Maurog
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1501
Registered: 09-16-2004
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Now, I don't really like this whole mod points business and try to ignore it as much as possible, but nevertheless.

How about tweaking it so that people with less than 10 rank points can't make new threads. Posts, yes, but not threads. It'll be doing us all a favor, really.

Thank you for your attention.

____________________________
Slay the living! Raise the dead!
Paint the sky in crimson red!

calamarain
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 933
Registered: 03-25-2007
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It does sound like a good idea. There's been... quite a few incredibly pointless threads made over the last month or so.

____________________________
My Holds

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[Last edited by calamarain at 01-25-2008 08:27 PM]

ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
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I think it would not make an effective enough filter to justify the confusion and perceived unfriendliness to newcomers. Bad post content can happen in a reply just as easily as a new topic. A lot of spambots have got reply spam down to a science now.

And newcomers often want to say something that is appropriate for a new topic. A reply-only-for-newcomers rule encourages off-topic replies to existing posts, i.e. "I know my question doesn't belong in this topic, but I can't ask in a new one."

I'm not saying there wouldn't be a little value to this, but I don't think it would be enough.

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

Maurog
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1501
Registered: 09-16-2004
IP: Logged

They do start with 10 points, right? It hasn't changed or something?

____________________________
Slay the living! Raise the dead!
Paint the sky in crimson red!

The spitemaster
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 354
Registered: 06-09-2005
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We could just start them off at twenty, then the ten idea would work better.

____________________________
Last night upon a stair
I met a man that wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish that man would stay away

Sillyman
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 339
Registered: 09-08-2006
IP: Logged

Or move the restriction down to 5.

____________________________
Who, me?
FNORD

coppro
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1309
Registered: 11-24-2005
IP: Logged

The issue is not idiots. The issue is more spambots.

Although really, if you started at 9, couldn't make a topic below nine, and there was a topic in the Anything board called 'come here for a rank point' whereby some random passers-by would unload their extra mod points, then that might work. Because generally someone writing a spambot isn't going to bother programming it to post in a specific topic - it's much easier to find a better target somewhere else on the web.

Alternatively, the "sign up page" could require a simple uuid to be passed that is regenerated about once an hour. That way an auto-sign-up bot will fail, and will find some other forum to harass, rather than someone actually writing a bot that uses the form. The trick is to be unique - if you are at all different from the next forum, spambots don't adapt.

jbluestein
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1670
Registered: 12-23-2005
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What's the problem you're trying to solve here, exactly? Are you worried about spambots? (because I haven't noticed much of a problem lately).

Or are we just worried about new, not particularly clueful people starting pointless topics that we don't like?

If it's the former, I'm not sure I see the problem.

If it's the latter, I'm still not sure I see the problem. Let's continue to be a welcoming environment. Use your conceptual 'D' key.

Josh


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"Rings and knots of joy and grief, all interlaced and locking." --William Buck

Beef Row
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 471
Registered: 12-28-2005
IP: Logged

For what it's worth, Admin currently only has 8 rank points, because he never contributes to the community, just takes credit for the hard work of others in every single thread he has ever posted. So yeah, this would stop his malicious credit hogging, and I'm all for it.

____________________________
"Now I will repeatedly apply the happy-face rule"

coppro
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1309
Registered: 11-24-2005
IP: Logged

There's no point trying to prevent idiots from posting. It doesn't work.

bash.org wrote:
<Khassaki> HI EVERYBODY!!!!!!!!!!
<Judge-Mental> try pressing the the Caps Lock key
<Khassaki> O THANKS!!! ITS SO MUCH EASIER TO WRITE NOW!!!!!!!
<Judge-Mental> **** me

Moral of the story: Idiots will be idiots. Resistance is futile.

Also, I admit it.

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[Last edited by coppro at 01-25-2008 10:18 PM]

ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

Generally, it is better to yourself put the content you want on the forum than to worry about others putting something you don't want there.

I'm not saying people were wrong to complain about bad posts here. I'm just saying if you go out and make good posts it helps the situation more than any other thing you can do.

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

coppro wrote:
The issue is not idiots. The issue is more spambots.

Well, you might say that is a separate issue that probably deserves different handling than low post quality from legitimate posters.

Although really, if you started at 9, couldn't make a topic below nine, and there was a topic in the Anything board called 'come here for a rank point' whereby some random passers-by would unload their extra mod points, then that might work. Because generally someone writing a spambot isn't going to bother programming it to post in a specific topic - it's much easier to find a better target somewhere else on the web.

Hmmmm.

You might be on to something there. What if we changed the "What Kind of Arnold Are You Post?" to be something a little more like a Turing test with a friendly welcoming theme. One up-mod to "11" would give people posting privileges (new and reply). Anybody could upmod or ask follow-up questions if they weren't sure.

A problem is that someone that gets downmodded to 10 or lower can't post, and has no way of correcting that except privately contacting people. That almost sounds good except that the system could be used by anyone to censor someone. I think spreading that power to everyone on the forum is going to create bad feelings when it is abused.

It might all work if getting downmodded back to 10 or lower didn't revoke posting privileges. But unlike the first change that requires forum coding work, which I try to avoid generating.

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

Jatopian
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1842
Registered: 07-31-2005
IP: Logged

How about if they get down to 1 they can't post new threads or delete threads?

Also, agreement with previous post.

____________________________
DROD has some really great music.
Make your pressure plates 3.0 style!
DROD architecture idea generator

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[Last edited by Jatopian at 01-25-2008 10:58 PM]

calamarain
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 933
Registered: 03-25-2007
IP: Logged

I agree with the low modpoint idea. Say if you're modded down to 3 or lower, you cannot create threads or delete old ones. It would save a lot of crap being flowed into the forum.

____________________________
My Holds

The spitemaster
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 354
Registered: 06-09-2005
IP: Logged

What would also solve this problem is a time limit. If someone has below five rank points they are not allowed to post. They, however, will regain points one at a time every twenty-four hours until they got to five. That way they boards aren't flooded and people won't be left out in the cold. If this works I would also put a ten point limit for new posts and start people at fifteen points.

____________________________
Last night upon a stair
I met a man that wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish that man would stay away

zex20913
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1723
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

The problem with "no new topic" is that old topics get cesspooled. All of the crap that would be in a new, shiny, ignorable topic goes into one that I may not want to ignore.

Seriously. If you see a topic that you don't like, hit the back button, click on the folder, and select ignore all posts. Subj.

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NiroZ
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1302
Registered: 02-12-2006
IP: Logged

I honestly don't think its worth the bother. People can post crap without making a new topic, and more likely than not they'll just bump up a old topic, which I'd find even more annoying than a poor quality topic.

MeckMeck GRE
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 594
Registered: 01-03-2005
IP: Logged

Maybe there should be a "delete thread" and a "save thread" button for all members. These buttons would be available the first 24 hours after a thread is created. It would work like a small poll. If the number of people wanting to delete the thread gets high enough (e.G. >5) and the amount of people wanting to save the thread is low (below 33% of the delete-voters) it will be deleted after 24 hours. To avoid abuse this options should be only available to registered members with more than 50 rank points. The drawback is that this method is way too complex and a simple posting restriction would be more appropriate. The best way of dealing with crappy topics however would be to ignore them. If you don't like them, why are you still reading them?

The spitemaster
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 354
Registered: 06-09-2005
IP: Logged

Another problem with restricting people is people may just make new accounts.

____________________________
Last night upon a stair
I met a man that wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish that man would stay away

zex20913
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1723
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

Many people (self included) don't vote on Holds. I am NOT going to rate each individual thread.

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Dolan42
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 195
Registered: 04-14-2006
IP: Logged

We have ignore thread and ignore board. Next up: ignore user. It works in chat, why not here? It could even be set with an expire date to see if the people get better or if you want to renew the time saving feature. You should be able to see the number of people who are ignoring you on your profile tab so you can see how dumb you are if you are getting better.

____________________________
-D
"To understand recursion you must first understand recursion."

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[Last edited by Dolan42 at 03-30-2008 06:48 AM : Oh, and if you disagree, feel free to ignore me.]

Jatopian
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1842
Registered: 07-31-2005
IP: Logged

But then we'll get asshats who never take anyone off ignore.

____________________________
DROD has some really great music.
Make your pressure plates 3.0 style!
DROD architecture idea generator

Beef Row
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 471
Registered: 12-28-2005
IP: Logged

Jatopian wrote:
But then we'll get asshats who never take anyone off ignore.

Also, goodbye Thread Continuity, as you get two or three people who've all mutually ignored each other replying in the same thread, and only seeing each other in other people's responses.

Especially if they ignored each other BECAUSE of the content of the thread. (Imagine the unlimited undo debate, or the 'sniping' debate with half the people not even able to read half the other people).

____________________________
"Now I will repeatedly apply the happy-face rule"

Jatopian
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1842
Registered: 07-31-2005
IP: Logged

Beef Row wrote:
(Imagine the unlimited undo debate, or the 'sniping' debate with half the people not even able to read half the other people).

That would be hilarious!
I mean terrible. That would be terrible.

____________________________
DROD has some really great music.
Make your pressure plates 3.0 style!
DROD architecture idea generator

Dolan42
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 195
Registered: 04-14-2006
IP: Logged

Beef Row wrote:
Also, goodbye Thread Continuity, as you get two or three people who've all mutually ignored each other replying in the same thread, and only seeing each other in other people's responses.

You'd still be able to see ignored people's responses, it just wouldn't trigger the thread or board to turn red. Just like ignore thread still moves it to the top and you can read it if you want. It just doesn't call it to your attention.

____________________________
-D
"To understand recursion you must first understand recursion."

Beef Row
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 471
Registered: 12-28-2005
IP: Logged

Dolan42 wrote:

Beef Row wrote:
Also, goodbye Thread Continuity, as you get two or three people who've all mutually ignored each other replying in the same thread, and only seeing each other in other people's responses.

You'd still be able to see ignored people's responses, it just wouldn't trigger the thread or board to turn red. Just like ignore thread still moves it to the top and you can read it if you want. It just doesn't call it to your attention.

Hmm, thats not nearly as hilarible as it sounded, but also seems sort of pointless.

____________________________
"Now I will repeatedly apply the happy-face rule"

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2336
Registered: 06-14-2005
IP: Logged

I think that whenever you read a post that has been modded down, it should automatically start ignoring that person.

Beef Row
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 471
Registered: 12-28-2005
IP: Logged

Someone Else wrote:
I think that whenever you read a post that has been modded down, it should automatically start ignoring that person.

Modded down.

____________________________
"Now I will repeatedly apply the happy-face rule"

Briareos
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3516
Registered: 08-07-2005
IP: Logged

Beef Row wrote:
Hmm, thats not nearly as hilarible as it sounded, but also seems sort of pointless.

Well, usually the "Ignore user" feature is implemented kinda like the "secret" blocks here: it shows "User is ignored" or somthing like that and provides you with a "View message" button that will display the message anyway - so it'll keep the noise down, but you can still read messages from ignored users if neccessary.

IMHO it's a great feature for ignoring trolls (which are a rare commodity here, mind you) and filtering out users that cause continuous headdesking due to their sheer incompetency.

Believe me, a desk (and/or a head) is a terrible thing to waste...

____________________________
"I'm not anti-anything, I'm anti-everything, it fits better." - Sole
R.I.P. Robert Feldhoff (1962-2009)