Rabscuttle
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Yes, we are agreeing.

I think. :)

Timo006
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Rabscuttle wrote:
[goodies]Hey, when did the screenshot change? Tiles weren't there before!

I'm reasonaby sure that the GA2 characters will be actual 'Characters' and the pictures in the threads are custom avatars.

F could be for flow, but I can't see how it could be characterised.
[/goodies]

[goodies]If I see the length of the marked out word, I don't think F could be Flow.[/goodies]

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Tim
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[goodies]For those people who don't want to read the whole thread, Doom, me and eytanz discussed what we think the letters CFG stood for in page 2 of this thread...

Eytanz actually said we should rethink about "Citizen 3", and now it's in there

I wouldn't be surprised if we got the F and G correctly...[/goodies]

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eytanz
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Tim wrote:
[goodies]For those people who don't want to read the whole thread, Doom, me and eytanz discussed what we think the letters CFG stood for in page 2 of this thread...

Eytanz actually said we should rethink about "Citizen 3", and now it's in there

I wouldn't be surprised if we got the F and G correctly...[/goodies]

[goodies]I stand by what I wrote. Or, more accurately, what I wrote was 100% accurate for the time it was written in.[/goodies]

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Ezlo
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[goodies] I just thought of an AWESOME idea you can do with custom characters! Now let's pretend you wanted to have, let's say a boat, in your custom quest, there's a way you can add that using characters! The walkable areas of the boat can be taken care of using custom flooring, and the walls of the boat can be made using custom characters! Just make a character with 8 tiles of the boat and place it where needed and turn invincibility on! Instant boat! Think of the possibilities you can go from there! You can make a river, or a windmill, or mountains, or a space shuttle! I'm going to start drawing custom stuff right away! [/goodies]

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Jason
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[goodies] What I was thinking of before was remember when people wanted an escalator of something that objecs moved on, want you could do is just make a NPC look like an object and have it walk somewhere! [/goodies]

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coppro
Level: Smitemaster
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[goodies]You ain't seen nothin' yet! I made a working versions of the Battleships logic puzzle in JtRH with a slight style modification.

Yes, mrimer, this is why[/goodies]

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[Last edited by coppro at 10-29-2006 09:09 PM]

NiroZ
Level: Smitemaster
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[goodies]
I really hope I don't have to use custom characters as walls. Being able to make custom walls would be way better[/goodies]

Niccus
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[goodies]Those shadows, those cursed shadows...
On that note, I still can't wait for multiple custom floor arts. I can't remember, are they in or out?[/goodies]

Zaratustra00
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Elfstone
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Niccus wrote:
[goodies]Those shadows, those cursed shadows...
On that note, I still can't wait for multiple custom floor arts. I can't remember, are they in or out?[/goodies]

Not sure that I understand that, but it seems to imply that
[goodies] instead of just using one photograph, as I did several times in my hold 'Seasons', we will be able to use several photographs in one room. Am I right? That would be excellent. I remember trying to use more than one photo and feeling a bit frustrated/cheated because I couldn't. Mind you, I have no idea what is required of the software for that to be possible, but it does seem like a wonderful idea.[/goodies]

Elfstone.

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eytanz
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You're understanding correctly.

I don't see any reason to hide this discussion as it has nothing to do with the bar. Basically, a feature request was made for multiple images in a room. IMO, It's pretty redundant, since you can achieve the same effect by just making one big image using photoshop or GIMP or even Paint that includes all the smaller images you want to use properly placed.

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Tahnan
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eytanz wrote:
You're understanding correctly.

I don't see any reason to hide this discussion as it has nothing to do with the bar. Basically, a feature request was made for multiple images in a room. IMO, It's pretty redundant, since you can achieve the same effect by just making one big image using photoshop or GIMP or even Paint that includes all the smaller images you want to use properly placed.

Unless you want Image A in a small area in the upper left of a room, Image B in a small area in the lower left and the lower right of a room, and the standard DROD floor tiles elsewhere in the room. In which case you'd have to include the DROD floor tiles in your big image, which is (a) a pain in the patookie and (b) not especially allowed.

Doom
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Tahnan wrote:

eytanz wrote:
You're understanding correctly.

I don't see any reason to hide this discussion as it has nothing to do with the bar. Basically, a feature request was made for multiple images in a room. IMO, It's pretty redundant, since you can achieve the same effect by just making one big image using photoshop or GIMP or even Paint that includes all the smaller images you want to use properly placed.

Unless you want Image A in a small area in the upper left of a room, Image B in a small area in the lower left and the lower right of a room, and the standard DROD floor tiles elsewhere in the room. In which case you'd have to include the DROD floor tiles in your big image, which is (a) a pain in the patookie and (b) not especially allowed.

You only need to place image floor in the spots where you want special flooring. Everything else in the image can be white. (You'll also get smaller file size when you don't draw any nice pictures in the invisible area)

eytanz
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Tahnan wrote:

eytanz wrote:
You're understanding correctly.

I don't see any reason to hide this discussion as it has nothing to do with the bar. Basically, a feature request was made for multiple images in a room. IMO, It's pretty redundant, since you can achieve the same effect by just making one big image using photoshop or GIMP or even Paint that includes all the smaller images you want to use properly placed.

Unless you want Image A in a small area in the upper left of a room, Image B in a small area in the lower left and the lower right of a room, and the standard DROD floor tiles elsewhere in the room. In which case you'd have to include the DROD floor tiles in your big image, which is (a) a pain in the patookie and (b) not especially allowed.

There's no reason to place image tiles on the squares you don't want an image to show up in; and there's no problem with displaying non-continuous parts of an image. So your objection is groundless.

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AlefBet
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eytanz wrote:
There's no reason to place image tiles on the squares you don't want an image to show up in; and there's no problem with displaying non-continuous parts of an image. So your objection is groundless.

Technically, there is, if you want to avoid the [gray] border around image floors. The only way to avoid that is to use image floor completely and everywhere in that room. However, allowing more than one image to be used in a room would be no help for this.

Tahnan wrote:
Unless you want Image A in a small area in the upper left of a room, Image B in a small area in the lower left and the lower right of a room, and the standard DROD floor tiles elsewhere in the room.

As Eytan and Doom have already mentioned, there's nothing that you can do with two room images that you can't do with one bigger one. Here's another trick for you: if this small area in the corners is one, two, four, or eight tiles high, you can actually put the vertical images right next to each other, one above the other, and take advantage of tiling to hit the corners properly. If not, you can pad them out to the next bigger power of two in height. With regard to width, as long as together they are not wider than 19, you can pad them into a 19-wide image and again take advantage of tiling. (And if they're each 1-wide, you can put them right next to each other.)

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++Adam H. Peterson

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[Last edited by mrimer at 11-01-2006 09:48 PM]

Tahnan
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Doom wrote:
You only need to place image floor in the spots where you want special flooring.

Oh! I think I see. (I've only used custom images once in a hold, so.) I had expected that, if you have an image, it would appear in each place you select "custom floor image", with the upper left corner of the image aligned to the upper left corner of the floor area. But I gather it's more like taking an entire picture, laying it under the floor of the room, and then "custom floor image" basically cuts a hole in the floor.

In that case, yes, never mind. :-)

trick
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
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AlefBet wrote:
As Eytan and Doom have already mentioned, there's nothing that you can do with two room images that you can't do with one bigger one.

Actually, there is. You can save space.

Let's say you want most of a room tiled with a small repeating custom pattern except for a few squares where you want a different custom image. If you're limited to one image per room, you have to have one large image in stead of two small ones. Now let's say you want to do this for every room in the hold, but the different-looking squares are in different positions in each room (but otherwise identical). Now you have to have one large image for every room in the hold. If you could have multiple images per room, you could have shared the small repeating pattern and the different pattern between all the rooms.

~ Gerry

AlefBet
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trick wrote:

AlefBet wrote:
As Eytan and Doom have already mentioned, there's nothing that you can do with two room images that you can't do with one bigger one.

Actually, there is. You can save space.

I almost never include space-saving considerations in my evaluation of what feature would make what possible unless the difference is overwhelming or the usage scenario is compelling.

Let's say you want most of a room tiled with a small repeating custom pattern except for a few squares where you want a different custom image.

In my opinion, this type of thing should be handled with custom level themes (in concert with custom floor).

____________________________
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++Adam H. Peterson

Ezlo
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Yeah, but for a custom theme you have to make your own everything. What if you want Caravel Walls and Objects to go along with your floor. I think you should be allowed to have multiple custom floors because it would save time, more than anything.

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trick
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AlefBet wrote:
I almost never include space-saving considerations in my evaluation of what feature would make what possible unless the difference is overwhelming or the usage scenario is compelling.

I admit the example was a tad contrived, but it was just meant to illustrate the point. In any case, this would result in smaller holds, which is nice for dial-up users, and also lower RAM usage by DROD when playing the hold, which might mean higher performance. One uncompressed room-sized image can take around 2.2 mb (32 bpp), and DROD doesn't decompress images on the fly (or didn't last time I checked), so they'll all be loaded at once if there's more.

In my opinion, this type of thing should be handled with custom level themes (in concert with custom floor).

Good point . I still think multiple custom images per room would be a good thing, though.

~ Gerry

mrimer
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trick wrote:

AlefBet wrote:
I almost never include space-saving considerations in my evaluation of what feature would make what possible unless the difference is overwhelming or the usage scenario is compelling.

I admit the example was a tad contrived, but it was just meant to illustrate the point. In any case, this would result in smaller holds, which is nice for dial-up users, and also lower RAM usage by DROD when playing the hold, which might mean higher performance. One uncompressed room-sized image can take around 2.2 mb (32 bpp), and DROD doesn't decompress images on the fly (or didn't last time I checked), so they'll all be loaded at once if there's more.

I'm not sure what you mean regarding compression here, but DROD recognizes use of JPGs and PNGs for custom room images. A high-detail image at decent JPG quality filling an entire room area takes up <100kB.

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coppro
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Ezlo wrote:
Yeah, but for a custom theme you have to make your own everything. What if you want Caravel Walls and Objects to go along with your floor. I think you should be allowed to have multiple custom floors because it would save time, more than anything.

I suspect that, with 99% certainty, you can do this in The City Beneath.

Oh, and read up on style-modding. You can mod only part of the style.

eytanz
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coppro wrote:

Ezlo wrote:
Yeah, but for a custom theme you have to make your own everything. What if you want Caravel Walls and Objects to go along with your floor. I think you should be allowed to have multiple custom floors because it would save time, more than anything.

I suspect that, with 99% certainty, you can do this in The City Beneath.

What is "this" in that sentence? Custom themes? Or multiple custom floors?

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coppro
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eytanz wrote:

coppro wrote:

Ezlo wrote:
Yeah, but for a custom theme you have to make your own everything. What if you want Caravel Walls and Objects to go along with your floor. I think you should be allowed to have multiple custom floors because it would save time, more than anything.

I suspect that, with 99% certainty, you can do this in The City Beneath.

What is "this" in that sentence? Custom themes? Or multiple custom floors?

What he wants, that is, instead of Style1Floor.png, MyStyleFloor.png.

trick
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mrimer wrote:
I'm not sure what you mean regarding compression here, but DROD recognizes use of JPGs and PNGs for custom room images. A high-detail image at decent JPG quality filling an entire room area takes up <100kB.

I know DROD stores images in their original compressed formats in the hold files and in the database, but I was talking about what happens when DROD wants to use the images. It has to decompress them first. However, I did some testing and found out that this is only a problem in the editor (adding a new image eats additional megabytes of RAM for each image!), and not while playing the game (entering a room with a full-screen custom image does eat ~2 mb, but images aren't cached like I for some reason thought they were (kinda stupid now that I think about it), so this goes away when you enter an image-less room). So, er, never mind about the RAM usage . (Well, except in the editor..)

Anyway, another plus of multiple custom images per room that I didn't mention above is convenience, or ease of use. If an architect wants to move two custom images in a room relative to each other, he/she currently has to switch to an image editor, change the image there and save it, switch back to DROD, import and assign the new image, and delete the old one. Moving things around (maybe just to see how they would look) becomes a hassle.

With that, I think I'm out of arguments, so I'll shut up now

~ Gerry

Ezlo
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[goodies] I've got an idea! To boost up the content that's in a Smitemaster Selection, Erik can add a few custom portraits or character sprites to each of them that you can use in your holds! I know I love Erik's artwork and don't think that anything I can make could be better. [/goodies]

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Timo006
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[goodies] That is indeed an incredible idea!! and if that would happen, we could request more images of custom images for TCB.[/goodies]

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Jatopian
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Yay! I solved it! I don't even want to know how many did before me...
[goodies]Is this tag right?
And, can someone tell me where the red herrings are? I've found one of them and the real image[/goodies]

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NiroZ
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Jatopian wrote:
Yay! I solved it! I don't even want to know how many did before me...
[goodies]Is this tag right?
And, can someone tell me where the red herrings are? I've found one of them and the real image[/goodie]

kinda silly question your asking there, the people who can see it can't know, and vice versa.
.

As for the 75 image, you don't need to discuss that in goodie tags.

I'll pm ya the the url for both red herrings.