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Caravel Forum : Caravel Boards : Contests : Death to Death! (Our contest for May '06)
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Someone Else
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I'm in
05-02-2006 at 12:07 AM
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NiroZ
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quote:

3. If Beethro kills a single monster in any room, Beethro must then become trapped and have
to restart and/or undo.



So is he allowed to exit the room, as long as killing the monster then prevents beethro from continuing with the hold?


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05-02-2006 at 04:27 AM
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Geiler Hengst
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Ok i simply dont get the rules... probably due to my english...

How can one finish a room with a monster in it if you are not allowed to kill the monster???


05-02-2006 at 12:01 PM
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stigant
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you don't have to "finish" any rooms in the traditional sense. You just need to be able to get Beethro to the exit stairs without dying and without killing anything.

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05-02-2006 at 01:44 PM
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Syntax
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quote:
stigant wrote:
you don't have to "finish" any rooms in the traditional sense. You just need to be able to get Beethro to the exit stairs without dying and without killing anything.

And if you do kill something, it should be impossible for Beethro to exit.
05-02-2006 at 06:02 PM
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Pinnacle
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I'll try it.

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05-02-2006 at 06:15 PM
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Chaco
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Argh, this is such a good contest idea! I'm so sorry, but I don't think I can participate in this one. I even started coming up with some ideas! :?

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05-02-2006 at 08:17 PM
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silver
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it seems like you shouldn't need to say "I'm in" on a hold-submission contest. Just either submit a hold (thus being in) or not. If you're concerned about potential loss of information, then toss in a step where you post "I submitted a hold, let me know if you got it" but right now, "I'm in" is pretty meaningless since there's no special information he's distributing only to potential authors.


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05-02-2006 at 08:30 PM
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Geiler Hengst
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One more question...

When Beethro will die for sure as soon as he kills a single monster, does this count as well as "trapped"?
05-02-2006 at 10:55 PM
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silver
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quote:
Geiler Hengst wrote:
One more question...

When Beethro will die for sure as soon as he kills a single monster, does this count as well as "trapped"?


of course, I'm not Ezlo, but... that seems to (obviously?) meet his requirement of "the only way to complete the room is to restore/restart"

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05-02-2006 at 11:12 PM
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Tim
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Seems like interesting. But I don't think I have time this time...

2 questions:

1) How do you "win" this contest?
2) Are there rank points for rookies?

-- Tim :)

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05-03-2006 at 12:32 AM
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coppro
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Like all contests, there will be a rookie prize of 10 points for all newcomers, and a 1st prize of 100 points and a prize from the Prize Pile, a second prize of 50 points, and a third prize of 25 points. In addition, because the results are not quantitative, they will be held by a vote.
05-03-2006 at 12:35 AM
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Tim
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quote:
coppro wrote:
Like all contests, there will be a rookie prize of 10 points for all newcomers,
I'm sure this is true, but I just can't find it on any earlier posts in this thread. I just want to make sure Ezlo confirms that.
quote:
In addition, because the results are not quantitative, they will be held by a vote.
A vote about what? About how good the hold has followed the rules? About how fun it is? Or about how many rooms it has? I just want to make sure I'm not doing the wrong thing.

Oh, by the way, the hold that are submitted, should they be anonymous?

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05-03-2006 at 12:43 AM
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coppro
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Actually, Erik's the guy about prizes.

But as for the vote, whenever we have a hold-building contest, the rules are verified, and then a topic started with each hold available for play and one humungous poll. You may rate them however you want.
05-03-2006 at 12:46 AM
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Tim
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quote:
coppro wrote:
But as for the vote, whenever we have a hold-building contest, the rules are verified, and then a topic started with each hold available for play and one humungous poll. You may rate them however you want.
That's simply not true. Here are some examples:

One room in a hold, or one hold in a room: Scores should be based on: Fun, Variation between all the different play-throughs of the room (e.g. if the room plays the same for each entrance, there's not much point), Economy (reusability of stairs and room elements) and Originality.

2005 Film Festival: After you've watched all nine of the films, please vote and give each one a rating between 1 (vomit-inducing) and 10 (simply the best) by how well you liked it. You may be more influenced by writing, the story idea, scripting prowess--it doesn't matter, use your own criteria.

Limited Resources: Rate them as you liked them.

The War of the Dungeons: 1) Entries should be judged based on how the new room compare with their older counterparts. Judge based on making sure the puzzle stays the same in all aspects, use of scripting in an ingenuitive and novel way (If they used scripting, that is), and the general feel you get from looking at the new version.

Let's say that I won't be a bit surprised if the rules are changed during the poll. It's not the first time.

[Last edited by Tim at 05-03-2006 12:59 AM]
05-03-2006 at 12:57 AM
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Ezlo
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Wow! Lots of questions!

Yes, rookie bonuses will be handed out.
Yes, being trapped counts as having to restart.
You will get the criteria when you get the poll.
05-03-2006 at 12:27 PM
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Geiler Hengst
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It would be easier when one would now the criteria while designing the hold... otherwise it turn out that the number of rattlesnakes used is !THE! Criteria :-)
05-03-2006 at 01:01 PM
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Ezlo
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Okay, criteria.

Look for holds that use scripting in new and interesting ways, and/or not use scripting in new and interesting ways. Look for holds that are fun. And most important, if people use cheap tricks like putting one single roach in a wubba hoard, give them a lower rating.

Sound good? Good.
05-03-2006 at 01:07 PM
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Geiler Hengst
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One more question:

If i cut tar and by doing so create a tar baby... am i allowed to kill it or not? otherwise you cant really use tar at all...

and one more thing


I would look for someone wo wants to work together with me on this contest, i have some nice ideas i guess, but my problem is always that I concentrate too much on the intended way to solve a room. Therefore i would look for someone who cant take part on this contest due to time or idea reasons, but still wants to contribute sth and wishes to test all my rooms for bugs/unintended solutions/solutions which work with killing sth.

Please pm me for case you are interested. Of course the hold would get both our names equally!

[Last edited by Geiler Hengst at 05-04-2006 01:17 PM]
05-04-2006 at 01:08 PM
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Ezlo
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No, created tar babies can't die either, and you can't pair up in a contest, who would get the prize?
05-04-2006 at 01:20 PM
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Geiler Hengst
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Double bad news :-(


No teaming is understandable, the problem with the task is that proving that a room is really not solveable with killing a monster is sometimes hard...
05-04-2006 at 01:26 PM
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Doom
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quote:
Geiler Hengst wrote:
...the problem with the task is that proving that a room is really not solveable with killing a monster is sometimes hard...
True, it may be tricky to come up with things like this. It requires a bit different thinking than building an average room. I think the hardest thing in this is not to keep repeating the same tricks in a room after another.

By the way, I'm thinking about giving additional 5 points (yes, inspired by Eytanz) to the hold, which meets a specific condition I'm thinking about. I don't want to influence the way people build their entries, though, so I'm keeping it a secret until the end of the contest. It will be interesting to see what people can get done.
05-04-2006 at 04:51 PM
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Hikari
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Oh, SURE, pick the month I was planning on finally entering a contest to come up with something like this :P

:sighs and marks the calendar to start working on a contest this time next month:

Oh well, this should be lots of fun to vote on, at least.

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05-04-2006 at 07:11 PM
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Tooth and Nail
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I'm definately gonna have a go at this one. I was a little unclear on the rules at first , but I think I've got a pretty decent grip on them now. The problem now is finding time.
Vive le Eric!

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05-05-2006 at 07:47 PM
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VodkaAndCoke
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quote:
Ezlo wrote:
you can't pair up in a contest, who would get the prize?

Me and Syntax were considering collaborating on a hold for this contest, as we share the same computer and don't have the time to do two entries. Would it be possible to share any potential rank points won between us? (And as for the prize pile We've (by that I mean I) have decided what we'd like if we were to ever win.
05-06-2006 at 03:28 AM
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Ezlo
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Yeah, I think for people living in the same house we can make an exception.
05-06-2006 at 11:04 AM
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michthro
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Good thing larrymurk, Tim, Jacob, Doom et al. don't live in the same house.
05-06-2006 at 11:12 AM
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Chaco
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How do you know they don't? It would make SS's much easier to produce... :P

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05-06-2006 at 02:32 PM
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michthro
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You're right. I don't know that. In fact, as Syntax would say, for all I know they're one and the same person. Assuming they're not, nothing would stop them from collaborating on SS holds. It's only in this contest that they'd have to live in the same house.

Couple of questions for Ezlo:
-(Asked in part before by NiroZ.) What if you kill a monster and exit, but it's impossible to complete the hold then? If you kill a monster and exit where you entered, so the end result is the same as restoring? The way I see it, the spirit of the rules is just that you shouldn't be able to make progress by letting something die. (Both cases can usually be avoided by placing arrows in entrances, but that's annoying for players.)

-Is it so important that Beethro can die? I mean, what about a room consisting of a trapdoor/orb puzzle, with a roach somewhere behind a force arrow to meet that requirement? If you consider that "cheap", it means that you have in mind something more specific than "nothing can die". More like "Take an ordinary room where the idea is for Beethro to clear out some monsters, and make it so that he can't get through if he does kill any." Could you please clarify? Btw, anyone who comes up with nine different interesting trapdoor or, of all things, orb puzzles, deserves to win.

05-06-2006 at 07:59 PM
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Krishh
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I think that's just the thing. Sure you can just put a roach behind a force arrow, and it will qualify, but it probably won't get high votes. I understood that a main rating criteria will be how good is the not killing things part incorporated into the puzzle. Then again, I'm not Ezlo.

[Last edited by Krishh at 05-06-2006 08:21 PM]
05-06-2006 at 08:09 PM
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