I've finished the hold as it stands. I did wait to see if anyone else would write but they haven't. I hope these comments are useful. Mostly they are about room order and the level of difficulty, and who the game is aimed at.
First I want to say how many good things there are in it. It's obviously for people who want to understand and practice slayer moves, which means that it can (and should) be more repetitive than a game hold and take time to expand on themes. I think it does this with some really clever applications. You get to learn a lot which makes it satisfying – even when it's frustrating you. And you get a lot better because of it.
For example, it was new for me that you can get by slayers even when you are only two squares away, if the hook and sword are pointed in the right direction. I have done it before, but as a lucky escape rather than a planned solution. And then to find that you can push the slayer from two squares away, by being backwards to it, and even change its direction, that's fantastic. (It reminds me of all the problems I had with goblins, how difficult it was having to take them round mazes, even to get them into a snake box. Now, for the most part, that feels easy. This hold goes a long way to doing the same thing for slayers.)
I would like to have had more easy rooms at the beginning, lots of them, with the techniques flagged up more. Unless you are aiming at more advanced players who want to tighten up one aspect of the game? (Except that you say "
Well done"
for finding a secret room, so presumably this is for beginners. Unless that was irony.) If you don't have beginner rooms then I think (several) title demos would be useful – with a scroll to tell people where they are. But I hope you go with the easy beginner rooms – I'd like to see what you do with absolute simplicity. Using each of the basic moves in turn? Like you do in the second level 1S and 5S.
Often a more difficult room is followed by easier rooms using the same techniques. Is this intentional? For instance, IMO, first level 2S1E is more complicated than the rooms that follow it. (I don't think it was me getting better at it.) Here you need to use the wisp and hold the slayer back to be able to complete it. But holding the slayer back is the same technique as moving the slayer about, and that hasn't been used yet. It seems to me that the hold assumes that people already know how to move a slayer around, but do they?
Save points. Are you going to add them later? I had to edit some in myself or give up in frustration.
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Under Pressure: (only secret to save space)
Click here to view the secret text
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1S
Good idea, but what I was saying about having easy rooms first. This looks simple but I got it at random without understanding what I was doing. Because the moves are complicated in a small space. Is that the point, that you can get through, to be examined later? If so it works.
2S
This is easier than 1S because there's more room.
Doesn't record a demo going south. (But there is one from the teleport going back east.)
2S1W
good room, idea and design. The wisp. Also being in small 3x3 spaces with the slayer.
2S2E
I found this much more difficult than 2S, and harder than 2S4E and 2S5E that follow.
2S2E
Nice room. But it assumes you know how to push the slayer into place. Is this where people are supposed to work it all out? Or go to the hints board for the answer?
Assuming that they know it, it is a good entry standard with a clear task. I liked the slayer trap.
2S3E
Nice room, good extension of 2S
2S4E
same technique as 2S2E but IMO easier because there's more room and fewer pressure plates.
2S5E
looks like 2S4E but pushing slayer onto plates rather than using wisp. Having the doors open differently was a nice touch. Simple but it got me.
2S6E
good extension of 2S5E
2S7E
nice room design. More pushing practice.
No name yet:
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Entrance
Pushing the slayer and then making him turn to hit an orb.
Good, clear and simple.
1S
Brilliant room, for the way it is based on the slayers duelling moves when you are two squares away. This is the room that shows you can walk the slayer by being backwards to it. So good you get it twice; the first side I couldn't get the slayer into position properly, the second it slotted into place. (Thank you. New idea for me.)
2S
Clever use of water creatures on dry land. I've not seen this before.
2S1W
As soon as the line is broken you can dump the slayer into the water, so it's very easy. I'm all in favour of very easy, but is this your intended solution?
3S
Another clever room. A first time use? Points up that slayers don't change direction if Beethro sheaths his sword. Also, they go straight for you. There's an easy slayer kill here because of the token. Do you want that? There aren't any other slayer kills in the hold.
Putting walls round the token with arrows stops it, but maybe it's too fussy:
wxw
wxw
waw
wtw
waw
where the arrows both point south. I think having two squares of wall above the arrow will stop the arrow kill. Or have a passage into the right hand side wall.
4S
slayer on a 5x5 platform. Excellent room. Needs save points.
I cleared most of the water creatures first, before going back to the slayer. Is that right?)
I don't understand why, when you move the platform, sometimes the slayer stays on the same square but sometimes it's thrown back a space. Is there a logic to it? I just took it as it came but I would have liked to be able to plan for it.
4S1E
I had to add save points or I would ahve given up. I kept losing it trying to get to the right hand side (moving, killing the water creatures and avoiding the slayer on a 5x5 platform) I found it impossible the first time, but after finishing the next level I went back and it was OK. So, good room and a good extension of 4S.
5S
Much easier than 4S. Another good room, like 1S with a different basic move.
Really good, clear, introduction to moving the slayer. But you've already had to use these techniques on the 5x5 platform so maybe it should come first?.
6S
Clever and minimalist. Needs the moves in 5S.
3: Another unnamed:
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Entrance. I gave up and added safe points. Same reason as before. Very annoying to lose your work.
Hard room. Good idea, but fiddly, especially the two slayers together. Do you have to have two twice? Interesting that after the two, one feels easy.
The slayers get in the way of each other, but only because of the programmed move order. (There's a point with the right hand two slayers where it looks as if you should be able to push one away onto an empty square but the other steps in first, without any particular reason why that one moves before the other.) So that bit is annoying because it's out of your control, if you see what I mean. You are trying to beat an artificial glitch, not an enemy.
1S
Nice. Much easier than the entrance.
I don't get a demo of completion. Would a conquer token help this? (I've had this problem in my hold when there are no deaths.)
2S
clever. That you can make them step four squares away from you. By turning your back on them. And simpler than it looks (which is always good).
2S1W
nice simple room design, good to be outdoors.
Another wisp and pressure plate room. But this time with added extra slayers. That you can get right up close to them in safety. (Is this enough to warrant another room? Me, I didn't mind, because it gave me more practice.)
I like it that there are only three pressure plates, so not over-kill of the idea.
2S2W
wisp and pressure plate. Harder than the previous room but it feels easier because by now the lesson is learnt. This is satisfying, to have learnt something.
2S3W
I liked this room. It's very simple, looks impossible – an impassable barrier of seven slayers – but it actually works out well.
2S4W
You don't have to step on the conquer token on the way round, so the third slayer doesn't come out. Then there's only the last slayer to manipulate which is quite easy. Is this intended? (I went round again to get the token, so more moves but easier.)
2S3W on the way back:
you have to go round the slayers again. It's not a problem but is it necessary? You've only just done it the first time.
2S2W and 2S1W on the way back:
if you enter onto the 5x1 plate it doesn't open the doors. You have to step off and back again. So not important but inelegant. Could the chambers be one square to the right so there's a space before the plate?
2S1E
same way of cutting into the water creatures, but in a more cramped situation. It was pleasing the times I could position the slayer to kill several of them in sequence.
The orb – 1) it doesn't open the doors, is it meant to? Or is it a red herring? (But why?)
2) When I did it the middle slayer cleared the area by itself, so I didn't have to go in anyway. Is that just lucky?
This is the only room where you could use the pushing-the-slayer-along-the-wall move, I think we could with more of it.
[Last edited by bodkin at 05-13-2007 03:30 PM]
