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Caravel Forum : Caravel Boards : Contests : Smite to the Death (Our contest for October.)
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bradwall
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I would like to join.

EDIT: I am wondering on a rule. Can our player run into someone elses sword? So, if player A hits 5, then player B tries to move into the path of his sword, is player B dead?
Also, what if player A and player B are facing each other and move directly toward each other... will they just stay in the same place or will they both die? I know that when Beethro does this to the Slayer, he just stays there... I was wondering if it is the same.

[Last edited by bradwall at 10-04-2005 02:23 PM]
10-04-2005 at 02:18 PM
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trick
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I'm in.

- Gerry
10-04-2005 at 03:08 PM
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DelverDom
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Count me in!

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10-04-2005 at 03:27 PM
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Yellow_Mage
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If there is space, I'm definitely in.

It's like fitting 20 people into a mini... seems highly improbably, but it beats a game of Twister.

bradwall wrote:

EDIT: I am wondering on a rule. Can our player run into someone elses sword? So, if player A hits 5, then player B tries to move into the path of his sword, is player B dead?
Also, what if player A and player B are facing each other and move directly toward each other... will they just stay in the same place or will they both die? I know that when Beethro does this to the Slayer, he just stays there... I was wondering if it is the same.

Wouldn't they all be invalid moves, like in chess; you can't deliberately sacrifice your king? I'm more curious if "Pause" can be a move. It would keep people moving if it wasn't available (unless you're boxed in somewhere, but you'd probably be dead then :)).

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10-04-2005 at 04:59 PM
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Oneiromancer
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Yellow_Mage wrote:
bradwall wrote:
EDIT: I am wondering on a rule. Can our player run into someone elses sword? So, if player A hits 5, then player B tries to move into the path of his sword, is player B dead?
Also, what if player A and player B are facing each other and move directly toward each other... will they just stay in the same place or will they both die? I know that when Beethro does this to the Slayer, he just stays there... I was wondering if it is the same.
Wouldn't they all be invalid moves, like in chess; you can't deliberately sacrifice your king? I'm more curious if "Pause" can be a move. It would keep people moving if it wasn't available (unless you're boxed in somewhere, but you'd probably be dead then :)).
Ah, I didn't see bradwall's post because it was an edit. I actually asked Erik the same question directly. He said that moving into a sword just blocks you, like if Beethro tried to move onto a mimic or a guard's sword. So it will end up as a wasted turn (or maybe not, if you would have died otherwise).

As for moving "at the same time"...well, first of all, there is a specific order of movement, so there's really no way that people can kill each other simultaneously. And second, in the situation of two people facing each other, they would just bump into each other's swords.

It will be interesting strategy, as Erik says. If you were facing your opponent like that, what do you think he's going to do? Will he rotate his sword and move diagonally to try to kill you? Will he move forward assuming that you will do the same thing? Will he back up diagonally to get some space? I think the last two people might take a very long time to die...it's a good thing we do 5 turns in advance, it might help decide things faster.

Game on,

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10-04-2005 at 05:05 PM
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Abbyzzmal
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My name blah, blah, blah, killed my father, blah blah blah.

I'll play.
10-04-2005 at 05:33 PM
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MeckMeck GRE
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Join Deathmatch..... connected ! ;)
10-04-2005 at 05:34 PM
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Alneyan
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Well, I like the idea, but not that much as a player, so I might just apply for that "work behind the curtains" thing instead. I gather that "help me update the hold for cycles" means updating the hold file when guards move in, move out, and get killed?

Sometimes, I find working behind the stage funnier than actually being on the stage. Don't ask.

[Last edited by Alneyan at 10-04-2005 05:37 PM]
10-04-2005 at 05:35 PM
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worm
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Doom wrote:
There's no Neather sprite in JtRH. (Unless one was added for the updated version of KDD2 in some special way, which I doubt) The AE sprite wouldn't fit on the grid without resizing and making it look like mess.

It might also be a good idea to extend that quote or people may think that Erik said it as a part of the rules.
Like I did before I CTRL+F'd it.

[Last edited by worm at 10-04-2005 05:58 PM]
10-04-2005 at 05:58 PM
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vylycyn
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Like every other contest held since I joined this forum, I shall participate in this one.

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10-04-2005 at 06:34 PM
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Leus
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I definitely want to play this. I've already done it with my friends on a chessboard with little action figures and building blocks as walls and arrows and such. Erik's already heard the story. Anyway, maybe after this is all over with, a real multiplayer version of DROD might be created.

So count me in. And if we get to choose our models, I'll be the Slayer.

P.S.: I'd love to help with the updating of the hold, but I'm afraid that I'd mess up just one move somewhere and then everything would be ruined and it would be my fault. Yep. I'm optimistic and confident.

P.P.S.: Hopefully I don't get confused by the movement because I changed the keys to WASD for horizontal and vertical movement and QE for sword turning. But I should be able to remember to do it right.

End long post.

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10-04-2005 at 06:39 PM
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VortexSurfer
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I'm in!

VortexSurfer
10-04-2005 at 06:56 PM
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mrimer
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I won't commit to doing this, but how about someone maintain an "Arena Playback" hold file with the contest results that has each monster character in the room scripted according to the moves the players make? Speech texts can be used to put player names above each avatar at the beginning (or at more interesting moments, like when A kills B) to help watchers follow along. Then the winners can put this hold+demo in their trophy case and we can feature it here for posterity.

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Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
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[Last edited by mrimer at 10-04-2005 10:18 PM]
10-04-2005 at 07:47 PM
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ErikH2000
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Well, it sounds mean, but I hope a bunch of you guys die off in the first cycle. It will be less updating work. :lol

I am greatly appreciative of the offers to help with the updates. I think we can spread the work around and it won't be such a big deal. I'll start a new topic for the updates and discussion there will be limited to people working on the updates. The way I see it going is that I'd do the first update and write instructions for doing it. Then we'd schedule people to do each update afterwards. It should work out that nobody would have to do more than one each week. We should also try to get at least one person double-checking the moves for each update. Some more volunteers to do updates and double-check them would be good. I see no game advantage to entrants for being involved this way. The "kickback" I mentioned will be me liberally dumping rank points on posts in the update topic from people who contribute their help.

Entrants should be careful to plan their commands based on the hold we post in the player's topic instead of holds we post in the updater's topic which might be subject to correction. If we do make a mistake in a hold posted to the player's topic, we'll roll back time to that update as soon as the mistake is known about. So in theory, we could make a mistake on the first update that is caught ten cycles later and the game would essentially be restarted (ugh!), but I think we can probably avoid this kind of thing if we're careful.

-Erik

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10-04-2005 at 08:07 PM
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ErikH2000
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To answer Malarame's question, which now that I think about it, is very important: You can talk about all aspects of the game at any time, but it must be done publicly on the board.

Collusion makes the game political instead of tactical. A political game with hidden alliances might be great fun to try sometime but this contest wasn't designed that way. Don't provide game information privately to anyone else or offer to--that will disqualify you. And for the sake of the game, if anyone approaches you with private game information, please tattle on him to me and I'll disqualify him. If you have already made arrangements like this, then we won't disqualify you, but I urge you to cancel them and play the game without sharing private game information. From this point on, simply asking someone if they would like to coordinate movements with you in private or exchange any form of private game information is going to disqualify you. It's important that people aren't allowed to put feelers out, i.e. "Do you feel like cheating? No? Okay, no problem! Never mind, it was probably a bad idea, anyhow." And unfortunately, ignorance of the rule can't excuse you, or the rule may not be effective.

Going back to the top to update the rules with this. Thanks, Malarame, for bringing it up.

-Erik

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10-04-2005 at 08:15 PM
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Alneyan
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I don't really see a problem with updating and playing, especially if someone is busy double-checking, so count me in.

My blade is sharp, and my wits sharper still! Problem is, wits are a tad bit harder to sharpen than good, old-fashioned steel... or iron, depending on how good blacksmiths are; it could even be bronze or obsidian for that matter. Let's just settle for steel.

ErikH2000 wrote:
To answer Malarame's question, which now that I think about it, is very important: You can talk about all aspects of the game at any time, but it must be done publicly on the board.

If you really wanted to get technical, you might to specify a thread for game comments, instead of saying "on the board": who knows, some people might just post on the SubTerra forums, hoping to catch some players offguard.

[Last edited by Alneyan at 10-04-2005 08:20 PM]
10-04-2005 at 08:15 PM
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ErikH2000
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Added "Resolving Movement" and "No Sharing of Private Game Information" sections to the rules. Also, a sentence that says if you botch your commands, we reserve the right to substitute "5 5 5 5 5" for your commands. There won't be time to seek clarification from players on what they meant.

-Erik

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10-04-2005 at 08:31 PM
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cheese obsessive
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I guess I'm in. But I am out of town this weekend, on a marching band regional. So shall I still join, if I am going to be internet-less for a weekend? I am so in if this is fine.
10-04-2005 at 08:38 PM
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ErikH2000
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cheese obsessive wrote:
I guess I'm in. But I am out of town this weekend, on a marching band regional. So shall I still join, if I am going to be internet-less for a weekend? I am so in if this is fine.
You can still be in. There's three things you can do if you'll be gone for the first cycle:

* Submit no commands, and you'll automatically stand in place for 5 turns, i.e. "5 5 5 5 5". A danger here is that someone will be able to predict this movement, and kill you off based on it.

* Submit commands without knowing the your initial board position. This will at least randomize your movements on the first cycle and perhaps give you a better survival chance. Look for details for submitting commands on the board a little later when I get around to putting them up.

* Find someone who is not already playing in the game to decide on and submit first cycle commands on your behalf. If you were going to miss the second or later cycles, you could find someone who had been eliminated, but unfortunately you'll be gone for the first one. I can't let anyone play for two entrants in one cycle because knowledge of two player's movements gives an unfair advantage.

If you are going to do either of the first two things, don't let on about it or the information could be used against you.

-Erik

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10-04-2005 at 09:03 PM
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HopelessAmateur
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ErikH2000 wrote:
Dieing
but I don't think he did it on porpoise.
Bad Spellers of the World Untie!
I'm in. :thumbsup

[Last edited by HopelessAmateur at 10-04-2005 09:18 PM]
10-04-2005 at 09:17 PM
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Tim
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Me too! :sly

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[Last edited by Tim at 10-04-2005 09:22 PM]
10-04-2005 at 09:22 PM
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Penumbra
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Ah heck, count me in as well :)
10-04-2005 at 10:08 PM
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agaricus5
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I am definitely entering this contest too - an e-mail based DROD RPG game thingy sounds really cool.

One question, though - do we get to see the current list of character movement orders per cycle, and the move sequence of characters from previous turns?

Also, since characters are going to be scripted, how are you going to switch character movement order during the cycle using scripting? It might also be an idea to have someone work the sequences out on paper just to check that the rules are being consistently followed (and that no scripting mistakes have been made).

Oh, and I think that allowing characters to take two moves in succession is possibly going to be a problem, since it is a sort of "double move" and may be important in a few situations (it is also something the end characters can do, but not anyone else, which is a bit unfair). Perhaps rather than using a (1 to x) and then a (x to 1) movement order in alternating turns, the second sequence could be reordered to (x-1, x, x-2 ... 3, 1, 2). It is a bit more complicated, but it removes the possibility of this scenario from happening.

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10-04-2005 at 10:17 PM
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ErikH2000
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agaricus5 wrote:
One question, though - do we get to see the current list of character movement orders per cycle, and the move sequence of characters from previous turns?
The commands will be submitted by players privately to an e-mail address, and then posted publicly some time after the deadline for submitting commands has passed. The hold itself will contain the complete history of all commands so you can watch the game from the beginning whenever you want.
Also, since characters are going to be scripted, how are you going to switch character movement order during the cycle using scripting?
Instead of relying on the implicit movement sequence of DROD, we'd explicitly use "wait" commands in scripting to create the desired movement sequence.

If this ends up being too much work, I have a second idea involving copying rooms and placing guards in the order they are intended to move. In this case, there would be a separate room for each cycle.
It might also be an idea to have someone work the sequences out on paper just to check that the rules are being consistently followed (and that no scripting mistakes have been made).
I'm actually thinking of writing a quick little program that outputs the script instructions needed for each character based on submitted commands.
Oh, and I think that allowing characters to take two moves in succession is possibly going to be a problem, since it is a sort of "double move" and may be important in a few situations (it is also something the end characters can do, but not anyone else, which is a bit unfair).
It's a good point that I hadn't considered. We might also try setting the starting player forward by one space on each cycle. So cycle 1 starts with player 1, cycle 2 starts with player 2, and so on. Whenever you get to go first on a cycle, you'd end up being the last player on the next cycle.

What do you think?

-Erik

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10-04-2005 at 10:41 PM
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KevG
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If you still need volunteers to help with the updating, count me in.

It seems like last person standing should get some kind of reward. As it stands, it could easily wind up that the last two or three people have no chance of winning based on kills. This would render the actual end game more or less meaningless. There could either be a separate prize for last person standing, say 10 rank points. Or, make the last kill worth 3 or 4 regular kills.


10-04-2005 at 11:03 PM
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ErikH2000
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KevG wrote:
If you still need volunteers to help with the updating, count me in.

It seems like last person standing should get some kind of reward. As it stands, it could easily wind up that the last two or three people have no chance of winning based on kills. This would render the actual end game more or less meaningless. There could either be a separate prize for last person standing, say 10 rank points. Or, make the last kill worth 3 or 4 regular kills.
Well there is always just the inherent coolness of being last to die. I'm also going to use time of death as a tiebreaker if 2 or more players have the same kill count. I really don't want to encourage people hiding away from danger by adding incentives to be last.

-Erik

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10-04-2005 at 11:12 PM
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bdwing
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I'm in as a player.

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10-04-2005 at 11:13 PM
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forrestfire
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Woohoo, my first contest! This is going to be so fun. I'm in.

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10-05-2005 at 12:31 AM
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agaricus5
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ErikH2000 wrote:
Oh, and I think that allowing characters to take two moves in succession is possibly going to be a problem, since it is a sort of "double move" and may be important in a few situations (it is also something the end characters can do, but not anyone else, which is a bit unfair).
It's a good point that I hadn't considered. We might also try setting the starting player forward by one space on each cycle. So cycle 1 starts with player 1, cycle 2 starts with player 2, and so on. Whenever you get to go first on a cycle, you'd end up being the last player on the next cycle.

What do you think?

-Erik
Hmm... That sounds like a good idea, although it would allow a double move to occur if each cycle begins by following the order in contrary motion to the last turn. Perhaps what would be better is the opposite of what you have, basically a shift of players from the front to the back, along with inversions and swappings through the turns.

So, it might go like this...

Cycle 1

Turn 1 : (1, 2, 3, ... x-2, x-1, x)
Turn 2 : (x-1, x, x-2, ... 3, 1, 2)
Turn 3 : (1, 2, 3, ... x-2, x-1, x)
Turn 4 : (x-1, x, x-2, ... 3, 1, 2)
Turn 5 : (1, 2, 3, ... x-2, x-1, x)

Cycle 2

Turn 1 : (x-2, x-1, x-3, ... 2, x, 1)
Turn 2 : (x, 1, 2, ... x-1, x-2, x-3)

...

Cycle 3

Turn 1 : (x-1, x, 1, ... x-4, x-3, x-2)
Turn 2 : (x-3, x-2, x-4, ... 1, x-1, x)

...

And so on.

In other words, the system works like this:

Cycle 1

1. People's characters move once in a particular order during turn 1.
2. The order is inverted, and the first and last two characters swap positions for turn 2.
3. The order is inverted once more, and the first and last two characters are once more switched for turn 3.
4. This is repeated for turns 4 and 5.

Cycle 2

5. Cycle 2 begins with the last player being moved to the front, the new order inverted, and the first and last two players swapped like before.
6. Inversions of the order and swapping of the first and last two players continue for turns 2-5.

Cycle 3

7. The last player becomes first, the sequence is inverted and the first and last two players are swapped like before.
8. Inversions of the order and swapping of the first and last two players continue for turns 2-5.

Repeat ad infinitum (or until three people are left, in which case double moves will become inevitable, so simply inverting the sequence every turn and moving the last player to first every cycle will be sufficient).

For two players, alternate moves will probably be the most fair way to conduct the movement order.

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10-05-2005 at 01:00 AM
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techant
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Wow look at this list of contestents, sure beats the last contest, guess all the quite ones have come out to play :lol

Count me in! I was brave enough to try the last one who know how long I will survive this but I am willing to try.

By the way I like the fact we can not just hide. 2 :thumbsup thumbs up for catching that weakness early.

If it keeps growing like this you will need a play off :w00t

PS - go watch those films from the last contest and vote while you are waiting for this one to start.

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[Last edited by techant at 10-05-2005 01:12 AM]
10-05-2005 at 01:11 AM
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