Announcement: Why not try our official idea generator for inspiration when making puzzles?


Caravel Forum : DROD Boards : Architecture : The Letter W (W Based Player Roles.)
New Topic New Poll Post Reply
Poster Message
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged

File: The Letter W.hold (52.3 KB)
Downloaded 13 times.
License: Public Domain
icon The Letter W (+1)  
Hello all, I'm back to make my second hold. This hold will be three small levels where you play as a different player role for each one, water skipper, wraithwing, and wubba.

Currently the only level that is (mostly) done is the waterskipper one so that is the level that the hold loads into, but after I have the other two the hold will start on a map screen. This map screen will update to include a location with the end of the hold after the three levels are clear so there won't be blue doors in any of the levels.

The rooms are still very much a work in progress, and are likely to change slightly or majorly between versions of this hold.

You can end the hold currently by leaving to the south of the entrance room, this will lead to the map screen in the completed version.

I'm looking to have this hold be around the 6 brains level of difficulty, so if you see rooms that are too far above or below that please tell me.

The most likely rooms to be completely changed would be 2n1w, 3n1w, 2n1e, and 1e. I feel like these rooms are the weak points in the level, especially 2n1w.

Update 1: Removed 2n1w and made another room, though not in the spot 2n1w used to be so I'll still need to make one more for that room.

Update 2: Added more rooms.

Update 3: Even more rooms, two missing in the wraithwing level and 4 missing in the wubba level, waterskipper level done.

Update 4: All rooms are in place, just fine tuning and polishing to be done now.

____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-

[Last edited by PigmyWubba at 10-03-2017 01:19 PM]
06-14-2016 at 01:52 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Insoluble
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1285
Registered: 09-04-2014
IP: Logged

File: The Letter W.demo (13.3 KB)
Downloaded 3 times.
License: Public Domain
icon Re: The Letter W (+1)  
Hi. I started playing this but spent way too much time on 2N1W and feel a bit too drained to go on. You mentioned that room as one that you are thinking about changing and I suspect that's a good idea. In general I think this hold is a neat idea and am intrigued by what I see so far. I'll post comments on the rooms I tried out and a demo pack so you can see if there's anything amiss in what I did.

Since I'm only about halfway through, rooms are posted in the order in which I completed them.
Click here to view the secret text


I'll try to play through the rest of these tomorrow. On the whole I like it so far.

____________________________
Links to neat forum tools that I always have trouble finding:
Click here to view the secret text

06-16-2016 at 06:37 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
I've changed 1e slightly based on what you said, and I also changed the obstacles and ortho-squares in 2n1w to force arrows, which will hopefully make the room a little less tedious.

____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-
06-16-2016 at 07:22 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
I've mostly finished the waterskipper level now, the only thing that's left is to make an new room for 2n1w, but I'll probably post that new room along with either the wubba or wraithwing level.

____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-
06-18-2016 at 06:40 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Insoluble
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1285
Registered: 09-04-2014
IP: Logged

File: The Letter W.demo (12.8 KB)
Downloaded 2 times.
License: Public Domain
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
I've played through some more rooms. Demos are attached.

Old business:
I eagerly await a new version of 2n1w.
1E Looks good.

New business:
Click here to view the secret text


____________________________
Links to neat forum tools that I always have trouble finding:
Click here to view the secret text

06-20-2016 at 03:22 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Chaco
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3148
Registered: 10-06-2005
IP: Logged

File: The Letter W Chaco.demo (8.1 KB)
Downloaded 3 times.
License: Public Domain
icon Re: The Letter W (+1)  
Just for good measure, here's a bunch of demos from me, where I probably do things in mostly the same way but maybe slightly differently than Insoluble did them.

Some quick comments:

1N is a good start, but the movement order on the golems can be a bit annoying if you put them in in the wrong order. I'm not sure what to do about that though; making the bridge 1 or 2 tiles wider ends up changing the Aumtlich beam geometry. I do like that you can use the orb for shelter from the Aumtlich beam, though, that's pretty cool.

2N is an alright room the way it is now, but the fact that you tend to spend a long time moving around the outside to deal with the trapdoors in the center of the +-shaped formations is a bit awkward, since you don't have an intuitive grasp of how much time you're allowed to be doing that. I did beat the challenge timer by a big margin, though, so clearly I must have figured out something good.

3N1W was a bit tricky at first glance, but wasn't so bad once I gave up on being stubborn about trying to light the NE fuses early, and just tried to dive in to light some of the other fuses first. The timer is in a fine spot, I think - keeps you from getting too bogged down but doesn't make you feel like "you were going so fast but you were still too slow".

3N1E isn't *that* bad if you know how Stalwarts move, but dealing with the Stalwart's tendency to try to rotate towards the brain on the east side when he's within about 3 squares of it is a bit annoyingly precise. Still, when you think of the Stalwart's state as only being his position and direction, it's not too hard to figure out some way of making him face a new direction at the same position. I appreciate the clone giving two temporary closings of a door instead of just one or zero.

____________________________
Quick links to my stuff (in case you forgot where it was):
Click here to view the secret text

07-08-2016 at 04:25 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (+1)  
After a (not so)short break from DRoD I've returned and started working on this again, I was considering waiting until I had every room I wanted in each level before posting an update, but decided against it.

You'll have to use the editor to access the WIP levels but the waterskipper level has three new rooms and is pretty much done.

Wubba/Wraithwing levels are included in the file but are very much barely started. All the rooms there are very subject to change.

I'm looking to have a pretty similar number of rooms for each level.


____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-

[Last edited by PigmyWubba at 09-22-2017 06:57 AM]
09-22-2017 at 06:50 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
Almost done with room making now, just 6 left to make but I figured I'd post what I have.

I added a temporary hub level for now, once I have all the rooms I'll add an actual map.

After I finish the remaining rooms there will be a phase of testing for USes and general polishing, and unlike my previous hold I'm gonna do that for a lot longer to really iron out the kinks.

The rooms are probably considerably harder than the original 6 brains goal, but difficulty tuning can be done after everything is in place.

____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-

[Last edited by PigmyWubba at 10-02-2017 04:37 PM]
10-01-2017 at 02:19 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
The last 6 rooms have been made, these rooms are a little unpolished in terms of both difficulty and possible USes, but they all exist.

I'm not entirely sure how long this polishing phase will last but
it won't be pushed through until I'm 100% happy with everything.

____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-
10-03-2017 at 01:12 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Insoluble
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1285
Registered: 09-04-2014
IP: Logged

File: The Letter W.demo (16.7 KB)
Downloaded 1 times.
License: Public Domain
icon Re: The Letter W (+2)  
I played a bit of the wraithwing level. I like the level aesthetics a lot, and there are some interesting ideas here for sure.

I like that you kept the entrance room basic. Since player roles aren't used all that often it's nice to have the first room in the level keep things simple.

1E: Is another fairly straightforward room but uses the wraithwing player role nicely.

1W: Was mostly a combat room but had the one bit that depended on turn order towards the bottom west. I think having something turn order dependent is fine here since it's pretty clear that's what you need to manipulate to get the monsters spaced out. It definitely fits with the room's theme.

1S1W: Felt like a pretty standard time clone room. It used the swordlessness of the wraithwings nicely though.

1S: This was a nice room and was the room the felt like it emphasized the properties of the wraithwing player role the most.

1S1E: is easy to come up with solutions for but the execution is tedious. I like constructs plenty, but I just don't feel like dancing one around to get one of the possible floor patterns to work. The speed potion helps a bit, but the execution still sadly ruins an otherwise nice room.

Haven't looked closely at other rooms on the level yet. I spent way too much time fiddling with the construct in 1S1E. I'll take a look at the others soon though.

____________________________
Links to neat forum tools that I always have trouble finding:
Click here to view the secret text

10-22-2017 at 04:04 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dying Flutchman
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 01-27-2017
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
Hi PW,

Still needing testing? I'd be able to playtest somewhere this week. (No promise, but willing to)

____________________________
My latest project: all you can ask for in casu gentryii.
http://forum.caravelgames.com/viewtopic.php?TopicID=43265
11-20-2017 at 04:39 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
Yeah, I'm just being patient and waiting for some comments. I already have the map and challenges scripted but I don't see much reason to post a new update just for that; so all thats left is polishing and US finding.

I published my first hold hastily and without much testing except from myself and probably half the rooms had something wrong with them, and I'm not gonna make the same mistake again.

____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-
11-20-2017 at 11:01 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dying Flutchman
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 01-27-2017
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (+2)  
Hi Pigmy,

I played through the skipper level so far, halfway through ww.

Design looks good, for starters.

Really like the skipper concept. Have never played as skipper before and you've done a nice job of showing several different puzzle mechanisms. Some really surprising solutions.

Room by room:
Click here to view the secret text


I'll give some comments on the ww-level later. Generally, I tend to like the ww role less than the skipper role. The ww can basically go everywhere that beethro/monsters can go + air/water. So there is no real limitation regarding moving space. With the skipper, there is a nice balance: skipper does (shallow) water, monsters do land + (sometimes) shallow water. This directly gives opportunities for puzzles involving remote manipulation, division of monster groups, etc.

Anyways: really like your work so far!

____________________________
My latest project: all you can ask for in casu gentryii.
http://forum.caravelgames.com/viewtopic.php?TopicID=43265
11-24-2017 at 10:22 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dying Flutchman
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 01-27-2017
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (+2)  
Hi again,

Didn't get to this in a while, but I don't seem to have much activity here. So here we go:

Played through about half of the WW-level. As said before, it doesn't really resonate with me, but that may be a matter of personal taste. Sort of room by room comment stream below:
Click here to view the secret text


Overall: nice level with some very good rooms, but a couple of rooms that are too 'busy' for my taste and put me off a bit.

Wubba-level-comments in next post.

____________________________
My latest project: all you can ask for in casu gentryii.
http://forum.caravelgames.com/viewtopic.php?TopicID=43265
01-24-2018 at 08:07 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dying Flutchman
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 01-27-2017
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (+2)  
Now for the wubba level:

Generally fun. All rooms were pretty interesting. The fact that you can't really die, makes for a lot less pressure on the exact move sequence. Lot's of room to play around and discover the mechanics of the rooms, without needing to start over every time.
Room by room comments below:
Click here to view the secret text


Overall: great level, but the difficulty is quite inconsistent and some rooms seem to require very messy/precise/unforgiving execution, rather than a good idea. I'd say some rooms could be made less difficult execution-wise without compromise to the basic strategic ideas.

Hope this helps you. I don't think I broke anything, so even without any changes this will make a good hold.

____________________________
My latest project: all you can ask for in casu gentryii.
http://forum.caravelgames.com/viewtopic.php?TopicID=43265
01-24-2018 at 02:25 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
PigmyWubba
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 146
Registered: 04-14-2012
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
Thanks for your input, a lot of the time it can be hard to figure out which rooms are hard and which aren't since judging the difficulty of your own problems doesn't work.

I agree that a lot of the more fiddly rooms could be refined, that along with a few other things I noticed will be fixed soon along with an actual map screen.

I'm a little busy Irl and with making a blind race level currently so I'm not sure exactly when this will be updated but hopefully it's not a very long wait.

____________________________
790th Raft Complaint Clerk-
01-26-2018 at 02:16 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dying Flutchman
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 01-27-2017
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
Hi Pigmy,

Not to put you under any pressure, but...

I really like what I've seen so far. Are you planning to finish this hold? I think it would be a shame not to.

Just my two cents.

Hope you find the time and motivation to continue with this.

____________________________
My latest project: all you can ask for in casu gentryii.
http://forum.caravelgames.com/viewtopic.php?TopicID=43265
06-07-2018 at 04:26 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dying Flutchman
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 37
Registered: 01-27-2017
IP: Logged
icon Re: The Letter W (0)  
Hi Pigmy,

Not to put you under any pressure, but...

I really like what I've seen so far. Are you planning to finish this hold? I think it would be a shame not to.

Just my two cents.

Hope you find the time and motivation to continue with this.

____________________________
My latest project: all you can ask for in casu gentryii.
http://forum.caravelgames.com/viewtopic.php?TopicID=43265
06-07-2018 at 04:26 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
New Topic New Poll Post Reply
Caravel Forum : DROD Boards : Architecture : The Letter W (W Based Player Roles.)
Surf To:


Forum Rules:
Can I post a new topic? No
Can I reply? No
Can I read? Yes
HTML Enabled? No
UBBC Enabled? Yes
Words Filter Enable? No

Contact Us | CaravelGames.com

Powered by: tForum tForumHacks Edition b0.98.8
Originally created by Toan Huynh (Copyright © 2000)
Enhanced by the tForumHacks team and the Caravel team.