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Caravel Forum : DROD Boards : Feature Requests : Make Shortest Routes Apparent
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stigant
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icon Make Shortest Routes Apparent (+1)  
With the addition of helper-horns, the shortest path from one square to another, or from a square to an entrance is becoming increasingly important. Would a tool which highlights the shortest path between two squares be too much of an aid? I'm not sure how it would work as there are several cases to consider (different monsters/helpers have access to different types of squares, and different movements etc), and clearly it would need to update as you drop trapdoors, move mirrors around, kill rock golems etc. But I increasingly find myself counting out squares which I consider to be somewhat menial and unfun.

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04-15-2012 at 08:04 PM
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RoboBob3000
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icon Re: Make Shortest Routes Apparent (+2)  
Click on a horn - highlight the entry point that would be used.

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04-15-2012 at 08:24 PM
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stigant
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Well, yeah, of course. But it's a bigger problem than that. I want to know which monster my helpers are going after next, and by how much. I want to know how many moves I have until that brained roach reaches me, and whether he'll end up going after a decoy or a friend in the process. etc etc.

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04-15-2012 at 09:58 PM
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Moo
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icon Re: Make Shortest Routes Apparent (+1)  
I had a similar thought today too, but for a different reason - making navigating already-completed rooms quicker.
It could be something like you press a key, click somewhere, and this will set a target that your character would try to get to using the quickest route (like Halph). Pressing a key (wait?) would move you one space along the path. Maybe pressing another movement key could cancel the path and just do that move as normal.

This isn't very similar to the OP's request, but maybe if you could do similar with other creatures, it would be? Perhaps drag from the creature to the target point, and the route would highlight? Could possibly have several paths shown at once, and this would help see where things would collide.
04-15-2012 at 10:34 PM
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Syntax
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quote:
stigant wrote:
With the addition of helper-horns, the shortest path from one square to another, or from a square to an entrance is becoming increasingly important. Would a tool which highlights the shortest path between two squares be too much of an aid? I'm not sure how it would work as there are several cases to consider (different monsters/helpers have access to different types of squares, and different movements etc), and clearly it would need to update as you drop trapdoors, move mirrors around, kill rock golems etc. But I increasingly find myself counting out squares which I consider to be somewhat menial and unfun.

I had a similar thought (yet more basic) back in 08 where I suggested showing the shortest path to a given exit should be a feature (having completed the room). Mike at the time said he wasn't happy to implement aids just for those purposes and having thought about I agreed with that. I agree that counting squares is a pain though.
04-22-2012 at 11:27 AM
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tonyk
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icon Re: Make Shortest Routes Apparent (+1)  
I recall suggesting such an idea in the UI competition some years back. I liked the idea of a drag tool that can be used to count squares for the most optimum route or just sheer distance between two points "as the bird flies". Saves some thinking maybe but could serve other uses - checking diagonal paths for instance (damn you evil eyes).

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05-08-2012 at 07:20 AM
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Insoluble
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quote:
Moo wrote:
I had a similar thought today too, but for a different reason - making navigating already-completed rooms quicker.
It could be something like you press a key, click somewhere, and this will set a target that your character would try to get to using the quickest route (like Halph). Pressing a key (wait?) would move you one space along the path. Maybe pressing another movement key could cancel the path and just do that move as normal.

This isn't very similar to the OP's request, but maybe if you could do similar with other creatures, it would be? Perhaps drag from the creature to the target point, and the route would highlight? Could possibly have several paths shown at once, and this would help see where things would collide.


This is a really great idea and similar to the suggestion in this thread.

The question of which controls to use was brought up in that thread and I'm not sure of a good answer to that. But I would love to be able to hold down some key then click my way through an already completed room or hub room.

As for the main topic of this feature request, That's a great idea too. There are so many things that use path maps that it may be difficult to implement though. How about highlighting paths of monsters/characters you click on? Or perhaps only doing so in puzzle mode?



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01-21-2015 at 03:16 PM
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Chaco
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icon Re: Make Shortest Routes Apparent (+3)  
I'm going to go ahead and bump this thread since it's a user interface change rather than anything to do with extra monsters, save file changes, art assets, etc., and anything that makes brained monsters or paths easier to calculate would be very helpful to newer players and veterans alike.

This was mostly inspired by watching a recent Alex Diener video where he had to manually count two separate paths to figure out which one was 18 squares long and which was 19 squares long. That's a job for a computer to do, not a human.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 03-14-2019 07:51 PM]
03-14-2019 at 07:50 PM
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Dying Flutchman
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icon Re: Make Shortest Routes Apparent (+1)  
quote:
Chaco wrote:
This was mostly inspired by watching a recent Alex Diener video where he had to manually count two separate paths to figure out which one was 18 squares long and which was 19 squares long. That's a job for a computer to do, not a human.


I can't make up my mind really. Yes, some sort of path showing too would be nice. And I am pretty sure people will start using it. Veteran players perhaps even more so than newbies, because they would benefit most, especially in difficult rooms.

But then, at some point, everyone uses it and architecture will start assuming that this tool exists and rooms will start to appear which basically require the tool for them to be reasonably solvable.

Also, many brain rooms that now hinge on understanding brain behaviour would become much easier. I'm not thinking about counting squares, but rather about rooms that require you to freeze certain monsters in a particular spot, or letting then dance back and forth and the like.

Having immediate visual path mapping feedback in combination with unlimited undo might take the linchpin out of many, many brain mechanics rooms.

But perhaps this proposal indeed is exactly like unlimited undo in a sense. At first you're afraid it would kill puzzle potential and make architects lazy, but I the end, it's just a nice tool and there will still be great holds.

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[Last edited by Dying Flutchman at 03-15-2019 07:58 AM]
03-15-2019 at 07:56 AM
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