azb
Level: Disabled
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Registered: 03-08-2014
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File: From the Other Side Level 1 Re-Fixed.drh (4.4 KB)
Downloaded 33 times.
License: Public Domain

Hello everyone,

I know I have made my Twenty Five Levels of Tendry, but I remember recieving feedback that it was too many levels for the simple Goblin Hollow style hold I was making, and that it was boring in terms of decorations/aesthetics and story, as well as too many scorepoints where it is not necessary, so I made sure to address all of those things in this hold.

You will play as a Gray man/Citizen from the Empire's perspective rather than Tendry's side, and you will encounter story dialogue during the bosses for each level - I only want to make 5 to keep it short and sweet rather than dragging on forever, and currently there are 2 levels.

Please feel free to let me know if it feels still too much like speed architecture/war style holds or if it feels like a genuine DROD RPG hold.

07/08/2024 UPDATE:

Fixed level 1 to have harder to fight monsters.

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[Last edited by azb at 07-08-2024 09:26 PM : 07/08/2024 Update, fixing level 1 to have harder to defeat monsters]

Gordius
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 98
Registered: 12-16-2008
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I like the premise of this, but I think the first floor needs some balance considerations. If you kill the WW in the first room, and then the two roaches and brain to get the blue key, and then the neather, you can use your key to buy the wooden sword and then everything left on the first floor (and also the antlions and the stuff you need a sword to get from the goblin) is free. I don't see any amount of work you could do with the gems/keys/health on the first floor that would improve on that.

And then, once you're on the second floor, I think there's only one monster that it is beneficial to consider getting the short sword for. Nothing else seems within the 20-point ATK window. And because of the strongly ATK-weighted starting stats of the Grey Man, DEF is always going to be relatively low value unless you can get a lot of it. It's possible that the Wooden Shield might be worthwhile, but I honestly think the same general approach here as on the first floor (What's the absolute simplest way to get enough greckles to buy the blue key and then see where that leaves me with the Goblin King?) is the only real option. But I decided to write this feedback in the hopes that you'll make the first floor more interesting rather than give too much thought to the second floor.

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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Yeah. I used weak monsters that you could one-shot intentionally at first, but I can definitely see how it would make the gameplay off-balanced if I used nothing but weak monsters - I will use stronger monsters to guard the gems and blue key, using a custom monster for the blue key like I did for the second level guard, but the stuff like being able to kill the wraithwing easily is intentional for only the first level.

I also intentionally gave the player a choice between spending their green key on a short sword or wooden shield, but not both, in that they would see the wooden shield is suppsed to be the easier pick.

Gordius
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 98
Registered: 12-16-2008
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I don't think that made it better. If anything, it's a lot more obvious now that there's nothing on the first floor I would really call a decision. Take the DEF gem in the first room. Before, it cost you 15 HP and would save a total of 10 HP if you killed everything else on the first floor. Now it costs 110 HP and saves you 12 HP on everything else on the first floor. So clearly we should ignore that until some undefined "later" when the tradeoff is less lopsided. But the same argument applies to pretty much everything but getting the yellow key, now spending it on 200 HP and killing the sub boss and boss to get out. It's a little costlier, but it's no more difficult or interesting.

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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It is intentional the first level is very straightforward in terms of what decisions you should make, but I suppose I could make the decisions a little more complex by tweaking some more monsters further, but I won't go crazy with custom monsters, I will just use different default monsters.

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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Okay, now it's fixed again - note it is 100% intentional you can one-shot the monsters after you have gotten the wooden sword, as that is what the intended idea is this early in the hold - I want the decisions to be easy and not super tricky mind melting madness.

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[Last edited by azb at 07-08-2024 09:28 PM : Typo: "Mind", not "Mend"]

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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Does anyone have feedback on level 2 in more detail, before I make level 3?

It is intentional there is that one room where you dodge the goblin in the correct direction and get free goodies, just like in other easy holds.

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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Does anyone have any feedback on the version with level 2 now?

Again, it's intentional there are places where you can sneak by the goblins without getting hit cause it's meant to be an easy hold and not like TotS or Fetch the Pie.

Nuntar
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 5291
Registered: 02-20-2007
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It's okay so far. Easy but nothing wrong with that if you want an easy hold.


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50th Skywatcher

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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Nuntar wrote:
It's okay so far. Easy but nothing wrong with that if you want an easy hold.

Click here to view the secret text

×The player can choose either the wooden sword or short sword and it's possible to complete Level 2 either way. Getting the wooden sword is actually better because of the enemy on oremites and the fact that you upgrade to the Goblin-Biter soon. I would leave this in because analysing the choices is a good puzzle.

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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Note when I publish it, my next version with level 3 is going to have a different hold ID as this current version is before I recently resetted my computer, and when you reset your computer and re-download DROD all of your hold data on the "Build" screen is lost and you have to re-download the hold from wherever you posted it.

Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3746
Registered: 10-06-2005
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azb wrote:
Note when I publish it, my next version with level 3 is going to have a different hold ID as this current version is before I recently resetted my computer, and when you reset your computer and re-download DROD all of your hold data on the "Build" screen is lost and you have to re-download the hold from wherever you posted it.

It might be too late this time for this advice to apply, but it might help next time: if you export and back up your player file from your old computer, then when you have your new computer you can download that player file backup, use it, and you'll be able to edit holds you made without having to make a copy of them.

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Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):

azb
Level: Disabled
Rank Points: 502
Registered: 03-08-2014
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Awesome! That is definitely helpful advice.