CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
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Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
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Edit:
All right, I think that should do the trick. New version released with 3S fixed.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Well, I definitely can't kill the snake with spawned roaches now.

Still struggling to make the intended solution work. I know how to keep the aumtlich, golem, and queen out of trouble. Just need to figure out how to stay away from the southern roach for 3 more turns before stepping on the pressure plates.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
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Ouch! I think keeping away the golem is the hardest part. Take your time, I'm pretty sure you'll do it soon.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

I'm near to the release of Undone Empire Tunnels. I think the problems are gone -even if I'm not sure- so please have a special attention with those following rooms.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

In 3S, I've found a way to wait indefinitely while the briar grows. My problem now is that I can't get the briar to stop growing. If it happens to grow on to (26,12), it connects with the root from the other side. Then, even if I close the door, the briar keeps growing, and I can't get Beethro's sword back. If the force arrow at (25,13) were northwest instead of northeast, I wouldn't have this problem.

I also completed the puzzle in the eastern secret room, which seems to work fine.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
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I think the new version of the room makes this problem. Give me some time and I'll see if there is any way to solve it.
Edit:
Edit 2:

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-05-2011 11:32 AM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Even if (25,13) were a yellow door, the briar could still reconnect with itself and keep growing. On the other hand, if you put a yellow door under the root, closing that door would remove the root entirely.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

Edit: I failed like a pro.


____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-05-2011 11:58 AM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

This is the best I can do, and it's not good enough. If I time the briar growth against the snake movement preferences, such that the briar does not reconnect, I'm too late in the spawn cycle to escape the roaches. Screenshot attached.

I'm going to bed now. My point is, while finishing this room might be possible, it's too finicky to be fun.

I suggest cleaning up the ending. Make stepping on a pressure plate destroy the entire root.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

I'll do the best I can. Thank you for your help and have a good sleep
Still can't remember how to finish the room. However, I uploaded a new version with a yellow door under the root that will stop it entirely.

Edit: Yes. Completely and easily possible now.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-05-2011 12:28 PM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

The ending for 3S works great now. Thank you for making that change.

Here is how I avoided the golem at the end of 3S:

Since I deleted my previous comments, I'm going to reiterate my one suggestion for 1S1W:

It seems that I have now explored 72% of Elderly Workshops. Is it possible to reach the remaining 5 rooms in this version of the hold? I haven't found a way to enter the corridors on the west side of 1S1W and 2S1W, or the corridor with the additional stairs on the north side of 1N.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
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There are some unrequired and unaccessible rooms in Elderly Workshops. I'm working on them for a future upload...

Also I will change that room with the decoy potions as you want. I'm going to release Undone Empire Tunnels in a few hours (or less) and there will be this change you asked for too.
I would like to thank you for the time you're spending here.


____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

And yes! Here we go. Version 4 released.

New features:
•Undone Empire Tunnels fixed and added.
•Elderly Workshops fixed (Special thanks to CSRabbit)
•Introduction to my third playable level-Unfallen Garden-has been added.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Thank you for moving the decoy potions in Elderly Workshops 1S1W. I think that makes for a fairer puzzle.

Elderly Workshops really has an interesting layout. And so does the new level, Undone Empire Tunnels. I'm looking forward to exploring it more. It looks like the player must solve 3E (difficult for Rabbits) before really exploring, though.

The forum's briar aficionados will adore 3E. I did not need all the platforms provided - hope that's intended, because the solution I found was pretty cool.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
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This room has got many solutions.


Still, I think it has more things. If you want to, I may release a free-of-path version of Undone Empire Tunnels, so you can explore it easily.
Also, you can get into two more rooms without solving 3E. However, if you enter 3E, you have to solve it. Rooms are:



Edit: I found a way to watch demos in the editor. Could I please have yours for 3E? Thanks.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-06-2011 01:14 PM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Here is a pack of demos for you, including 3E, 1N2E, and 1S2E.

I like the contrast between the different puzzle types on this level. After putting a lot of hard work into one of the main puzzles, it's nice to get a quick victory in one of the corridor rooms.

Entrance - The player can skip this room by placing the clone on the oremites east of the green door. Because you have a blue door at the end of the level, it's best not to allow this. You could easily fix it by changing (34,19) and (36,19) into trapdoors.

3E - As I mentioned before, this room is very cool.
1N4E - This room seems to work just fine.
1N2E and 1S2E - I broke these rooms. I'm sorry. See demos.

1S4E - I've been having trouble with this room.
EDIT:

Neather2 wrote:
However, if you enter 3E, you have to solve it.

IMHO, it would be nicer for the player, if this weren't the case. Perhaps the force arrow could be moved one square east, and the walls extended one square east as well?

---

[Last edited by CuriousShyRabbit at 07-07-2011 05:04 AM]

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

All right, I'm sorry again for this. Looks like my keyboard has got some problems with the command keys. F6 doesn't show any demos now and just rotates the room in the editor and counts the moves in the game. Could you please...elaborate...again? Fixed up the entrance, I'll release it after seeing what to do with the other rooms. 3E arrow fixed too.

Edit:
1N2E becomes breakable after my mistake in the downloads. I see you can...

You won't in the new version. I swear.




____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-07-2011 05:48 AM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Alright. I've been a naughty Rabbit. Here is what I did. Please forgive me.

1N2E

1S2E

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
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And...fixed! Hope this makes the indented solution work. Version 4.1 released.
Here's what I did:

Entrance: As you said, replaced oremites with trapdoors.
1N1E: Put a red door to block any player movement before getting into the briar area and replaced the Wraithwing with a roach.
1S1E: Put some walls around first Beethro to force the clone do it all himself, and also put a green door before the opened yellow door.
3E: Arrow replaced.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-07-2011 06:16 AM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

No need to rush... I don't think 1N2E is solvable at all now. You have an inaccessible trapdoor at (37,6).

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

Same problem, same solution. Sorry. I actually fixed it in the past, but I told you I had that problem. New version released (or I hope so)

Edit: Are you going to kill me if I say I just forgot one more thing? Well, actually the room is possible, but it may get a bit tedious. So I had a new fix in the room.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-07-2011 06:57 AM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

The changes in the Entrance and 3E look good.

Here's what I'm doing now in 1N2E:

1S2E is still broken, because I can bypass your new green door via the broken wall next to it. Then I can do the same as before using Beethro and the mimic instead of two Beethros.

EDIT: Actually, I don't even need to bypass the new green door in 1S2E because I can

Also, may I please have some help with 1S4E? This room's been driving me crazy all day.

---

[Last edited by CuriousShyRabbit at 07-07-2011 09:22 AM]

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

CuriousShyRabbit wrote:
The changes in the Entrance and 3E look good.

Here's what I'm doing now in 1N2E:

Click here to view the secret text

×Activate the pressure plates at (23,16) and (35,9). Kill everything except the aumtlich and the brains. Move aumtlich to (22,19), let it break two orbs, then kill it. Drop trapdoors, remove the two broken orbs, then enter briar area. The other two cracked orbs can be removed after the briar is released.

I don't really see the purpose of the snake loops in this room. The snakes do get in my way, and make the room harder to conquer. But why are there four of them, going in a loop, on and off of pressure plates? I feel like I'm still missing something.

1S2E is still broken, because I can bypass your new green door via the broken wall next to it. Then I can do the same as before using Beethro and the mimic instead of two Beethros.

1N2E is..

1S2E


What am I missing? Thanks.

Edit: I probably understood what you did:


____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-07-2011 07:21 PM]

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Neather2 wrote:

Click here to view the secret text

×You shouldn't have anything left near the green door. I mean, you can only clear the room by killing all the monsters, and since the upper-right snake is defended by a wall, you *have to* open all the four doors.

What am I missing? Thanks.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

CuriousShyRabbit wrote:

Neather2 wrote:

Click here to view the secret text

×You shouldn't have anything left near the green door. I mean, you can only clear the room by killing all the monsters, and since the upper-right snake is defended by a wall, you *have to* open all the four doors.

What am I missing? Thanks.

Click here to view the secret text

×You don't have to open all four doors. Only (30,5) needs to be open, so that the snake will kill itself on the wubba.

I am going to cut all my hair off for that. All right, please give me some minutes and I'll see what to do. Thanks for your help. I'm going to give you some hints for the other room in a while.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

Take your time and do it right... I'm going to take a break. I'll look at it again tomorrow.

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

Done. I've got a few problems:

1S4E looks impossible. I would bet it isn't, I've solved it ten times before putting it in there. Maybe I changed some tiles that made the whole thing an unsolvable puzzle. I want to work on this, I'm pretty sure I can get the solution even with this version. If I can't, It is enough to..


1S2E should be entirely fixed now. I built a new path for the snake, so the player must find a way to open all doors and must deal with all the things I've set on the room. Also, I've turned 16,14 into a wall. The mimic is not going to be free without the door opened.

I still have to look for the non-puzzle rooms. I discovered some backtracking problems or some paths that may completely change the idea of a puzzle. For example, entering the oremites area with the pit platform in 1N2E would let the player explore the opposite part of some rooms, which means unintended solutions and more. I think I already solved some of these problems in the version you've got (Arrow at 10,21 in 1N3E and at 19,31 in 1N4E). Dunno if I really want to see those things in a final version. Because of this, I edited the first post and deleted the hold. I will attach a new-totally fixed version if I can get a new layout for Undone Empire Tunnels.

-Neather2

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

---

[Last edited by Neather2 at 07-07-2011 10:21 AM]

Neather2
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 406
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged

Worked a bit and released version number 5. I hope it all works now. Some of the changes:

•The layout of Undone Empire Tunnels has been redone (what a pun). The paths should now work correctly and there should be more free-roaming around the rooms.
•Two Cutscenes added. A few of these are needed to continue the story and also have some kind of more stuff.
•1S2E fixed with a new snake-way and some more walls as said before. Oremite tile turned into trapdoor in 1S4E (still not sure if it is really impossible without that)

-Neather2

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

CuriousShyRabbit
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 3170
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged

I've replayed Undone Empire Tunnels. Those new guards don't seem too friendly! And what's with all those mysterious buildings?

3E, 1N2E, and 1N4E work the same as before.

1S4E - I can now easily solve this room.

1S2E - Here's what I'm doing now.

I still have one more room to find on this level. Conquering 1S2E gives access to the mysterious building in 1S1E, but the orb doesn't open the door. I also see the platform by the mysterious building in 1N1E, but can't get to it. Is this room accessible?

Also: it would be much easier for me and other testers to help you check for path problems if you would please post an editable version of the hold file.