admin
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Rank Points: 8
IP: Logged

File: Paycheck.drh (4.7 KB)
Downloaded 1092 times.
License: Other
From: Unspecified

A quick hold (Probably about half an hour) for DROD: RPG. Not much story, no monsters that you have to fight, mostly based on doors.

Mikko
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 276
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

I guess this is a hold meant to be easy to complete but difficult to optimize.

I completed it without picking up a sword at any point and also didn't use the bomb for anything. Now I'll have to play through it again aiming for a good score.

skell
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3764
Registered: 12-28-2004
IP: Logged

Just lie Mikko said, fairly easy if played to just finish. Worse when you are

Honestly speaking this brings me to a question:


And by the way - Nice and enjoyable hold .


____________________________
My website

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[Last edited by skell at 09-21-2008 01:32 PM]

Tim
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1979
Registered: 08-07-2004
IP: Logged

skell wrote:

Click here to view the secret text

×But I can't get that wooden blade, as no matter what I tried, I am always missing twenty greckles. Any hints?

This might sound strange to you, but if you are having problems with specific rooms in the hold, the best you can do is to ask it in the H&S board, so that other people can look for it as well.

Edit: H&S pictures for this hold doesn't work yet.
Solved.

____________________________
The best way to lose customers is to let little kids running loose on a forum with too many mod points.

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[Last edited by Tim at 09-21-2008 07:32 PM]

Fafnir
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 315
Registered: 11-05-2004
IP: Logged

Definitely easy to beat, difficult to optimise. I think I see where the bomb's used, I just don't have enough money...

____________________________
Stupidity kills.
Absolute stupidity
Kills absolutely.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Paycheck showed up in HA just after I finished playing the demo version of Tendry's Tale, and was disappointed by the scarcity of puzzles. (This is not true of the full version of Tendry's Tale, which is full of many puzzles, all layered on top of each other.) But Paycheck was the first hold that showed me that the RPG game could have puzzles too. It's not very friendly towards new players though, and it took me a week as a new RPG player to struggle through it by sheer force of willpower. But I did finally manage to conquer the hold and visit all the secret rooms in the same savegame.

Just so everyone can pat themselves on the back for being better RPG players than the Rabbit, here's my final score:

And it seems that there are many ways to beat this hold. In my solution, I did not use:

Mechadragon
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 61
Registered: 10-30-2004
IP: Logged

Well, I got it beat without TOO much of a struggle, and now I'm going...secret rooms? Really, where? That score of 153 did look awfully low...

Yellow_Mage
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 267
Registered: 05-19-2004
IP: Logged

Can't even do the first level... is it me, or it's broke in the demo?

____________________________
"Sit and daydream, and watch the changing color of the waves that break upon the idle seashore of the mind." - Henry Wadsworth Longfellow

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

I played this hold in the demo. Please use the H&S board, if you need help.

Mikko
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 276
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

CuriousShyRabbit wrote:
Just so everyone can pat themselves on the back for being better RPG players than the Rabbit, here's my final score:

Click here to view the secret text

×1260

Everyone who has gone through the secret area should have the same attack and defence. I don't think it's possible to finish with extra health either, so having unused keys is the only way to get better scores. I've managed to save one yellow for an extra 10 points, but nothing more than that.

bwross
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 376
Registered: 04-17-2005
IP: Logged

Yellow_Mage wrote:
Can't even do the first level... is it me, or it's broke in the demo?

It's not broken. I'm thinking that you should read the help on the lock command... that's not required for the demo section (it is pointed out later in game, though). This hold involves a lot of thinking about locking doors as well as unlocking them.

skell
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 3764
Registered: 12-28-2004
IP: Logged

And so I have finally managed to get it to 100%. My awful score of 210 points is... Awful, indeed. But I am satisfied that I have managed to master it.
Because mastering it was quite... Really difficult.

____________________________
My website

Blondbeard
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1486
Registered: 03-31-2005
IP: Logged

I had a really good time trying to optimize this.

MeckMeck GRE
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 594
Registered: 01-03-2005
IP: Logged

Nice hold. I guess I did the worst solution possible with 142 points... Enjoyable hold all in all.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

It looks like Paycheck will become much easier when this bug fix (about closing doors destroying briar) becomes official.

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2340
Registered: 06-14-2005
IP: Logged

Can I change that room? I just need to move the briar one space over and one space down, so that it sits on top of the greckle door. It won't change any solutions.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Only Schik can update holds once they've hit the Holds board. It sounds like your change would fix the unintended solution, but I can't say whether your hold can be updated.

dart193
Level: Roachling
Rank Points: 13
Registered: 03-25-2008
IP: Logged

Wow! This hold is very interest! I love it. I was not sure about close door function, but now i see how interest it can be. Now i want to get through aumtliches room from ATK and DEF room to upper secret. I am not sure where i need to use... I told too much. But every room there is perfect. I like number of possible solutions.

And i reach 1200 and more points. I didnt understood how I did it.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Someone Else wrote:
Can I change that room? I just need to move the briar one space over and one space down, so that it sits on top of the greckle door. It won't change any solutions.

Yes, the HAs as a group agree that you should be allowed to make that change. Please only move the briar one square SW in Full Time Pay : The Entrance. Please do not make any other changes in the hold - we will be checking. You may attach the fixed hold to a post in this topic.

After that, it may be while before Paycheck is updated on CaravelNet, but at least it will be available here for people to play.

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2340
Registered: 06-14-2005
IP: Logged

File: Paycheck.drh (0 bytes)
Downloaded 49 times.
License: Public Domain

Okay, bad news. I can't for some reason put the briar on top of greckle doors. Therefore, I've moved it one over and put an ortho square where it was. I hope that is alright.

TFMurphy
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3118
Registered: 06-11-2007
IP: Logged

Someone Else wrote:
Okay, bad news. I can't for some reason put the briar on top of greckle doors. Therefore, I've moved it one over and put an ortho square where it was. I hope that is alright.

With that change, it'll be impossible to get back out once you get in to get the RBS if the Trapdoor Gate is up (which it will be).

I'd suggest moving the Greckle Gates both one square up, putting an Orthosquare where the briar was, and placing the briar between the greckle gates and the prizes. This way, it still costs 40 greckles to get in and out while the Trapdoor Gate is down, and 40 greckles to get in and out while the Trapdoor Gate is up. (It will mean that players won't be able to get the Greckle for "free" (after dealing with the briar, of course) by bumping it while standing on the nearby Greckle Gate, but getting that far and not picking up the RBS wasn't exactly a spectacularly good move anyways)

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[Last edited by TFMurphy at 11-10-2008 09:00 PM]

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2340
Registered: 06-14-2005
IP: Logged

File: Paycheck.drh (4.7 KB)
Downloaded 52 times.
License: Public Domain

Good point. I've fixed that now.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

File: Paycheck_fix.drh (4.7 KB)
Downloaded 69 times.
License: Other
From: Someone Else

Thanks for the fix. Unfortunately, we cannot use the hold you posted. It was apparently created by editing a copy of Paycheck, rather than by editing the original hold. That gives it a different Hold ID, making it import as an entirely new hold, rather than as an update to the hold people already have installed.

Stefan has very kindly applied your fixes to the original version of Paycheck, and this is what we will use when the hold is eventually updated on CaravelNet. Thanks Stefan!

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2340
Registered: 06-14-2005
IP: Logged

Yes, I thought that it was the difficulty of completing the hold itself, not the secrets. That's why I put the difficulty so low.

Syntax
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1218
Registered: 05-12-2005
IP: Logged

Is that score with, or without the briar in the 2nd room on the door?

The latest version of TT makes killing the briar easy. I'm playing through as though it was 1 left and 1 down. Great challenge so far

Samuel
Level: Delver

Rank Points: 69
Registered: 07-08-2007
IP: Logged

I loved this Level Set. It was very well designed and it takes brain power to finish effectivly, i like it. i give it an eight for brains, 6 for fun.

____________________________
I believe in everything until it's
disproved. So I believe in fairies,
the myths, dragons. It all exists,
even if it's in your mind. Who's to
say that dreams and nightmares
aren't as real as the here and now?
John Lennon

Samuel
Level: Delver

Rank Points: 69
Registered: 07-08-2007
IP: Logged

Finished it in about 3 minutes plus 20 minutes of paper+pen working out.

____________________________
I believe in everything until it's
disproved. So I believe in fairies,
the myths, dragons. It all exists,
even if it's in your mind. Who's to
say that dreams and nightmares
aren't as real as the here and now?
John Lennon

TFMurphy
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3118
Registered: 06-11-2007
IP: Logged

As of today, Paycheck has been updated and the fixed version can be downloaded from CaravelNet or from the link at the top of the thread. So now you can go after the optimization challenge without fear.

Since a couple of necessary architectural changes were made to implement the fix, CaravelNet has invalidated any highscores that revolved around the briar (mostly due to the greckle gates, I believe, since they've changed position now, even if you pretended there was briar blocking your path). And since many highscores were recorded before validation demos were saved (a feature added in DROD RPG 1.1), well, those are obviously gone too (as they are for all published DROD RPG holds).

Actually, you know what? Let's make this easy. Everyone reading this who has this hold and has CaravelNet should take the time to replay it and register their score ^_^ (And if you don't have the hold... well, why not download it and try?)

Oh, and many thanks to Schik for doing the updating.

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[Last edited by TFMurphy at 08-16-2009 04:23 PM]

12th Archivist
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 789
Registered: 12-07-2008
IP: Logged

OK. I have just finished the hold. I didn't pick up any swords. I only picked up a single accessory item, the Grappling Hook.

My score was 102. Such a pitiful playthrough, but at least it's no longer a hold on my "to-play" board.

Enjoyable hold, Someone Else! Very fun to try to gather the required greckles and keys to get to the end of Smitemaster! Some fun could be mustered from trying to optimize this.

2 brains
7 fun

____________________________
It was going well until it exploded.
~Scott Manley

Check out the DROD Wikia project here!

Lamkin
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 606
Registered: 08-17-2008
IP: Logged

While replaying through this hold today, I noticed that in Vat cleaner: The Entrance, the pressure plate at (3,5) doesn't do anything. My guess is that it's supposed to open the red door at (1,6). Of course, you can still finish the hold, but I just thought I'd mention it...

And I see I'd never commented on the hold. Yeah, like others have mentioned, it's a difficult hold to optimize, but optimizing wasn't absurdly challenging, and trying to optimize was what had made the hold really fun to play. Also, it's definitely a nice change of pace in that the sole focus of the hold is on managing one's greckles as opposed to fighting monsters.