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File: Idiots Dungeon.hold (39 KB)
Downloaded 8876 times.
License: Other
From: Unspecified

Made by Rowthro Budkin.
A dungeon that has a few elements as a theme for each level.

rowrow
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 432
Registered: 08-17-2004
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Can more people please vote on this? 1 Vote doesn't show much of the quality and difficulty of the hold.

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B'hakhgra Du S'tra Moth'ness Ti!

RoboBob3000
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1980
Registered: 10-23-2003
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I don't know why more people haven't rated this hold; it was one of the most enjoyable holds I've played in a while. I think that the tar and mud race rooms were well implemented. My only beef is with the rock golem stage. I spent far too long trying to manipulate them in small spaces, and the one with the Golem/Wubba/Trapdoor section nearly made me want to cry.

The rooms with rattlesnakes and brains were epic battles, and they reminded me just how much action that combination of elements can bring.

Also, this hold needs stairs to end it! I want to put it in my "completed" stack.

Nice work, Rowrow.

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rowrow
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 432
Registered: 08-17-2004
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I was gonna do it with stairs, but then someone told me I shouldn't because you can start on any level. Even now I don't know what to do.

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RoboBob3000
Level: Smitemaster

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Here's one thought:

Change the entrance level so it has rooms to the north, south, east, and west. Make them all required rooms only accessable as entrances after hitting the exit stairs of each of the four levels. Make sure they each have a one-way path back to the hub room. Put a blue door blocking the end hold stairs in your hub room, and just like that, you have a completable hold.

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rowrow
Level: Smiter
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Registered: 08-17-2004
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It is not possible to do, since you can't update a hold with a new room, or a room missing.

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eytanz
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2708
Registered: 02-05-2003
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Just add a staircase somewhere. Personally, I'd much rather have people who don't really deserve it listed as conquerers, then people who do deserve it but are stuck with it on the unconquered list.

After all, being a conequerer doesn't affect the actual high scores, and the amount explored is listed, so it's not like anyone could benefit much from accessing the stairs prematurely.

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stigant
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1182
Registered: 08-19-2004
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I've found 2 secret rooms, but I can't see where the others are. Or are there any? Is it possible to drop the master doors?

The ones I've found are:


There were some nice rooms in this hold:
I really liked the golem level with 2N being the most satisfying solution. 1N and 1N1W were also very good.

On the many monsters level, I liked 1N and 3N the best.

The orthogonal squares with rattle snakes rooms, I just got as many snakes trapped as possible and then killed off one at a time. I find this type of room to fairly luck based in the sense that I'm going to try the same basic strategy with slightly different tactics until I get the room right. I did like the roach horde rooms, though. They were nice strategic efficiency tests.

I didn't like Many Monsters 2N or Tar and Mud 1S1E. I felt like the 650 move timer was really arbitrary and I was within 10 moves about 5 times in a row before I finally got out with 3 moves to spare. The room is enough of a puzzle without the efficiency aspect to it. I would recomend closing off an entrance to a secret room when 650 moves expires, but allow completion of the room in more than 650 moves.

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[Last edited by stigant at 09-20-2005 08:38 PM]

larrymurk
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1917
Registered: 12-09-2004
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Another "broken" hold?

It appears this hold can not be completed.

Rowrow, can you please make the hold completable? Please...


11/18/2005 UPDATE: This hold can be conquered now.

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[Last edited by larrymurk at 11-18-2005 09:33 PM]

rowrow
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 432
Registered: 08-17-2004
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yay! It should be completable now. let me know if there is anything wrong about the ending besides it not saying the right thing when you did complete it. But again, you wouldn't do that level again and get confused.

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larrymurk
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1917
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rowrow wrote:
yay! It should be completable now. let me know if there is anything wrong about the ending besides it not saying the right thing when you did complete it. But again, you wouldn't do that level again and get confused.

Yeah! Indeed the hold can now be conquered. Thanks for making the revision rowrow

Interestingly, the master walls in "Choose the Element" now drop; however, I think we have a bug. The monsters seem to still be treating the master wall as impassable although it is unlocked and indeed Beethro can walk through it.

I believe this is a bug for mrimer? Mike, you reading this?

If this bug is fixed it looks like this room would be solvable.

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3303
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That doesn't sound like a bug.

Master walls aren't supposed to let monsters through. Dropped or not.
(dropped) Master walls aren't supposed to be used as puzzle elements anyway. There's something like demos becoming invalid if Beethro steps on a master wall in a room.

Rabscuttle
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2495
Registered: 09-10-2004
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Yes, the spider assumes that the master walls are up, so a demo where Beethro walks through a Master Wall will get deleted. You can test this yourself in KDD2:L1:Ent

[pedant]...unless you still complete the room after bumping into it.[/pedant]

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3659
Registered: 10-06-2005
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I suppose this means that you should probably put the master walls in your hold in a seperate, monsterless room, so that room will have no highscores.

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eytanz
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2708
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This of course raises the philosphical question - if a monster found and solved all the secret rooms, would the master walls let it through?

Fortunately, most monsters are way too stupid to find secret rooms, let alone solve them. Brains might be able to do it, but they're immobile so the master walls aren't an issue with them.



What?

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Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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Registered: 10-06-2005
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But then how come many secret rooms have monsters in them? Eh? Didn't think about that, did ya?

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RoboBob3000
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1980
Registered: 10-23-2003
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And wouldn't a monster have to smite itself before it could clear *any* room?

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pladams9
Level: Delver

Rank Points: 30
Registered: 07-31-2005
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Not if it's a Wubba. (I think.) And Wubbas are invincible. All it needs is to eat a brain and off it goes.

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Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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Wubbas don't eat monsters. At the most, they just cuddle against big moving objects.

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Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1645
Registered: 12-12-2004
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We'll tape a sword to it. IT CANNOT FAIL.

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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Registered: 10-06-2005
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Even if the wubba had a sword, it wouldn't be able to drop red doors

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trick
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
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Registered: 04-12-2003
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It could use the sword to kidnap Beethro and threaten him to follow it around and drop trapdoors for it.

- Gerry

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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Threaten him? Then Beethro would just run around the wubba goblin-style and get his sword back

Somehow I think this will become a battle...

EDIT:

Also, wubbas can't go down stairs or through tunnels.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 12-03-2005 11:18 PM]

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

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This clearly would have to be a wubba of unparalleled intellect, to figure out the entire idea behing smiting anyway.

Alneyan
Level: Smitemaster
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Are you sure Beethro *is* a delver of unparalleled intellect? I'm starting to suspect brains *also* affect Beethro (of course, my jealous rivals will find something to fault with my thesis, simply because they weren't the ones who came up with it).

Assuming we have such a wubba, could it not convince Beethro to carry it around? Wubbas tend to hang around people, so it should be easy enough for said wubba to get on Beethro's shoulders and stay there. If nothing else, a Wubba ought to be able to go *down* stairs.

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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Uhm, wubbas are as big as Beethro. They won't fit on his shoulders. And this still doesn't resolve the whole "Beethro is the only person on the Eighth who can go through tunnels" issue.

Another limitation: wubbas don't have limbs, so they can't open and drink mimic potions.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 12-04-2005 03:24 PM]

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

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Wubbas are presumably porous enough to absorb liquids around them.

Thus: They shatter the potion with the sword taped to their top, and then sop up the potion.

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
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Registered: 10-06-2005
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But how would the wubba know about enemies buried behind several layers of walls and thus place the mimic in the appropriate position?

What are the capabilities of a mimic-wubba, anyway? We can presume that the mimic looks like Beethro only because Beethro drank it.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 12-05-2005 01:02 AM]

gamer_extreme_101
Level: Smitemaster

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Tee-hee...this conversation would be a lot better if you knew the information about wubbas that's currently on the new site. I'd love to hop in here and continue on, but I fear what Erik would do to me.

All I'm going to say is that Banjooie is on the right track. And that I'm hungry. But that's it.

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Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3659
Registered: 10-06-2005
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Oh, I read the hidden wubba help file in DROD that you can't access with the DBOD, and it doesn't say anything about mimic-wubbas

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