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Pekka
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The Architest wrote:
This is what the Finnish ones could sound like. Pekka, what'cha think? :)

There are many good ideas. I like "tervahinen" in particular. (It suggests a mythical creature found in old folk tales, a member of some sort of "tar-folk.")

Perhaps we should avoid invented names for common words with real-world equivalents, such as serpent or spider. There might be some places in the dialogue and flavor texts where, for example, Beethro could call a serpent a slither-bag (this was in Architect's Edition, unless I remember wrong), and we could invent something equivalent for those situations. But in the game itself I'd prefer using just käärme for a serpent, because even though it is really big and red, that is what it is :)

I will respond in more detail later and bring up some of my own suggestions. I still want to think about some of the words that don't have any obvious fitting Finnish equivalents, like funnily enough, the orb.

@Bombadil: According to Merriam-Webster online dictionary, goblin comes from Medieval Latin. This of course has little bearing on what is a good equivalent in modern Spanish, but I thought to mention it.

Origin of GOBLIN
Middle English gobelin, from Anglo-French, from Medieval Latin gobelinus, ultimately from Greek kobalos rogue
First Known Use: 14th century


04-21-2012 at 11:11 AM
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DyRsOfDh14
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04-21-2012 at 11:14 AM
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Keiya
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skell, have you considered something like Croudin (link to Minecraft's, for demonstration)?

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04-21-2012 at 11:19 AM
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Suwako
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If it help, I'll translate these terms.

Brain - Cerebro
Eighth - Los ocho (i think it sounds better than el octavo)
Evil Eye - Ojo malvado (could be also only "ojo" if it have to be shorter)
Force Arrow - Flecha
Hold - Dominio (from DyRsOfDh14, excelent word to describe it :) )
Orb - Orbe
Roach - Cucaracha
Roach Queen - Cucaracha reina
Serpent - Serpiente
Spider - Araña
Tar - Brea (DyRsOfDh14 give a good reason)
Tar Baby - Residuos de brea? (i don't think of another name to say what is)
Tar Mother - Nucleo de brea? (madre de brea doesn't sound good, so well, it could be a good translation)
Trapdoor - Trampilla
Wraithwing - Murcielagos, (is the animals that are like them, literally it would be volador furioso or some as that and it's long)

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04-21-2012 at 12:01 PM
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DyRsOfDh14
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I always called them murciélagos despite that they aren't. But if they aren't murciélagos (bats), I think we should translate it to what it is. I think the best would be "Espectro Alado" (Winged Spectrum) for the full name and just "Espectro" when mentioned in-game.
Eighth means Octavo, if it was Los Ocho we would be talking about multiple things.
I don't like the sound of "Ojo Malvado", but leaving them just as "Ojos" would be ok.
"Baby" should be translated as "bebé" as it's a living being, and I think "Madre Brea" sounds better...
04-21-2012 at 12:15 PM
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Suwako
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Oh, I made some things wrongs, thanks to say it :D .

Forgot that wraith also means espectro and not only specter, so to be exactly espectro is a better option
I said that of the tar because "madre de brea" and "bebe de brea" sounds bad to me, but if is as you say, "madre brea" and also "bebe brea", then it has a nice name and sounds better.
Finally, if eighth means octavo then your translation it's better.

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04-21-2012 at 12:30 PM
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skell
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I have set-up a MoPad (Mozzila's Etherpad, a multiplayer text-editor which allows people to edit a document at the same time) for FDROD translations. If you haven't got a PM from me yet, ping me.

My choice for Etherpad was done because I have used it before and really liked its capabilities. The English texts are not yet ready, but I am tirelessly working on it (they will still have to be proofreaded at least once before I can give you them). This means that in a few days you should be able to start translating :).

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04-21-2012 at 01:08 PM
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skell
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One more thing, regarding French translation. It turns out that Damien is a professional translator and thus I'd like him to do the translation (which would have an additional benefit for him to add it to his CV if he wishes to). Sorry Syntax and Emojk, though I guess, if you wish to, you can look at the text later.

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04-21-2012 at 01:44 PM
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Damien
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Yes, as was said earlier here, translation IS a skill in itself, but proofreading a translation to detect if it sounds natural or not only requires you to be a native speaker (and dedication, and concentration, and enough literacy, and...). And that I do need, because reading your own work is like looking at a picture with your eyes stuck to it, not very efficient.

So Syntax and Emojk, if you're still up for it, I'll still need your help !

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04-21-2012 at 01:55 PM
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Znirk
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Thanks, Grizzly. I'll certainly keep these in mind, and have in fact made a working copy of your post over in skell's translation workspace.

How do you like "Absteiger" for "delver"? It's not openly offensive, but might plausibly be disliked by the smitemasters.

I was kind of hoping to name the wraithwings "Grottenmotten" :)

For evil eyes I'd like to find something snappy that combines "Starre" (rigor, rigidity) with "starren" (to stare). Any thoughts?

"Feste" for "Hold" is very good, though I'm not sure it appears in the text of KDD. Still, it can't hurt to think about the wider context.
04-21-2012 at 02:27 PM
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The Architest
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Pekka wrote:
Perhaps we should avoid invented names for common words with real-world equivalents, such as serpent or spider. There might be some places in the dialogue and flavor texts where, for example, Beethro could call a serpent a slither-bag (this was in Architect's Edition, unless I remember wrong), and we could invent something equivalent for those situations. But in the game itself I'd prefer using just käärme for a serpent, because even though it is really big and red, that is what it is :)

Yeah, might be better to use the real ones. :blush I just had this thought, that plain käärme wasn't so grand as serpent. But yeah, let's see what we can do later when skell gets the MoPad ready.
04-21-2012 at 02:49 PM
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Grizzly
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For the German part:

Yes - "Absteiger" (= descending person) for delver sounds nice. I like it, because it has that second meaning of a person who is on a downward trend in terms of life/success. :)

"Grottenmotten" sounds like the wrong animal and also suggests that they may only live in caves. Although there for example exists a wraithwing swamp somewhere in Akandia. I like my suggestion more.

Combining "Starre" and "starren" as in "starrer Starrer" might work, but could be a bit difficult to understand. I suggest "Starrendes Auge" which should be at least better than "Böses Auge".
04-21-2012 at 04:23 PM
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Pekka
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Here is my current list of translations I prefer for the DROD terms in Finnish. I built the list on Architest's suggestions with some changes. I am open to other choices, of course. We still need to see them used in practice to be sure they fit well.

I made use of synonym lists in both English and Finnish to look for related words that hopefully carry some of the original's meaning. It's often hard (or even impossible) to find an equivalent for one word in a language and these are just best I could do on a short notice. I'm sure we'll have other ideas while working on the whole translation with Architest.

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04-21-2012 at 05:25 PM
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Damien
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Pekka wrote: We still need to see them used in practice to be sure they fit well.
I assumed we would get a beta version. Is it the case ? Because we would indeed need to see things in context to deliver something good.

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04-21-2012 at 05:56 PM
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Neather2
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vittro wrote:
I can do Italian, and I'm pretty sure that Neather2 would be happy to cooperate :)

That's right, I would. :P

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04-21-2012 at 05:59 PM
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skell
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Damien wrote:
Pekka wrote: We still need to see them used in practice to be sure they fit well.
I assumed we would get a beta version. Is it the case ? Because we would indeed need to see things in context to deliver something good.
Yep, that was my assumption. You will join the beta-testers bandwagon ;).

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04-21-2012 at 05:59 PM
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Neather2
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vittro wrote:
Beethro Budkin
Brain: Cervello
Dugan
Eighth: L'Ottavo
Evil Eye: Occhio malvagio
Force Arrow: Freccia-forza (best I could come up with)
Hold: Tenuta/Dominio
Orb: Sfera (literally sphere)
Roach: Blatta
Roach Queen: Blatta regina
Serpent: Serpente
Spider: Ragno
Tar: Melma
Tar Baby: Piccolo di melma
Tar Mother: Melma madre
Trapdoor: Botola
Wraithwing: Pipistrello

The following is the best I can come up with in Italian, I won't write those I agree with vittro:

Force Arrow: Freccia direzionale or Segno di direzionalità restrittiva
Tar: Catrame
Tar Baby: Mostro catramoso (Which is literally monster made up with tar in English)
Tar Mother: This would just sound too bad in Italian, I would explain it with something like "Il catrame, alimentato dai rimasugli di cibo lasciati nella prigione di Dugan, ha assunto la valenza di un vero e proprio essere mostruoso, per cui è capace di espandersi grazie a due occhi che ne rappresentano il nucleo d'intelligenza", which means something like "Tar, fed with food scraps left in King Dugan's Dungeon, became a living monster (In fact, the original name is Living-tar) and it is able to expand itself with two eyes, that represent the smart part of the monster", in English.


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[Last edited by Neather2 at 04-21-2012 06:16 PM]
04-21-2012 at 06:14 PM
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Briareos
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Grizzly wrote:
Combining "Starre" and "starren" as in "starrer Starrer" might work, but could be a bit difficult to understand. I suggest "Starrendes Auge" which should be at least better than "Böses Auge".
How about "Bösauge" or "Starrauge"? I don't really like the idea of splitting that into two words; you yourself suggested "Schreckschwinge" and not "schreckliche Schwinge", after all... :)

Force Arrow = Schubpfeil / Bewegungspfeil / Kraftpfeil / Richtungspfeil / Zwangpfeil - I'm not sure what will work best.
"Einbahnpfeil"? ;) Otherwise "Richtungspfeil" gets my vote; "Zwangspfeil" just sounds wrong.

Master Door = Tür der Meister (?)
"Meistertür"? "Heldentür"? "Bezwingertür"?

Neather = I don't know .. - "Der Untere"?
"Unterweltler"? "Herr der Unterwelt" sounds a bit too bombastic IMHO...

np: DVA - Bare Fuzz (Pretty Ugly)

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04-21-2012 at 06:18 PM
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Damien
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Briareos wrote:
Master Door = Tür der Meister (?)
"Meistertür"? "Heldentür"? "Bezwingertür"?
Something like "Tür der Meister" is wrong, because that would be "the Master's door", if I'm not mistaken. Something akin to "Main door" would be preferable I think.

"Der Untere" seems nice. That one has to stay vague and not explain what it is actually referring to, to keep the mystery.

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04-21-2012 at 07:23 PM
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Krissan wrote:
I can help with a swedish version.
As can I.
04-21-2012 at 07:25 PM
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Jatopian
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Damien wrote:
Something akin to "Main door" would be preferable I think.
It's not called "master wall" because it's most important. It's called that because you can only cross it when you've mastered the hold - beaten all secrets and walked down the end stairs.

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04-21-2012 at 07:40 PM
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Damien
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Jatopian wrote: It's not called "master wall" because it's most important. It's called that because you can only cross it when you've mastered the hold - beaten all secrets and walked down the end stairs.
Very good point.

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04-21-2012 at 08:20 PM
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Syntax
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Tahnan wrote:
Syntax wrote:
Yeah since I understand that but if you used a translation for Roach Queen (say) I'm afraid my vocabulary would not cover it.
Oh, come on, seriously? Your vocabulary covers "welchen" and "bewegt" and "Einfluss", and your knowledge of German grammar is good enough to know how that sentence fits together, but you don't know "Schabe" and wouldn't be able to look it up?

If this is the case, I think you're in the vast minority. Znirk's basic point is correct: the fact that someone refers to "Schlammkinder" is going to be far and away the least of their barriers to getting help here. And thinking from their perspective, I can't imagine playing a game in English in which I'm fighting a Schlammkind and a Wasserläufer and a Reinemachefrau. (Or, well, maybe, in a game that's trying to capture the inherently German setting of the original. But there's no inherently English-speaking setting in the Eighth.)

[Note to skell: feel free to quote anything I said.]
I'd be able to look it up, yes - but in any case I'm happy with translating monster names too having seen both sides of the argument.
04-21-2012 at 09:27 PM
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Syntax
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Damien wrote:
So Syntax and Emojk, if you're still up for it, I'll still need your help !
Absolutely agreed from my side - have let skell know I'm happy to assist :)
04-21-2012 at 09:35 PM
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Damien
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Syntax wrote:
Absolutely agreed from my side - have let skell know I'm happy to assist :)
I'll be in touch with you.

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04-21-2012 at 10:31 PM
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Grizzly
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Briareos wrote:
How about "Bösauge" or "Starrauge"? I don't really like the idea of splitting that into two words; you yourself suggested "Schreckschwinge" and not "schreckliche Schwinge", after all... :)
Schreckschwinge is intentionally combined from two nouns ("Schreck" + "Schwinge"), to indicate that those animals are not only scary for others but also afraid of others. But because of the conjugation of adjectives in German, making up one combined word might really be better for consistent naming throughout the game. Maybe we could also use "Stierauge" instead of "Starrauge"? It's from "stieren" (= "starren"), but one could also associate it with an eye getting angry and rushing towards Beethro - like bulls do when they see a red cape.

Force Arrow = Schubpfeil / Bewegungspfeil / Kraftpfeil / Richtungspfeil / Zwangpfeil - I'm not sure what will work best.
"Einbahnpfeil"? ;) Otherwise "Richtungspfeil" gets my vote; "Zwangspfeil" just sounds wrong.
Because it's not really only one way but 5 out of 8 ways that are applicable on a force arrow, maybe "Richtungspfeil" is the way to go.

"Meistertür"? "Heldentür"? "Bezwingertür"?
I like "Bezwingertür". Because it indicates you "conquered" the hold.

Neather = I don't know .. - "Der Untere"?
"Unterweltler"? "Herr der Unterwelt" sounds a bit too bombastic IMHO...
Both proposals sound like "too far beneath" and one could associate it with the Greek Hades. See Damien's post:
Damien wrote:
"Der Untere" seems nice. That one has to stay vague and not explain what it is actually referring to, to keep the mystery.

04-22-2012 at 08:31 AM
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Damien
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What about credits, skell ? Will there be a list of everybody who participated in translations accessible in each version ? Are there any credits ? Why, etc.

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04-22-2012 at 09:48 AM
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skell
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Damien wrote:
What about credits, skell ? Will there be a list of everybody who participated in translations accessible in each version ? Are there any credits ? Why, etc.
Yes, there are credits both accessible from the title screen and in the game outro and everyone who participates and wants to be credited will be.

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04-22-2012 at 09:56 AM
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Pekka
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Is a Hold in DROD something that is necessarily underground? Would a fortress or a keep be an acceptable synonym for it, or would either lose some important facet of the term?

If you were to call a Hold a collection of something, what would that something be? A collection of levels? A collection of rooms? Or do you see it differently?

Just jog my imagination a bit, please.
04-22-2012 at 04:16 PM
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The Architest
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Pekka wrote:
If you were to call a Hold a collection of something, what would that something be? A collection of levels? A collection of rooms? Or do you see it differently?

I've always thought hold is a collection of rooms and levels. Rooms and levels are "hold" (held) together, at least I think so. Be it aboveground or underground. :)

So confusing. "Level sets" term in RPG would had been a lot of easier to translate, but not nearly as charming.

[Last edited by The Architest at 04-22-2012 04:40 PM]
04-22-2012 at 04:40 PM
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