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Caravel Forum : DROD Boards : Architecture : Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (A short challenge hold)
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Dragon Fogel
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File: SMS Secret Mischievous Sanctum 1S - not quite.demo (28.6 KB)
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License: Public Domain
icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
So here's my failed demo. You can probably see what I'm trying:

Click here to view the secret text


Thoughts on 1N1E hints:

Click here to view the secret text

02-26-2025 at 03:45 AM
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Dragon Fogel
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File: SMS Secret Mischievous Sanctum 1S - another miss.demo (28.6 KB)
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
Trying another approach to 1S. This did not work either, but it gave me a vague idea for something that would:

Click here to view the secret text


I don't see a way to pull that off, but it's an idea that would work if I could do it.
02-28-2025 at 04:33 AM
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LovaP48
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
Alright, I'm back!
The deadlines have been met and I'm now breathing easier, so DROD architecture is back on the menu :)

@Fogel: Both of your approaches for 1S are way away from my intentions. I won't say they are impossible, but they sure look so :D
Earlier on, in one of your first comments you said "but I'm guessing the idea is not to drop the highlighted trapdoors?", which is in fact false and I should have flagged it for you immediately.

The idea there was to have those trapdoors be the ones your first pass drops.
So I ask, should I make the highlight a different colour to signal this? Or replace the trapdoors with pit and add some kind of a one-time-tunnel passage to the other side?
What do you think would help in this regard?

It might take me a while to regain my footing here with where the needed upgrades are, bear with me. (But hopefully by the time I get a useful tip for this, I'd have managed to progress.)
03-14-2025 at 07:31 PM
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Dragon Fogel
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
Wait, I was just supposed to drop those first? And here I thought this was a secret because you were asking for something extremely nonsensical but nonetheless possible. That approach sounds pretty similar to what I did in the original room. I should be able to get a successful demo soon in that case.

Removing the trapdoors and forcing a one-way trip through some other mechanism for the first pass is probably the simplest way. But it was really only an issue because the dialogue hasn't been written yet.
03-14-2025 at 08:53 PM
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LovaP48
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
Dragon Fogel wrote:
Wait, I was just supposed to drop those first? And here I thought this was a secret because you were asking for something extremely nonsensical but nonetheless possible.
No. Damn, sorry for making you do silly things :blush
Dragon Fogel wrote:
That approach sounds pretty similar to what I did in the original room. I should be able to get a successful demo soon in that case.
Great to hear so!
The challenge of this room is mostly done by the removal of two of the diagonals, which was the intention, not some insane tarstuff baby blockade :D
Although I do admit, if there IS a solution like that, hats off to the one who can do it.
Dragon Fogel wrote:
Removing the trapdoors and forcing a one-way trip through some other mechanism for the first pass is probably the simplest way. But it was really only an issue because the dialogue hasn't been written yet.
I'm still thinking about other enforcement mechanisms and whether to guide the player with some of those.
I guess I'll see what your solution is first.
03-14-2025 at 09:04 PM
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Dragon Fogel
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File: SMS Secret Mischievous Sanctum 1S Victory.demo (30.3 KB)
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License: Public Domain
icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
Got it. There were some tricks in the way I did it that I wasn't quite expecting, but it was satisfying to work out.

I suppose the way I was attempting it before really fit the "misunderstood" part of the title.
03-14-2025 at 11:14 PM
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LovaP48
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
Dragon Fogel wrote:
Got it. There were some tricks in the way I did it that I wasn't quite expecting, but it was satisfying to work out.
Good job!
Unfortunately, since you had the older version, your pickaxe->caber switch done on the edge of the trapdoors didn't go through and so the demo is corrupted on my end. Oh well.
But I can see where it was going and from that point it's routine to finish.
One thing I didn't expect nor account for is to
Click here to view the secret text

Dragon Fogel wrote:
I suppose the way I was attempting it before really fit the "misunderstood" part of the title.
Uh oh :D Let's not push the misunderstandings even further!

I hope that I can put the next version out during this weekend with some reworked hints and hopefully some accompanying text for 1S too.
03-14-2025 at 11:32 PM
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LovaP48
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (+1)  
I am not playing too much tDoKH, you are playing too much tDoKH! O:-

Ahem, anyway, today I revisited this level, played through it, implementing both an introduction to 1S, as well as tweaking the hints to 3E and 1N1E.
With this, I believe all the rooms are finished - but I'd appreciate a lot if someone other than Dragon Fogel looked into this and gave some feedback, especially whether the hints are at all helpful.

After that's done, it's "just" the voice acting that is left to do.
west.logan confirmed to me that he'll voice the few Beethro lines and today Nuntar volunteered to voice the archivist note - thank you to both of them.
I too need to record a bunch more of the hint lines and so on, but I'd prefer to first have some of the feedback about the hints.

Many thanks to anyone who wants to push this to the finish line.
(The file in the root post has been updated just now.)
07-05-2025 at 08:56 PM
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Dragon Fogel
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (+1)  
Looked at the hints. 1S and 3E seem fine to me; the only change I'd consider is mentioning if a step isn't strictly necessary (for instance, that the mud isn't needed in 1S) but that's not a big issue. 1N1E's hints don't seem adequate.

More details:

Click here to view the secret text

07-07-2025 at 06:45 PM
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LovaP48
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (+1)  
Dragon Fogel wrote:
Looked at the hints. 1S and 3E seem fine to me; the only change I'd consider is mentioning if a step isn't strictly necessary (for instance, that the mud isn't needed in 1S) but that's not a big issue. 1N1E's hints don't seem adequate.

More details:

Click here to view the secret text
Thanks; I think I'm fairly happy with 3E hinting, I'll call it final unless someone comes in with an upgrade before I record these (that will likely happen towards the end of this week).

In terms of 1S, I made some minor tweaks, including the fact that mud isn't necessary.
Below is the current version I have in my text file:
Click here to view the secret text

For 1N1E, I'm not sure anymore what was in "the version before this one" unfortunately -- but I do agree it should say the below the trapdoor thing and I included it now.
For the challenge, it should hopefully say all the steps (at least of my route) though, I got rid of the whole "First-Third-Second" business.
Click here to view the secret text

Anyway, here's what the hints say currently, after rewriting them some:
Click here to view the secret text

07-07-2025 at 07:35 PM
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Dragon Fogel
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (0)  
Okay, after looking over my demo and rereading those, I think the hints are fine up to the sixth tap. More details behind the secret tag.

Click here to view the secret text

07-07-2025 at 10:10 PM
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LovaP48
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icon Re: Strategist's Misunderstood Subselection (+1)  
Okay, good to hear so!
Another attempt for the final hint:
Click here to view the secret text

In terms of this:
Dragon Fogel wrote:
Click here to view the secret text
I understand where you're coming from and it might be nice, but not dropping that trapdoor was part of the original room too, as far as I remember, so I won't include it in my hints for now.

If someone other than Dragon Fogel could mention their stance on this (and any other hints they might wish to review), I'd be very happy.
Anyone that takes up the challenge, do so sometime this week, please!
07-07-2025 at 10:52 PM
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