to do.

Boiling Core - Still works the same as before.

Poxipon - Passing through the entrance works okay.

Poxiponal Dungeon
2S1W - This is now possible. I made two circuits of the room, and didn't need the second trapdoor.

Poxipon
4N4W - I've conquered the room (not sure I liked guessing the scripting here), but after the king dies, it gets stuck in a never ending cutscene.

I see in the editor that I should have been taken to Ocean Capture next. So, tomorrow, I'll start in Time Warp, go to Ocean Capture, and play from there.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
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Actually, it didn't take me long at all to get stuck from there. I completed both Ocean Capture levels, and got sent to Familiar Place... as a tar baby! It's impossible to leave the entrance as a tar baby. Since there are no other stairs to Familiar Place from Time Warp, I'll have to stop there.

Comments on Ocean Capture (Lower Level puzzles) Checkpoints please!
1W - Easy. Exploit the fact the guards are stupid when coming around corners.
Entrance - The corner trick again. I liked how this room was different when I first entered the level and when I came back to solve it.
1N1W - I suspect my solution was not entirely intended. I lit the fuse, killed the first guard, extinguished the fuse with a mirror, put another mirror on the pressure plate that released the other guards, and killed them.
1N - When I first tried this room, I made it too hard for myself. Really, only one of the first four guards has to live and open the door to the first clone potion.
1N2W - Tough. A lot of trial and error to get this right.
2N1W - It took me a while to catch on to the fact that I could use the "not slayer" to kill one of the guards.
2N2W - Fun... I made full use of the "not slayer's" unscrupulous guard killing here.

I'll need a new version of the hold with Familiar Place accessible as Beethro before I continue testing.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
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Thanks for the new version! Now I can explore Familiar Place as Beethro. Is it supposed to remind me of Mysteries of the Deep : Tenth Level, or am I completely off-base?

Entrance - As Beethro, I could successfully exit south.
1S - I killed the tar baby on the left, and tricked the snake into killing itself on the tar baby on the right.
1S1E - It took a bit of trial and error, but I eventually disposed of all but one serpent, and then released the rattlers to finish the job.
1E - Easy. The fegundo did all the work.
1S1W - I used the adder to block the briar growth.
1W - I put the snakes on the pressure plates, hit the orb, and then killed everything.
1S2W - Nice builder puzzle. I had to give him a path to the build markers, but was able to move away and drop a few trapdoors on his trips back home.
1S3W - This one's hard. May I have a hint please? Where should I kill the first giant?

It looks like there's a required room in 1N, but the force arrows in 1E prevent me from going there.

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
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Making a slight return to DROD after six months absence and decided to carry on where I left off. However, after six months I am still no wiser how to beat Tar Forest 1N. How do I kill both babies formed when the bomb goes off, assuming I need the bomb to go off?

mxvladi
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2505
Registered: 02-11-2008
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Have you noticed square at 10.10? First, after blowing tar blob, move to 11.11. When enemy-babies are at 11.14 and 10.15 move to 10.10. So, one won't follow you and other will. Now they're separated and you can kill them.

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

Thanks, but I went back to it and completed it first try. Some of my dead brain cells must have suddenly been resurrected.

Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged

Bump... I decided to release two WIP levels because I didn't want to leave anyone worried. (I must admit, I had a bit of pressure too. )

Also, Blorn Bridge, official wearer of the Holds Al Dente 2008 3rd Place, is included as a side-quest.


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CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
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Pressure? Hmmm, I can't imagine how you could possibly feel any pressure strong encouragement to continue making this very cool hold...

Anyway, I've played through the two WIP levels...

Architectural Invasion
These builder puzzles are a bit easier than the earlier levels in your hold. They could be solved by a quick experiment to see what the builders are going to do, and then outrunning them.
1E - An easy introductory room. I outran the builder by a mile.
1S - I'm not sure this room works right yet. I didn't use the mirrors. Even though the citizen warned me that the builders were going to try to trap me, they had too far to go to have a chance at that. Perhaps you'd like to make the passages down to the orbs longer?
1S1W - Good room, and the most puzzly of the puzzles on this level.
Did you mean for 2N1W to be a required room? The blue door in the entrance never opens, and I can't pass through the line of builders to the north.

Vertiginous Ascent
Some very nice classic puzzles on this level.
1W - Saving the Stalwart to kill the one inaccessible roach was kind of tricky. I ended up removing one blob of mud, one set of roaches, the the large blob of mud to give him access. Then I went after the other set of roaches.
2W - Thanks for that little holding room on the east side of the middle area. I don't think I could have done this without waking two eyes.
1S1W - Classic roach manipulation and snake timing. This could have been an AE room.
1S - I made the snake press the NE pressure plate for me, so I'd have time to go in after the roach queen. I would have appreciated some checkpoints in this room.
1N1W - Found the secret passage... looking forward to seeing where it leads...

Thanks for the puzzles, Jeff

Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
Registered: 05-16-2005
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New version out, with both levels out! Something happens, too. If you wish to comment on it, secret tags please.

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CuriousShyRabbit
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File: HA Architectural Invasion 1S Victory.demo (1.1 KB)
Downloaded 51 times.
License: Public Domain

Here's my demo for Architectural Invasion 1S.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

I've played as far as I can go in the new version. I wish we could figure out why you can't import my demos, as it would be good for you to see what I'm doing in some of these rooms.

Architectural Invasion
1E - I commented on the previous version.
1S - I'm still not using the mirrors to block the builders. They're doing a good enough job blocking each other.
1S1W - I commented on the previous version.
1W - I like this room a lot. You have to think about which relay station the builder will want to go to next.
2S - I put the snake where the builder started, blocked the bad force arrow with Beethro while the builder made my escape route, then danced on the hot tiles to prevent the builder from doing any more.
1S1E - I put Beethro on the pressure plate by the builder to keep it from popping up. That allowed the builder to finish his job quickly and I didn't need to toggle the roach doors.
1N - Yikes! That's a serious plot development.

Vertiginous Ascent
1W - I commented on the previous version. Still like this room a lot.
2W - I commented on the previous version.
1S2W - I think maybe I could have done this with 4 pressure plates in each section too, as I had an extra golem left in each one. My strategy was to clear as much outer tarstuff as possible before setting each giant loose.
1S1W - I commented on the previous version.
1S - I commented on the previous version.
2S - Pretty easy. The mud was the only one that couldn't be grown and cut later.
2S1W - An interesting briar race, but I stayed well ahead of the briar. I had a tought time positioning the wraithwing, but eventually got him in his place.
1N2W - Getting the stalwart through this room without dying is one finicky task. Don't forget to add more checkpoints. Also, don't you think Beethro might want to thank the stalwart after doing all that?

Blorn Bridge
I still love this level.
Don't forget to fix the end-of-hold stairs in 1N1E.

talund
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 95
Registered: 05-17-2005
IP: Logged

Crumbling Sanctum 2S still is not possible as the pressure plate is not active. I used the room editor to activate the pressure plate, solved the room, finishing the level but then when I returned to where I was supposed to meet Beethro again, the clock simply spun wildly as whatever scripting might have been there does not seem functional

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[Last edited by talund at 10-24-2008 02:47 PM : More info.]

talund
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 95
Registered: 05-17-2005
IP: Logged

Mellasten - I came here from Roach as a Roach and so nothing works.

talund
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 95
Registered: 05-17-2005
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Poxiponal Dungeon 1S - very trivial solution. Wait until serpent has turned left by the door and then step on the trigger square.

mxvladi
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2505
Registered: 02-11-2008
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Okay, I finally have a time to play through this hold.

So far, I've solved Gredgedon Mines. My comments:

entrance: pretty trivial. I like this anyway. I believe there're no unintended solutions can be possible here, so I'll just say that I liked this.

1E: Frying wubbas was suprisely easy. I found far harder part of room when you're trying to get that pressure plate(though I've done it quite fast). Could be harder if player would have to save one of two wubbas.

1S: I found this a little trial-and-error, but I needed some strategy here, of course, too.

2S: Cutting away blobs at SW of the room and at the NE of the room was very simple, but blobs at NW part of the room were quite hard to cut. Nice job! (I actually wanted to crush my keyboard while trying to stab NW blobs )

1S 1W: After some unlucky tries, I've managed to make all four gellies press those pressure plates. Niice puzzle.

1W: Quite complex and quite hard thing... but still fun.

1S 1E: Yikes! That goblin manipulation was pretty hard. But I've managed to solve this anyway.

1N 1W: This room was AWESOME.

---

[Last edited by mxvladi at 11-23-2008 03:26 PM]

Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
Registered: 05-16-2005
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After all that time, a new version was made! Enjoy.

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CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
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Registered: 10-14-2006
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I've played through the new Height Complex level.

1N - Getting the giants stuck behind mirrors was a nice challenge.
1N1E - This room was more work than challenge. There are a lot of wubbas that need to go on pressure plates. And there are so many obstacles, it's easy not to get surrounded.
1E - I may have missed the point of this room. The adder needs to be at least 7 squares long to hold the door open so Beethro can open the door to the hot tile. It's easy to make it so, by feeding the adder 5 gel babies. But why is there a pressure plate at (11,9) that closes the door at (18,18). It doesn't make a difference to my solution. That's why I think I missed something.
2N - After I realized that the bomb only needs to kill the golem (and not the wraithwing too, silly Rabbit), this room was not so hard.
3N - It looks like this room might have a choice of two solutions - putting the mimic by the orb or putting the mimic in the tar. I could only get the orb solution to work. And it was still tricky figuring out how to clear the tar leaving at least 4 babies behind to hold the pressure plates down.
2N1W - This room would have been harder, if the rattler went all the way to the pressure plates, and I had to get the mimic over there to kill it. But the pressure plates will up with roaches, and after the mimic kills the rattler, it's easy to use the clone to lure the roaches back to the mimic.
1N1W - I played this room before in sun-basking desert.

Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged

Thanks for the comments! However, I see that there is a lack of difficulty balance.
I would appreciate lists from testers so I know which levels are more difficult, so I can rearrange them. Also, if any rooms are especially difficult compared to others, I might move them.

Thanks in advance,

Hold Architect Jeff_Ray...

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Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

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Alright, a new demo is up! I would really like it if you could give me a list of the levels from the easiest to the hardest, with any rooms that are too easy or hard for the level.

Thanks in advance.

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CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
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File: Homeward Adventure.demo (78.2 KB)
Downloaded 63 times.
License: Public Domain

I haven't played the new rooms, but here's a new Export All pack of all the demos I have so far for the entire hold.

mxvladi
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2505
Registered: 02-11-2008
IP: Logged

Since I've solved the most recent holds in the "Holds" board which I actually was able to solve, I'll start playing through this one.

First, I've played through first two levels, and must say that Barrel Keep is easier than Gredgedon mines.

Second, comments on Barrel keep:

1E: I've met "kill the serpent with the eye" puzzles before. This one wasn't much more challenging than any of such puzzles I've met before. Still nice room.
1W: Liked it. First, it seemed that "there's one additional golem, and player can smite it anywhere". But then I've realised why did you include fifth golem.
1N: I like the room, but it was too easy, I think, because giants were really easy to lure in positions where they need to be killed.
1N 1E: Yet again, a nice simple(but not too easy) room, which I liked a lot.

1N 1W: This seemed a little random to me, mainly because I'm not expert at stalwarts or decoys.
1S 1W: Challenging and my last room to complete. While killing roach queens was easy, killing the serpent was... um... hard.
1S 2W: Another not-too-hard room. Probably my favourite in this level.
Secret room: Quite easy, so I think it can be marked as required(while 1S 1W could be marked as secret)... up to you, of course.

---

[Last edited by mxvladi at 03-17-2009 07:44 PM]

mxvladi
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2505
Registered: 02-11-2008
IP: Logged

Comments on Flooded Crevasse:

1W: This was quite clever. Not too hard, but the fact that I have to kill waterskippers around 14,12 - 15,13 area before than any other waterskippers(well, at least before illing waterskippers which are around 10,21 - 11,22 area) stumped me for a short while.
Entrance: This was quite challenging for me(at least the way I've solved it).
1E: I liked it a lot. Shame that there's only one waterskipper at 33,13 - 36,17 area.
1N 1E: This was quite complex and clever. The waterskipper-which-didn't-allow-mirror-to-fall-in-the-water trick was great!
1S 1E: This looks like harder version of 1E, and it is. Yeah, this is cool room, but I don't like that it's around the same trick as 1E.
2E: Simple. Didn't require much strategy, just putting platforms in obvious right places.
3E: A simple one, too.
1S 2E: Yet again a lovely room. First time I thought I need to get a goblin at 21,4... but then realised I was wrong.

Haven't solved two stalwart rooms yet, and have no time now. But they seem to be difficult...

Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged

Okay, folks, I submitted a new version.

My biggest priority right now is to reorder the levels. I'm currently aiming to reverse the order of the levels, but if you have a different order in mind, then shoot. (Changes to the current list should be bolded).

Here's the current order (will be renamed if needed):


Any suggestions? Please...

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Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
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Height Complex: 1N can be completed by going on the upper part and luring the giants on the hot tiles area. A green door will resolve the problem.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

Jacob
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3749
Registered: 10-01-2004
IP: Logged

Or yellow door with a pressure plate at the entrance to the chamber.
1N1E on that level could really do with some pressure plates.

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Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged

The trivial solution has been fixed.

Jacob, did you mean 2N1E?

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Jacob
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I did mean 1N1E, but I also meant "checkpoints" (of which there are none), not "pressure plates." Sorry.

____________________________
New to DROD? You may want to read this.
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Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 962
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged

New version. Level order changed. Comment.

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