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Rheb
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File: The underground civilisation.hold (426.8 KB)
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icon The undergroun civilisation (+3)  
Hi I am Rasmus and I am new to this forum.
I have however played quite a lot of drod.
Here is my first hold and I have been working on it for a long time. I hope you will enjoy it and all feedback is welcome. I will be gone for a couple of weeks but after that i will respond to the feedback.

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08-04-2006 at 02:44 PM
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Banjooie
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
What the jesus? I demand to see a demo of the first room in the rebelnest even being remotely solvable.

Edit: ...Wow. It is solvable. That is freaking /crazy/.

[Last edited by Banjooie at 08-04-2006 05:34 PM]
08-04-2006 at 05:31 PM
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Chaco
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
Alright, now you've piqued my curiousity. Downloading...

EDIT:

O_o'

Uh, Rheb? Maybe you should go play Renegades... and beat it... because somehow I don't think you'd find it that hard... -_-

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[Last edited by Chaco at 08-04-2006 06:35 PM]
08-04-2006 at 06:13 PM
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bandit1200
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
I'm happy. I've beaten two rooms in the editor. :D Most of the others are :no :no

You've certainly done your homework, Rheb. I'm leaving this one to the experts.
08-04-2006 at 08:06 PM
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UrAvgAzn
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
So far (which isn't that far), wow. I didn't know architects could take it to this level of difficulty. I looked at it in the editor after dying a few times. The counter said 285 deaths. Desert: 1S was fun for a beginner like me, but The Rebel Nest just took all my confidence away. What I really disliked but it made the puzzle a whole lot better is that the guards hit the orbs. Just when I find a nice place where I can kill quite a few roaches, the guards come up and hit the orb. Then I get either stabbed by a guard or killed by a roach. Well, I looked at it in the editor and after seeing The Entrance of The Rebel Nest, I looked at all the levels. Goblin Chase sounds hard, I hate goblins. More comments later, I'm going to bed.

Keep posting,

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08-05-2006 at 03:43 AM
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Elfstone
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
Banjooie wrote:
What the jesus? I demand to see a demo of the first room in the rebelnest even being remotely solvable.

Edit: ...Wow. It is solvable. That is freaking /crazy/.

Care to toss a clue or two in my direction?
This has me stumped. :(

Elfstone.

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08-05-2006 at 03:46 PM
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Blondbeard
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File: Tuc The rebelnest or not The Entrance Victory.demo (1.7 KB)
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
The first room (the orb room) isn't THAT hard if you compare it to a lot of other rooms in other holds around. Rasmus is my littlebrother, by the way ;)

Click here to view the secret text

Here is a demo for those who really needs it.
08-07-2006 at 05:27 PM
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larrymurk
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Rasmus,

I'd say you've designed quite an amazing and difficult hold here. If you're interested in publishing this I hope you can enlist a real expert (read, better than me at least) or two to test this for you.

I'm glad you left this "anyone edit" so I can comment on a fair number of rooms.

I put my comments in secret because they might be a bit long.

Click here to view the secret text

08-09-2006 at 08:40 PM
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golfrman
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well, you should be very glad hearing that from larrymurk, if he can beat his own holds but can't beat this then, well, this is probably the hardest hold i've ever heard of, then again... i haven't played any doom holds
*goes to look for one to see if he has a chance of surviving one turn against the first room in a doom hold*

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08-09-2006 at 09:00 PM
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Blondbeard
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
By the way: It would be great if you could tell Rasmus if you see some kind of bad spelling or grammer. I tried to help him, but I'm afraid my english isn't that good either.
08-09-2006 at 11:23 PM
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Rabscuttle
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
Spelling up to the first room of rebel nest.

Click here to view the secret text

08-10-2006 at 10:58 AM
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Rabscuttle
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
More spelling. Comments on rooms following

Click here to view the secret text

08-10-2006 at 03:15 PM
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Rabscuttle
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (+1)  
Thoughts so far (almost to the end of goblin chase):

Desert
Click here to view the secret text


Rebel Nest:
Click here to view the secret text


Goblin Chase:
Click here to view the secret text
08-10-2006 at 03:33 PM
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TripleM
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
Well, I've done all rooms in the rebelnest except 1N.
Click here to view the secret text


edit:
Click here to view the secret text


[Last edited by TripleM at 08-12-2006 01:01 AM]
08-12-2006 at 12:33 AM
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Blondbeard
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (+1)  
It's hard to give a good hint, but
Click here to view the secret text

08-12-2006 at 01:35 AM
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Blondbeard
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
Some of the (IMO) best rooms in the hold are in "the tunnel", "the tunnel 2" and "the guard tunnel". I know Rasmus felt he was improving as an architect along the way, and there are some really fine optimization rooms, and more often than not you'll have to figure out some kind of genious trick. In some ways those kinds of rooms reminds me of Larrymurks, or Dooms holds. It would be nice if someone could take a look at them. By the way I might put out a demo for 1N of rebelnest if needed.

[Last edited by Blondbeard at 08-15-2006 12:26 AM]
08-15-2006 at 12:25 AM
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TripleM
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (+1)  
Oh, I forgot to mention; I did get 1N in the end. Great room. I'll get back to the next level right now, actually.
08-15-2006 at 12:31 AM
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Blondbeard
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Okay ;) Checking once again. Has anyone given up on testing this hold? In that case why? Was there some rooms which was just boring and uninspiering, and in that case which ones? Or to some of you maybe the hold seemed fun, but a bit too hard. Since the hold is anyone edit it isn't possible to get stuck. It would be good to know if there are some rooms along the way which just isn't fun (and of course if there are some really fun ones too).

For example: The goblin chase rooms are mostly meant to be solved by placing a mimic among some orbs (even though you didn't have to for some of the rooms). It's easy to make sure this is required, but will that make the level too repitetive, or will it be okay?
08-17-2006 at 09:48 PM
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larrymurk
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I've given up testing because I've played through most of the rooms completing those that I could.

Many times the difficulty gets compounded when there are two interlinked goals like RNest:1N. First you must kill the tar mothers in 30 moves then you must hit the orb and make it up to the mud making sure no eyes were left asleep. It takes me some fiddling around, but I manage to kill the tar just in time. Now I'm coming up about 4 moves short on the next part and I don't even know whether I should be redoing the first part.

Now don't get me wrong, many rooms are too difficult for me to solve by myself. I believe if the hold is thoroughly tested and released, I'll have fun doing what I can and begging for hints often. I'm always amazed at the genious of the DROD community and I imagine there'll be some players who can handle this and will love the challenge. I do think there are some little changes I'd make like ones already mentioned, and there's another place I didn't mention yet where if you go N you are put in an optional room with force arrows making it not so optional. Anyhow some testing should reveal these things.

I'm excited because it's not terribly often we see a hold with really well thought-out puzzles. It just so happens its a little above my ability. I'd hate to see this dumbed-down. You could release this as an expert version and then an easier version where the rooms are made easier.

Good luck Blondbeard and Rasmus. I'll do what I can to help, but I might be a bit limited.

[Last edited by larrymurk at 08-17-2006 10:14 PM]
08-17-2006 at 10:12 PM
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Blondbeard
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Thanks Larry. I just want to say that I can't take credit for anything here :blush This is all Rasmus creation.
08-17-2006 at 10:22 PM
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Banjooie
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I can't beat 1S1E. Therefore: forget it.
08-18-2006 at 05:52 AM
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Rabscuttle
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (+2)  
All done except for the two rooms behind the orb puzzle in rebel nest.

Rebel Nest:

Click here to view the secret text


Goblin Chase:

Click here to view the secret text


Civilisation:

Click here to view the secret text


The Tunnel:

Click here to view the secret text


The Tunnel 2

Click here to view the secret text


Guard Tunnel:
Click here to view the secret text


The royal chamber:
Click here to view the secret text




Overall, some very nice (and tricky) puzzles, although the linear nature of the later levels will probably put some people off.

08-19-2006 at 04:13 PM
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Rabscuttle
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (0)  
Ok, that orb puzzle in rebel nest wasn't too terrible. The two rooms after it were easy

Mastered and post-master-doored.
08-19-2006 at 04:32 PM
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Rabscuttle
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (+1)  
Spelling etc:
Click here to view the secret text

08-19-2006 at 05:19 PM
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Blondbeard
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Nice! That's some really good feedback there. Haha... Those fighting arenas isn't really for me, and the interesting room with lots of rattlesnakes and decoy potions made me want to pull my hair, but I just had a feeling you could like them. Just two questions then, I guess. 1) Do you think it's a good idea to change the rooms in Goblin Chase so that you can't do them the "cheap" way?, and 2) Do you strongly think the ending should be different? (I kind of liked it. I think it's a bit funny.)

Oh, and I don't think it will be that hard to make the puzzles less linear. I think you can have a long corridor on the side of the tunnels (if needed).

[Last edited by Blondbeard at 08-19-2006 05:25 PM]
08-19-2006 at 05:20 PM
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Rabscuttle
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1) Yes.

2) No.
08-20-2006 at 04:19 AM
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Rheb
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File: The underground civilisation.hold (426.5 KB)
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (Updated) (0)  
Hello again. Now i'm back from my trip to Öland.
And I have now corrected my spelling, and changed some rooms in Goblin chase for exampel.
I also want to thank Rabscuttle, Blondbeard and larrymurk for all your valuable help.

Rasmus

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09-08-2006 at 08:16 PM
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michthro
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Oh, man, this is fantastic stuff! And no-one told me about it until yesterday. (I've been too busy with SttD and other things to look at Architecture much, but I'm glad Blondbeard did tell me.)

I've only played up to the start of The deeper tunnel, and peeked ahead a little. Comments so far:
Click here to view the secret text
I also noticed a couple of typos etc. I'll post a list when I've checked everything.

Great work, Rheb.
09-13-2006 at 08:35 PM
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michthro
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Yay! Mastered and everything. (Ok, except for TDT:3W. I'll get back to it.) Further comments:
Click here to view the secret text

09-14-2006 at 04:58 PM
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Blondbeard
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icon Re: The undergroun civilisation (+1)  
Another really nice feedback. It sounds as if you just think the hold needs some minor fixes, michthro. The bombs in Rebel Nest 2E is not supposed to be a red herring. The explosion is supposed to reach the orbs surounding the mimic. The walls blocking the explosion is a mistake.

You mentioned some typos. It will be apreciated if you report them. Thanks!


09-14-2006 at 08:04 PM
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