Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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File: The Level Beneath.hold (604.7 KB)
Downloaded 114 times.
License: Public Domain

This is my first attempt at making a hold for DROD.

I would welcome any feedback relating to the difficulty (I aimed for a mixture but I can't tell how hard other people will find this) and to any unintended solutions etc. or just ideas as to how it could be improved.

At the moment there is only one level but if I get positive feedback then I may consider making more.

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

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[Last edited by Andy101 at 09-14-2006 12:37 AM]

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1645
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Excellent hold, but it'll totally require someone smarter than me to finish it, I see.

Sergenth
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 296
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Typo -- In 1S: 1W, Beethro says "Wow, a serpant"

I'm a mediocre analyst, so the first room is wonderful! I had to play it a couple of times, but it was worth it.

Once you get outside in the 8 rooms that ring the first one, it's a different story. My brain is reeling by the sheer combination of elements, and I'm not even sure if I'm on a "right" path after killing that serpent.

In 1W:

Also, you gotta tell us a little (not a complete description) about the idea behind the pathing and being able to exit rooms before they are finished. I don't know if I'm breaking rooms, or doing what I'm "supposed" to.

I'll let you know if I get myself stuck.

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[Last edited by Sergenth at 10-24-2005 02:57 AM]

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

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I'm stuck on that one room...

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3226
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Nice puzzles, but with one bad thing. Rooms that will become impossible to pass if you mess things up in the beginning.

I just made my way to 1S1W SE-entrance, but had to restart all the way to 1S1E SW-entrance, because of the obvious thing. Well, at least I know already how to beat all rooms beyond that.

More in-depth comments coming after I beat rest the hold.

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

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Room comments:

I had mostly fun with the few rooms, although the blue door didn't ever open.

1S: Nice 'efficiency' puzzle. Especially because of the scroll

1S1W: As I said, I was too stupid to plan ahead and had to play half of the level twice. I don't know if others will appreciate that kind of puzzles, but I don't really like them. Pretty straightforward room otherwise.

1W: Apparently trivial solution:
You can use the decoy near the NE corner to blow the bomb at the bottom and complete the room from the SW entrance. It seems to me that it should've been done from the SE...

1E: Kind of neat puzzle, but the room design makes it somewhat obvious. Again, it's possible to clear the room on the first time through it. Does the orb near the top have a purpose?

1S1E: I didn't get the serpent/mimic thing. How am I supposed to save him? (Referring to speech in 1S1E)

1S2E: I didn't get the point of this room either. It's just one boring tar maze. Enough about that...

2S1E: Tricky room, but leading the mimic through the trapdoors requires too much trial and error IMO. The decoy placement wasn't too easy either, but at least there was a logical solution to it.

2S: Pheow! Fortunately I planned ahead this time. Slightly trivial solution to the first part: You don't have to be quick. Just leave one goblin behind. I liked the wraithwing trick in the second part too.

Question: Should there be a room at 1S2W? There's an obvious place for a couple of missing tunnels in 1S1W.

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
IP: Logged

Thanks for all the feedback everyone.

Doom wrote:
Room comments:

1S1W: As I said, I was too stupid to plan ahead and had to play half of the level twice. I don't know if others will appreciate that kind of puzzles, but I don't really like them. Pretty straightforward room otherwise.

I will try and make it more obvious that this should be completed first time round.

1W: Apparently trivial solution:
You can use the decoy near the NE corner to blow the bomb at the bottom and complete the room from the SW entrance. It seems to me that it should've been done from the SE...

fixed

1E: Kind of neat puzzle, but the room design makes it somewhat obvious. Again, it's possible to clear the room on the first time through it. Does the orb near the top have a purpose?

orb now removed

1S1E: I didn't get the serpent/mimic thing. How am I supposed to save him? (Referring to speech in 1S1E)

He can be saved, try harder

1S2E: I didn't get the point of this room either. It's just one boring tar maze. Enough about that...

Perhaps if you had saved someone earlier then he might have helped you through this maze.

2S: Pheow! Fortunately I planned ahead this time. Slightly trivial solution to the first part: You don't have to be quick. Just leave one goblin behind. I liked the wraithwing trick in the second part too.

Not sure how to fix this trivial solution

Question: Should there be a room at 1S2W? There's an obvious place for a couple of missing tunnels in 1S1W.

This should be added soon

Other coments; blue door will now drop, room behind master door however is not yet completed

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
IP: Logged

Sergenth wrote:
Typo -- In 1S: 1W, Beethro says "Wow, a serpant"

fixed

Once you get outside in the 8 rooms that ring the first one, it's a different story. My brain is reeling by the sheer combination of elements, and I'm not even sure if I'm on a "right" path after killing that serpent.

The rooms form a spiral and not all need to be completed first time around, I nicked this idea from Jacob

In 1W:

Click here to view the secret text

× I like that the player can make a choice in how to deal with the mud, depending on which entrance they come in... if that's how I'm seeing it -- I haven't tried to get to the Master Door yet, but that must be the way

I made a mistake here, it should only be completeable when accessed from the SW, there's nothing behind that master door, but I'm working on something to go there and for a secret room

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3226
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Andy101 wrote:

Doom wrote:
1S1E: I didn't get the serpent/mimic thing. How am I supposed to save him? (Referring to speech in 1S1E)

He can be saved, try harder

Oh, I get it now.

1S2E: I didn't get the point of this room either. It's just one boring tar maze. Enough about that...

Perhaps if you had saved someone earlier then he might have helped you through this maze.

Okay, understood that. But transparent tar makes it just as easy.

2S: Pheow! Fortunately I planned ahead this time. Slightly trivial solution to the first part: You don't have to be quick. Just leave one goblin behind. I liked the wraithwing trick in the second part too.

Not sure how to fix this trivial solution

I have an idea that might work. I'll check it out later, but now I'll have to leave to school.

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[Last edited by Doom at 10-24-2005 09:26 AM]

Banjooie
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1645
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Did I mention I despise 2S1W? Because I do. And not in a good way.

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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Banjooie wrote:
Did I mention I despise 2S1W? Because I do. And not in a good way.

How can you hate the wraithwings, they've got great personalities when you get to know them

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

Doom
Level: Smitemaster

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File: Goblin Room.hold (1 KB)
Downloaded 58 times.
License: Public Domain

Here's one way to fix the trivial solution in 2S. (see the attached hold)

And don't bother looking if you've not played through 2S of "Quest" yet. It's possible that you might just spoil the fun of playing it.

If you decide to do something like this, make sure that you can't lead any goblins behind a wall where they won't follow you into the passage. Remember to adjust the timer too if you make any critical changes

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[Last edited by Doom at 10-24-2005 04:02 PM]

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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Thats a great little room, thanks. I'll try and make something a bit like that for 2s.

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
IP: Logged

Various fixes now made;

2S, hopefully fixed trivial solution

Added extra scripting and various alterations to tiles used to try and make it clear which way you are going in each room

Added secret room and room behind master door


____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

larrymurk
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1911
Registered: 12-09-2004
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It's always nice to see people putting effort into making fun/good holds.

From what I've seen, I really enjoy your scripting/story. It really does help me feel more involved which is fun.

1S- Good room. I'd say this was reasonably difficult as I had to play through it several times to figure out what order to do everything. This is "good hard" because with time and thinking people should be able to solve it.

1S3W- Great idea, great fun. I happened to get fairly lucky and beat it fairly easily, but I'd recommend adding save pts.

2S1W- I'm not a pro w/ WWs, so passing through this room the first time was a bit painful.

1S1W- Entering from the SW all I had to do was hit the orb and light the fuse to conquer the room. I assume this is an unintended solution?

2W-
I don't think you can do anything entering from the SW so I tried to backtrack. No luck. I couldn't back track through 1S1W because of the tunnels.
Major problem?


OOPS- I take that back. I see that the orb in the SW also opens the Eastern door.

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[Last edited by larrymurk at 10-25-2005 01:17 AM]

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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larrymurk wrote:
1S1W- Entering from the SW all I had to do was hit the orb and light the fuse to conquer the room. I assume this is an unintended solution?

It is unintended in so far as the hold becomes impossible later on if you beat the room first time round. I have tried adding some scripting to make this more obvious but I obviously need to do more to make it clearer.

Also 2w is not beatable first time round, just try to get out the other side alive, I've added scripting to clarify this.

Edit:

I have now changed to scripting + added a scroll in 1s1w to warn you not to kill the snake.

Check points now added in secret room

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

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[Last edited by Andy101 at 10-25-2005 09:11 AM]

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
IP: Logged

Bump.

I've finally got round to giving this hold a major update with a view to actually uploading it to the holds board. I would be grateful for some comments on the updated version (attached to first post).

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster

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Couldn't be good to make it Anyone Edit? Because i can't pass through 1S.

____________________________
I make Let's Plays too!
Click here to find out my LPs' progress, and find out what I plan to tackle next!

Currently playing:


My Holds:
-Completed:

-Work in Progress:

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
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I remember the first time I tried this hold, I could only beat 1S and the secret close by. Nothing has changed. How do I get the guard to cooperate with clearing the mud in 1S1W? Assuming that's what I need to do.

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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Jeff_Ray: For the time being I'd prefer not to make it anyone edit as the order in which the rooms are played is very important.

bandit1200: You do need to get the guard to cooperate. You need to make it above the tar and you want the guard below it, in order to do this you need to make sure that there is a big enough gap between you and the guard when you reach the tar.

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
Registered: 10-29-2003
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Andy101 wroteit1200: You do need to get the guard to cooperate. You need to make it above the tar and you want the guard below it, in order to do this you need to make sure that there is a big enough gap between you and the guard when you reach the tar.

And therein lies my problem. It seems I need to use the guard to get by the eyes, (or is that where I am going wrong?), and I can't put any distance between the guard and Beethro after that.

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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You want to try and create a larger enough distance before you kill the eyes.


____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

kie
Level: Master Delver

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Registered: 02-26-2005
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bandit1200 wrote:

Andy101 wroteit1200:

Was that intentional? Either way, it's the funniest thing I've seen in ages. You have now been rebaptised, it1200

____________________________
cheers, kie

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
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Andy101 wrote:
You want to try and create a larger enough distance before you kill the eyes.

Click here to view the secret text

×Turn to face south as soon as possible, then kill the eyes facing this direction.

I don't have JtRH in front of me, but I can see perfectly that extra square that I knew must be there for a reason but couldn't figure out why. [bandit kicks himself in the pants]

bandit1200
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 290
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kie wrote:

bandit1200 wrote:

Andy101 wroteit1200:

Was that intentional? Either way, it's the funniest thing I've seen in ages. You have now been rebaptised, it1200

I didn't notice, but it's rather apt as I've been chatting about bands for the last 4 hours.

Ezlo
Level: Smitemaster

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File: TLB Spiraling Outwards 1S1W.demo (749 bytes)
Downloaded 44 times.
License: Public Domain

I need help, this is the best I can do in 1s1w. I have a feeling that the weird trapdoor that I don't drop has something to do with it, but I don't know what to do to make it work.

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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Ezlo wrote:
I need help, this is the best I can do in 1s1w. I have a feeling that the weird trapdoor that I don't drop has something to do with it, but I don't know what to do to make it work.

You're very nearly there. The way I do it is to get to (9,20) with the sword facing south and the guard on (10,22) with his sword facing south west. That should give you enough time to get above the tar.

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

Ezlo
Level: Smitemaster

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Andy101 wrote:
The way I do it is to get to (9,20) with the sword facing south and the guard on (10,22) with his sword facing south west. That should give you enough time to get above the tar.

How do you get his sword south west?

Andy101
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 222
Registered: 07-22-2005
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Ezlo wrote:

Andy101 wrote:
The way I do it is to get to (9,20) with the sword facing south and the guard on (10,22) with his sword facing south west. That should give you enough time to get above the tar.

How do you get his sword south west?

Sorry, my mistake, that should be north west.

____________________________
"True perfection has to be imperfect"

Ezlo
Level: Smitemaster

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Okay then, I still seem to be one move behind. I'll keep trying.