Knaight
Level: Goblin
Rank Points: 18
Registered: 01-01-2007
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Right now Seeps are the only real wall creature, and there is only one of them. There is a lot of room to change things, so here are some ideas for the forum to shred.
Dissolving Seep(Reverse Golem)-This is a completely normal seep, however when you kill it the wall it is on dissolves.
Seep Queen-As roach queen, but it makes seeps, and lives in walls.
Seep Crawlers-Seep Crawlers are able to go out of walls. However every tile counts as a hot tile for them, and if they touch a hot tile they die. They can go back into walls and act like a normal Seep again.

zex20913
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1723
Registered: 02-04-2003
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I think I like the anti-golem. It opens up a lot of testing issues, though. I'm sensing a lot of USs from it.

I think the seep queen would be better if it lived on floor--acted like a roach queen, but only spawned on walls. That would avoid many of the nuisances that I think a seep queen in the walls would bring up.

I'm not sure if I'd want to have a creature that can live in both walls and the floor, unless EVERY tile was a hot-tile to them. Walls included.

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Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2359
Registered: 06-14-2005
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I agree with your assessments. I was worried at first about being able to get to rooms that you shouldn't be able to with the anti-golem, but I think that it's just up to the architect to use wisely.
I don't think that a seep queen would be a great monster, but I can see some use coming out of that.
Well, there are monsters that can live on pits, water and floor, so...

Ravon
Level: Master Delver

Rank Points: 220
Registered: 02-19-2004
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The anti-golem could perhaps be used by a clever delver to make parts of a room trivial, but a careful architect can line the rooms with pits to keep any intruders from wandering.

Also, hello again.

Briareos
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3516
Registered: 08-07-2005
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Ravon wrote:
Also, hello again.

O HAI!

np: Gotye - Heart's A Mess (Supermayer Mix) (Various - Kompakt Total 10 (Disc 2))

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Knaight
Level: Goblin
Rank Points: 18
Registered: 01-01-2007
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Ravon wrote:
The anti-golem could perhaps be used by a clever delver to make parts of a room trivial, but a careful architect can line the rooms with pits to keep any intruders from wandering.

Also, hello again.

Given the company we are dealing with it would probably be more likely to be made absolutely necessary to kill them in specific spots, at specific times. They have the potiential to be very deadly, as well as to be a godsend and give break rooms.

I like them best of the three, they seem to fit in well.

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2359
Registered: 06-14-2005
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I agree, they are something that is completely original, with plenty of puzzle potential, and that makes them definitely worth putting in.

Knaight
Level: Goblin
Rank Points: 18
Registered: 01-01-2007
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On Seep Crawlers-Do you think it would be better if they died automatically if they were on the floor at certain times? I was originally thinking that giving them one turn on the floor in general, then they die, but that has no precedent. Killing all Seep Crawlers on the floor on turns 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, and 30 would, as we already have Snake preference switching, roach spawning, water skitter spawning, etc.

This would limit them to short bursts on the ground, which is sort of what I was aiming for to begin with.

Thoughts on this method?

zex20913
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1723
Registered: 02-04-2003
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I think I'd prefer a "turns out" limit, as opposed to an "on-turn" thing. Not saying I'd necessarily want either, just saying.

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Briareos
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3516
Registered: 08-07-2005
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zex20913 wrote:
I think I'd prefer a "turns out" limit, as opposed to an "on-turn" thing. Not saying I'd necessarily want either, just saying.

I dunno, but "turns out" is even harder to keep track than "on-turn" - just look at briar growth... do we really want to have to right click on every Seep Crawler to check how long it's gonna last?

np: Telekinesis - Tokyo (Telekinesis)

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Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2359
Registered: 06-14-2005
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I agree. If they died on turns divisible by 5, that would certainly be interesting. I support that idea.

Jatopian
Level: Smitemaster
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Registered: 07-31-2005
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It makes no sense. One turn out would be better. And it wouldn't be hard to remember; either they're out, and they will die next turn, or they aren't out.

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Knaight
Level: Goblin
Rank Points: 18
Registered: 01-01-2007
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The issue is that that is a highly limited range. With the 5 turn thing, it makes sense if you consider it a random type thing, but with the randomness being completely illusory. They may survive for up to five turns, it depends, some are luckier than others, and it is faux-random. 1 turn out would work, but that is very limiting.

Kwakstur
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 385
Registered: 05-05-2006
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1-turn-out Seep Crawlers would have to prefer an in-wall move over an outside move, and they would have to be smart enough to always try moving back onto a wall. Otherwise they would all kill themselves!

With roach behavior, only in certain very restrictive setups would it be possible for them to attack the player without easily being tricked into suicide.


And I don't see how the every-5-turn ones would work, either. They would be easier to employ in a level, but they can still easily be manipulated into an unfortunate demise.


The crawlers are just too difficult to employ.
Edit:Unless...
Unless THEY were spawned by the queens! 1-turn crawlers would still kill themselves like crazy, but at least they might pose a threat.


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[Last edited by Kwakstur at 09-21-2009 09:52 PM]