Stuwy
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 212
Registered: 04-10-2003
IP: Logged

File: Renegades.hold (3.2 MB)
Downloaded 134 times.
License: Public Domain

This was a project that I made in August, and dragged on to January somehow....

All levels have been completed, as well as speech and other scripting goodies. I just need a set of eyes to pick up some mistake I left.

I'm not the best story writer, so if there are any parts in the hold where the speech just doesn't make any sense, speak up.

The difficulty is set so that even smitemaster's/newbies can have a challenge, or a chance to complete this hold.

Enjoy!

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3772
Registered: 10-06-2005
IP: Logged

I always relish a chance to play a new hold, finished or not. If I find any glaring errors, I'll let you know, though I might not find trivial solutions as easily as some other people might.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

TripleM
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1379
Registered: 02-05-2003
IP: Logged

Ooh - not only a new hold, but a new hold by an old forum member. Gotta check this out.

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3772
Registered: 10-06-2005
IP: Logged

Alright...

First, Level 1: The Entrance is a nice starting room. The level description starts the story nicely, and there's some nice commentary by Beethro (or whomever the hero is).

Once East is where it starts getting ugly. I hate bomb mazes, and then you had to throw in brained roach queens too. So I have to do a lot of sword turning, which almost 95% of the time means exploding the entire room. Also, it's annoying to be cutting away some crumbly wall and then have a roach right behind you.

What's worst is that I can't find a way to kill the rightmost roach queen, brained or non-brained, so I'm currently stuck in this room. Overall, I think that room's too hard for a Level 1 room. Maybe if you added more checkpoints or got rid of a select few bombs...

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

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[Last edited by Chaco at 01-08-2006 10:48 PM]

Tahnan
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2467
Registered: 11-14-2005
IP: Logged

Level 1 is certainly not easy. The aforementioned bomb room definitely took some time, though as always, I hate golems more than anything. So I'm stuck at the staircase room; will return to later.

There're some grammatical issues in the scripting--not much, but I noticed "emporer" for "emperor".

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3772
Registered: 10-06-2005
IP: Logged

Yeah, skipping ahead, I noticed *lots* of rooms with golems.

Also, you might want to get rid of the wraithwings-on-tar puzzles, as that'll be fixed in the next patch, and then the whole thing is pretty much moot.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

Chaco wrote:
Once East is where it starts getting ugly. I hate bomb mazes, and then you had to throw in brained roach queens too. So I have to do a lot of sword turning, which almost 95% of the time means exploding the entire room. Also, it's annoying to be cutting away some crumbly wall and then have a roach right behind you.

What's worst is that I can't find a way to kill the rightmost roach queen, brained or non-brained, so I'm currently stuck in this room. Overall, I think that room's too hard for a Level 1 room. Maybe if you added more checkpoints or got rid of a select few bombs...

I found 1E pretty easy, though I nearly had heart failure when I first saw it. I did have the same problem with that queen for a while. I'm afraid I got bored after being stuck in the stairs room for a couple of hours. so I had a look at the rest in the editor.

Tahnan
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2467
Registered: 11-14-2005
IP: Logged

Update: now stuck on the beginning of Level 2, 3S3E. (There're some small scripting weirdnesses in the entrance area, having to do with what happens if you leave 1N or 1W without clearing them.)

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

How did you get through that stairs room? It's driving me mad. I must have had a couple of hundred goes by now.

Tahnan
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2467
Registered: 11-14-2005
IP: Logged

bandit1200 wrote:
How did you get through that stairs room? It's driving me mad. I must have had a couple of hundred goes by now.

It was easy! All I had to do was...

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

It was the three or four at top right I was having problems with. It took me nearly another 3 hours before I finally got the right moves.

I want my life back!

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

L2, 3S3E. I could also do with a tip on how to deal with the guards at the entrance to the room. I seem to have tried every combination of moves, but obviously haven't. :*)

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[Last edited by bandit1200 at 01-10-2006 11:08 AM]

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3385
Registered: 07-05-2004
IP: Logged

A few comments I wrote long ago while being offline and should've sent a lot earlier. They just got forgotten on my HD.

L2: 4S4E - It's possible to conquer with only one decoy. I recommend leaving another one in, though because it's a good challenge and not too easy.
L2: 3S4E - It's possible to kill all guards in the 2 wide passage at the beginning. You propably don't want to leave that kind of possibility in.
L2: 3S3E - How about a checkpoint *right before* the first guard room. The solution is so specific, you'll need to restart many times. As for the later parts of the room, it's not necessary to drop red or black gates, because bypassing them doesn't block any further parts in the room.
L2: 2N4E - I agree with Slayer's speech after killing all guards. I didn't believe myself it could be done, but it was actually quite easy in the end. Very interesting room. (And very stupid guards )

bandit1200 wrote:
L2, 3S3E. I could also do with a tip on how to deal with the guards at the entrance to the room.

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

Doom wrote:

bandit1200 wrote:
L2, 3S3E. I could also do with a tip on how to deal with the guards at the entrance to the room.

Click here to view the secret text

×Enter with your sword pointing to SE. Then keep trying.

I'd found that way the only way I could kill any guards, but after I've killed two, I'm 5 moves from the door with only 8 moves left. All I've been able to achieve is kill another then get blown up, or stand there and take what's coming to me. Running for the door doesn't seem to be an option - not enough moves left.

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[Last edited by bandit1200 at 01-10-2006 06:48 PM]

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3385
Registered: 07-05-2004
IP: Logged

bandit1200 wrote:

Doom wrote:

bandit1200 wrote:
L2, 3S3E. I could also do with a tip on how to deal with the guards at the entrance to the room.

Click here to view the secret text

×Enter with your sword pointing to SE. Then keep trying.

I'd found that way the only way I could kill any guards, but after I've killed two, I'm 5 moves from the door with only 8 moves left. All I've been able to achieve is kill another then get blown up, or stand there and take what's coming to me. Running for the door doesn't seem to be an option - not enough moves left.

Alright... SPOILER ALERT! (read only as far as you need to)

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[Last edited by Doom at 01-10-2006 09:27 PM : open secret tag...]

Stuwy
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 212
Registered: 04-10-2003
IP: Logged

Tahnan wrote:
Update: now stuck on the beginning of Level 2, 3S3E. (There're some small scripting weirdnesses in the entrance area, having to do with what happens if you leave 1N or 1W without clearing them.)

Really? How so to be specific? I mean do the gaurds still talk or something?

There're some grammatical issues in the scripting--not much, but I noticed "emporer" for "emperor".

Which room specifically if you can remember?


Thanks everybody for the comments so far. All bugs you have posted are all being fixed up currently.

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[Last edited by Stuwy at 01-10-2006 09:29 PM]

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1645
Registered: 12-12-2004
IP: Logged

It's in that room with the emperor statue, where he's pointing right, and it's right below that really irritating room with the golems in tight spaces. First level, I think 2 East but I could be wrong?

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

Thanks Doom; all this time and I never knew you could step across a sword. Duh! You live and learn.

Anyway, I'm giving up on this hold and going to play something easier.

After looking through a lot of the other rooms, in the editor, it'd get embarrassing the number of times I'd need to ask for help. I played a lot of them, but there's far more that I find impossible.

BTW, I couldn't help noticing that one of the easiest rooms in the hold is on level 6 and really seems out of place, especially as there are entrances on earlier levels that are far more difficult.

Oh well,I enjoyed the first level.

Edit: Level 3 entrance, Halph twice says "aloud" instead of "allowed". Also, Beethro says, "...will ever regret opening this door for me". Was "ever" intended, or was it meant to be "never"? I noticed a few other speeling mistooks but unfortunately didn't make a note of them.

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[Last edited by bandit1200 at 01-10-2006 10:00 PM]

Stuwy
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 212
Registered: 04-10-2003
IP: Logged

bandit1200 wrote:
Thanks Doom; all this time and I never knew you could step across a sword. Duh! You live and learn.

Anyway, I'm giving up on this hold and going to play something easier.

After looking through a lot of the other rooms, in the editor, it'd get embarrassing the number of times I'd need to ask for help. I played a lot of them, but there's far more that I find impossible.

BTW, I couldn't help noticing that one of the easiest rooms in the hold is on level 6 and really seems out of place, especially as there are entrances on earlier levels that are far more difficult.

Oh well,I enjoyed the first level.

Edit: Level 3 entrance, Halph twice says "aloud" instead of "allowed". Also, Beethro says, "...will ever regret opening this door for me". Was "ever" intended, or was it meant to be "never"? I noticed a few other speeling mistooks but unfortunately didn't make a note of them.

Hey, thanks for testing my hold anyway's. For a person like me who was familiar with this game since 1998, some rooms I can conquer with ease, while others struggle on the same room. Don't worry, you will get there.

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
IP: Logged

For a person like me who was familiar with this game since 1998, some rooms I can conquer with ease, while others struggle on the same room. Don't worry, you will get there.

Heh, I've been playing it since 1997, when the only help available was from Erik in rec.comp.puzzles. Love the game, but I've never been very good at it. I'm afraid this ancient brain of mine doesn't work as it should anymore.

Here's a few more rooms with grammar/spelling errors.
L2 1n5e personal instead of personnel
L2 entrance same as above, plus gaurds instead of guards
L2 3s3e
L2 5n2e
L3 1n
L3 7n
Hopefully the mistakes in the last 4 will be obvious.
You also hyphenate words that don't need it, such as "un-armed" but I didn't make a note of where those were.
All were in scripting, I didn't check any scrolls.

Stuwy
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 212
Registered: 04-10-2003
IP: Logged

Annnnd..... Fixed!

Thanks a bunch Bandit, it helped

Stuwy
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 212
Registered: 04-10-2003
IP: Logged

Sorry for the bump, but has anybody tried testing levels 3-6? I'm planning to release it into the holds board soon.

Thanks,
Stuwy

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3772
Registered: 10-06-2005
IP: Logged

I tried a few rooms in them, but I wasn't really all that interested after having been put off by the bomb room.

However, I noticed you have a few wraithwing-on-tar rooms. Get rid of them. They're fixing that bug in the next patch.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

Tim
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1979
Registered: 08-07-2004
IP: Logged

Chaco wrote:
However, I noticed you have a few wraithwing-on-tar rooms. Get rid of them. They're fixing that bug in the next patch.

Sorry about that, I guess I've been very quiet about this, but the bug has been identified and hopefully fixed in 2.0.13.

Which means, than an unnamed room in an unnamed hold by a person I won't name will be finishable.

(sorry, but I haven't had time to play this hold yet.)

-- Tim (who filed a bug report by e-mail)

____________________________
The best way to lose customers is to let little kids running loose on a forum with too many mod points.

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[Last edited by Tim at 01-18-2006 12:59 AM]

Tim
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1979
Registered: 08-07-2004
IP: Logged

A short reply, because I've only been randomly playing this hold. (This hold is way too hard for me anyway...)

There are some spelling mistakes, and I'd suggest you to use a splling checker with the ExportSpeech function. For example, the entrance description of L4: definately, Seige, percise, fortunatley. I can check them all if you want to.

L5 1N4E, can't return afterwards.
L5: Many water rooms doesn't connect properly.
L6 is very hard, and I don't think I can solve any of them, but 3N1E is certainly not finishable.
The Void is not finished. Even 2S4E is not possible.

-- Tim

____________________________
The best way to lose customers is to let little kids running loose on a forum with too many mod points.

Atch
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 81
Registered: 08-29-2003
IP: Logged

Hi Stu, it was interesting to read that you and bandit together have accumulated an impressive 15 years Drod playing. Myself, I have barely managed 3 years and was beginning to think that I might be finished – until this afternoon I had not played a single room since November. However, I downloaded the latest version of Renegades and have enjoyed playing through the new bits of Level 4 so may not be completely burnt-out yet.

Level 4

You will remember that when Renegades was in private beta we couldn’t complete Level 4 and so were unable to reach Level 5 outside of the Editor – well you can now. Just a couple of points:

1S, 1W:  Now a rather easy room: I thought the original room you had here was great fun – was there a reason for changing it?

2S, 4W:  I had to redo the Slayer’s trail half a dozen times so checkpoints (at say (1, 15), (26, 21) and (30, 12)) would have been appreciated.

Level 5

I did play five rooms of the original Level 5 as a single level hold under my own name. The Entrance is very well done but other rooms: 1E and 1S, 2E were very very tough and were verging on being cruel. I have to say that golems in tight spaces, particularly when restricted by bombs, are perhaps my least favourite of the new elements so I was only able to enjoy these rooms in retrospect and that was mainly through relief on having completed them. However you have now changed 1E (not played yet) so my 3933 moves in 62 minutes were all in vain. Unless you have other plans for it perhaps you should issue it as a single room hold, an example of a grade 10 for hardness and tedium! To play the old version, I had to add checkpoints in the NW and NE corners. The checkpoints that you had in the middle were unless – accessible only when you had almost finished – or was I missing a simple solution?

I think that I will leave Level 5 for now and go through Level 3 again next – I see a number of changes – and should be able to report by next Tuesday or Wednesday (25th). Even if the wraithwings on tar bug is fixed by the next patch, 3N, 2E will still be playable won’t it? It will just be easier and far less quirky a room.

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1645
Registered: 12-12-2004
IP: Logged

Tim wrote:
There are some spelling mistakes, and I'd suggest you to use a splling checker with the ExportSpeech function.

Good job, sir.

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[Last edited by Banjooie at 01-19-2006 11:08 PM]

Tim
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1979
Registered: 08-07-2004
IP: Logged

Banjooie wrote:

Tim wrote:
There are some spelling mistakes, and I'd suggest you to use a splling checker with the ExportSpeech function.

Good job, sir.

Banjooie, I'm very glad to see that your English is much better. It seems that you are a much more suitable person to check the English in this hold than I am.

On behalf of Stuwy, I want to thank you in advance for volunteering to check the hold for me.

-- Tim

____________________________
The best way to lose customers is to let little kids running loose on a forum with too many mod points.

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1645
Registered: 12-12-2004
IP: Logged

File: Renegade Errors.txt (6.6 KB)
Downloaded 68 times.
License: Public Domain

Tim wrote:
On behalf of Stuwy, I want to thank you in advance for volunteering to check the hold for me.
-- Tim

Okay. ^_^

Tahnan
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2467
Registered: 11-14-2005
IP: Logged

Update: now stuck on the beginning of Level 2, 3S3E.

(Incidentally: now that I've come back to this hold, I had to read through Doom's walkthrough. Not fond of this area at all, because there are a lot of counterintuitive moves, specifically moves that look like they should kill you--swinging your sword when there's a guard with a sword pointed at your back--that don't only because of the opaqueness of order of monster movement.)

Anyway--

Stuwy wrote:

Tahnan wroteThere're some small scripting weirdnesses in the entrance area, having to do with what happens if you leave 1N or 1W without clearing them.)

Really? How so to be specific? I mean do the gaurds still talk or something?

If you go east from 1W right after entering, the slayer (rather strangely) follows you out (and you can then go into 1N without having completed 1W).

If you go south from 1N right after entering, the yellow door won't open to let you back in unless you go back into 1W and then back out.

There're some grammatical issues in the scripting--not much, but I noticed "emporer" for "emperor".

Which room specifically if you can remember?

Level 1, 2E, had "emporer" for "emperor". Someone else commented on "gaurds" for "guards", which is probably there throughout; I forget.