Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

File: Putting the Pieces Together.hold (42.3 KB)
Downloaded 55 times.
License: Public Domain

Here's a hub, now with map. Currently, there's nothing stopping anyone from exiting the hold right away, I'll work on that in a bit.

The map could be better, but right now my main goal is making it functional.

Please submit any fixes you feel are needed for your entries. (Including level descriptions if you want to add or change those.)

There's a level for late entries (Pieces of Late), which will all be secret rooms. The postmastery area is currently empty, but I plan to do a room for it soon.

If people are interested in doing late entries and need ideas, I'd particularly like to see rooms using some of the ideas that didn't get used in the actual contest.

I think that's about it. Thanks to everyone who entered, and please let me know if there are any issues with the compilation hold.

---

[Last edited by Dragon Fogel at 11-14-2017 09:33 PM : final version, submitting to HA]

disoriented
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2424
Registered: 08-07-2007
IP: Logged

In It All Adds up, please make the orb (32,5) cracked.

____________________________
34th Skywatcher

Best to PM me, since I might miss your message on CaravelNet chat.

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3685
Registered: 10-06-2005
IP: Logged

File: Half-Built Room v2.hold (1.9 KB)
Downloaded 52 times.
License: Public Domain

Here's a fixed version of Half-Built Room:

* Added some force arrows on top of the shallow water that are then turned off by the serpent when it exits. This should prevent Beethro from standing in the shallow water to mess with the serpent timing (because I don't want players to have to worry about that).

* Replaced one wall with a force arrow, so gel babies have a way of escaping if placed on an otherwise-convenient diagonal. I don't think this completely prevents Insoluble's unintended solution; it still looks at least theoretically possible, but it should be much much harder.

* Added a gel baby to the southeast chamber just for safety, to ensure Beethro has to actually go in there at some point.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

---

[Last edited by Chaco at 09-17-2017 03:20 PM]

Insoluble
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1639
Registered: 09-04-2014
IP: Logged

File: PtPT Some Assembly Required The Entrance dont use hot tiles.demo (14.7 KB)
Downloaded 50 times.
License: Public Domain

In chat the other day Nuntar had asked about how it was possible to do Putting the Pieces Together without using the hot tiles to kill the giant. My demo pack didn't include that particular solution so I just recorded a demo of it. Personally I kind of like this solution because in violating the "use hot tiles to kill giant" interaction it actually enforces the "feed golem corpse to adder" one.

____________________________
Links to neat forum tools that I always have trouble finding:

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Okay, so this is the current state of things:

-disoriented has asked for changes to It All Adds Up and I've made those on my end.
-Chaco has modified Half-Built Room and I've put that in the compilation.
-hyperme has opted not to fix Some Assembly Required. As the unintended solutions still require two ideas, this is probably fine.
-I've asked mauvebutterfly about fixing A Helpful Serpent; he didn't have any particular ideas but he said he'd try.
-I've sent PMs to Resert On about The Sewer and IQubic about Frozen Abyss.

Are there any other unintended solutions to fix, especially ones that allow one of the ideas on the scrolls to be skipped? That's the main thing that needs doing.

It would also be nice if anyone doing extra rooms could get them done promptly. (This includes me, I'll try to get started on something today.)

Just for the record, these ideas were not used at all so it would be nice to see them in the extra rooms:
-Prevent a slayer from activating a troublesome orb.
-Use a firetrap to control whether a construct revives or not.
-Hold a goblin in place near a decoy.

People might also like to use ideas that they feel didn't get much exploration in the contest.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Posted an update, this should fix It All Adds Up and Half-Built Room. Also included is a late entry by me featuring all three completely unused ideas.

Anyone else is free to submit late entries, of course.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

File: frozen-abyss.jpg (172.5 KB)
Downloaded 577 times.
License: Public Domain

IQubic is having computer issues, so here's a screenshot of his entry to help him work out fixes:

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Made some fixes to IQubic's entry and set up a very simple mechanism so that you have to complete all the entries to leave the hold.

Resert On
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 05-02-2017
IP: Logged

File: Abstracts Puzzle.hold (3.1 KB)
Downloaded 49 times.
License: Public Domain

I actually have a room that uses "Prevent a slayer from activating a troublesome orb." but I think that thing was like 'The Cellar' I made.

____________________________
Stuffs:

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Resert On wrote:
I actually have a room that uses "Prevent a slayer from activating a troublesome orb." but I think that thing was like 'The Cellar' I made.

Do you want this as a late entry or are you just showing it? I'd only be able to use the slayer room as a late entry if that's what you want.

Of course, you're perfectly free to use these rooms as you want in your own hold.

While you're here, The Sewer doesn't actually enforce splitting up the giant on hot tiles. This can be fixed fairly easily by just adding some walls or other obstacles so there are no paths to the pressure plates that are wider than one tile. Are you fine with me doing this for you?

In other news, I've now made a complete draft of the postmastery room, which shoves all 20 ideas into one huge mess. Made a shortcut so people can test it without dropping the master wall - that's getting removed when it's time for publication, though.

I look forward to people discovering the myriad room breaks it no doubt has.

Edit: Already caught some issues and fixed them. Seems the previous version was still at zero downloads, though, so hopefully nobody's inconvenienced by this.

additional edit: changed move order slightly, shouldn't affect anything other than preventing a break that would still take a lot of work to set up.

I'll refrain from making any more changes until I find out what ridiculous things can be done with decoy placement.

---

[Last edited by Dragon Fogel at 09-25-2017 01:28 AM]

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Turns out I couldn't resist hunting for potential decoy breaks, so, the latest version takes out the ones I could find. Mostly with the help of breakable walls.

I feel reasonably confident you can't put the decoy in a place other than where you're meant to and still clear the room, but I guess we'll see when people start trying to do it.

Edit: okay, looked through the room again and found some things I was assuming to be enforced actually weren't. On the plus side, I feel I've done a fairly thorough examination of other possibilities, so it's hopefully done now.

Also the room is no longer marked required, not that it really mattered since I wasn't using a blue door.

---

[Last edited by Dragon Fogel at 09-25-2017 04:54 AM]

Resert On
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 05-02-2017
IP: Logged

File: The Sewer v-3+100 divide 25.hold (2.2 KB)
Downloaded 50 times.
License: Public Domain

Dragon Fogel wrote:
Do you want this as a late entry or are you just showing it? I'd only be able to use the slayer room as a late entry if that's what you want.

You can use that level for extra level.


And this the new version of "The Sewer".

____________________________
Stuffs:

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3335
Registered: 07-05-2004
IP: Logged

Dragon Fogel wrote:
In other news, I've now made a complete draft of the postmastery room, which shoves all 20 ideas into one huge mess.

Here's a demo that uses about 8/20 of the ideas.

Actually a bit surprised that the room ended up being clearable with this approach. For a long time looked like I'd only make it halfway through, but bit by bit more and more little breaks added up to a full solution.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

I knew that decoy potion would be trouble.

Secret tags used in case this gives away too much about the solution to people trying to solve it.



Aside from fixes to the postmastery room, the new version I'll be posting in a minute includes Resert On's fix to The Sewer and adds another late entry, also by Resert On. I've gone with Abstracts Puzzle as the title for the latter, please let me know if you wanted it to be something else.

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3335
Registered: 07-05-2004
IP: Logged

Dragon Fogel wrote:
Of course, there's probably still a place to put the decoy that will break everything

There sure is. Not that it makes things trivial or anything.

Replayed the room, and am obviously still very far from the intended solution. New (noisy) demo here

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Made more fixes, including some things you didn't break yet. This made getting the golems in place a bit less tricky, but I'll pay that price for actually making it necessary to do that.

That decoy is still the big variable. I hope I don't have to resort to brute-forcing the intended placement with a pressure plate or something.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Whoops, I made some big mistakes in that last one. I messed with the plates that opened the fire trap for the puff, and accidentally made it so the first one turned it on rather than off. Also messed up a mechanism that was meant to be a major step in the solution.

Fixed those, and another potential break I noticed, but now I've seen a new one. Going to have to give it some thought, there's a crude fix I can use but I'd rather avoid that if I can help it.

Edit: I found a better fix, so I implemented it. Also replaced the scroll on a pressure plate with a force arrow to fix another issue, though I'm not sure if it would have lead to a room-solving break.

---

[Last edited by Dragon Fogel at 09-25-2017 11:24 PM]

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Okay, went out for a bit, thought about the room, and realized some more problems.

The most glaring one was that I could potentially just lead a monster onto the pressure plate that lets the roach out, while standing in a position where it wouldn't go south. Changed that to an orb blocked by a tunnel, so only Beethro can get there.

The other big change was that I completely reworked the set of mechanisms in the center-east part of the room. Now the Slayer can pathfind to you, but you can't leave to the north until you've been to the bottom area, which requires clearing out all the tar.

I realized a few issues with the new setup while I was typing that up, so I fixed them and will be posting the next update momentarily.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Made some more fixes and tweaks. Some of the things I'm closing off are just vague possibilities that would be extremely hard to set up if they're even possible to do at all, but I'd rather not take the chance.

On the simpler side of things, I put down some oremites to prevent leading the construct all the way to the other side of the room and creating a stepping stone to wake the eye from.

I'm going to make this the last update of the night.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

I lied.

This update changes a trapdoor to trapdoor over water.

mauvebutterfly
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 776
Registered: 05-03-2015
IP: Logged

File: Pieces - mauvebutterfly.hold (1.4 KB)
Downloaded 50 times.
License: Public Domain

I think I finally fixed my room. I was really trying change as little as possible while enforcing the giant and hot tile interaction. It's now a mess of pressure plates, but at least it's enforced, I guess. Hopefully.

____________________________
106th Skywatcher

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Hold updated with the new version of A Helpful Serpent.

I'm waiting to see if a couple of people who expressed interest in late entries are able to finish them. Other than that, the main changes should be done now, so feel free to test rooms and look for any room breaks that still exist.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Bump!

No updates to the hold yet.

One of the people I was hoping might make a late entry said he couldn't. Still have one other person looking to try something, we'll see how that goes.

In the meantime, this could use more testing, particularly on the two late entries that are already in here. But if there are still unintended solutions in the main entries or my postmastery room, it would be good to know that.

Insoluble
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1639
Registered: 09-04-2014
IP: Logged

File: PtPT Abstracts Puzzle The Entrance Victory.demo (14.9 KB)
Downloaded 50 times.
License: Public Domain

Posting a demo for "Abstract Puzzle".

____________________________
Links to neat forum tools that I always have trouble finding:

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Fixed the map so that A Helpful Serpent and The Sewer can be entered again, and made a small change to prevent an unintended solution in The Leftovers.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

I'm about ready to send this to HA, but I'd like some more testing of the two late entries and the postmastery room, in case anything else needs to be changed.

disoriented
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2424
Registered: 08-07-2007
IP: Logged

In A Helpful Serpent and The Sewer, the stairs to return to the hub end the hold.



____________________________
34th Skywatcher

Best to PM me, since I might miss your message on CaravelNet chat.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

New version posted which fixes that issue. Also, the Pieces of Late mini-hub has been modified to account for the fact that there were only two late entries.

Scroll was removed from the Master Wall bypass because I put a wall there and took it out again for tester convenience. Now I'm going to put it back in, just in case I don't need to fix anything else. If I do and it warrants further testing, I'll take the wall out again.

Aquator
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 408
Registered: 10-25-2014
IP: Logged

File: Putting the Pieces Together.demo (13.3 KB)
Downloaded 53 times.
License: Public Domain

I think I've found an unintended (and very noisy) solution for The Leftovers since not all of the idea pieces seemed to be necessary to solve the room. I've attached the demo for it.

Abstracts puzzle can be beaten using both only the sword and only the dagger so it's possible to conquer the room without ever using the weapon token but I don't think this is breaking anything.

The postmastery room was a lot of fun to figure out piece by piece. I'm fairly certain there was nothing unintended in my solution, but the demo pack also includes my solution for it just in case.

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

Aquator's demo for the postmastery room is indeed the intended one. Obviously there are variations in how some steps are done compared to how I handled it in my own testing, but all the key mechanisms are used as intended.

New version posted which should fix Aquator's unintended solution for The Leftovers, and also more directly enforce the "prevent the slayer from hitting the orb" step.