Tscott
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File: ImpossibleCubes ver4.hold (13.1 KB)
Downloaded 118 times.
License: Other
From: Unspecified

EDIT (09-30-03) Uploaded final final verson of hold.

EDIT (09-28-03) Added what I hope is the final version of this hold.

EDIT: (07-19-03) I've updated this hold. Please look at my message below if you're curious about what has changed. Both this message and the post below about the update should have the same version of the hold to download now.


Hi. It's been a while since I posted, but I've been watching the beta updates with interest. I started playing around with the editor around build 21, but didn't have time to keep up with many of the frequent updates. Now, I finally got around to finishing my first level and wouldn't mind some imput.

First let me say, by "Impossible Cubes" I'm not trying to say this is super hard or anything. The level is named after the simple optical illusion that I tried to recreate in a few of the rooms. Also many rooms are built around a square/cube of some sort that may be a bit tricky, hence the name.

I made all the rooms in build 26, and tonight I just successfully imported it into build 28. I've played through each room many times, so they should all be solveable. Some rooms I'll admit are better than others, please let me know what you think.

[Edited by Tscott on 07-19-2003 at 06:36 PM GMT: Adding new version of hold.]

[Edited by Tscott on 09-28-2003 at 10:37 PM GMT: Final (I hope) version of hold attached]

[Edited by Tscott on 10-01-2003 at 03:35 AM GMT: Final final version added to post]

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

Scott
Level: Smitemaster
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Nice puzzles there. Some are significantly more difficult than others. I rather enjoyed the snake/queen room progression. I was certainly glad of checkpoints on those tar levels.

agaricus5
Level: Smitemaster
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I like the hold too.



[Edited by agaricus5 on 07-14-2003 at 02:09 PM]

____________________________
Resident Medic/Mycologist

agaricus5
Level: Smitemaster
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There are one or two typing errors in the level though...



____________________________
Resident Medic/Mycologist

eytanz
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2708
Registered: 02-05-2003
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It's a really nice hold - I'm stuck in 2N, though; I just can't seem to figure out how to do it. The checkpoint placement seems entirely unhelpful, but maybe I'm going about it the wrong way.

agaricus5 wrote:
re: 2N 1W:

Click here to view the secret text

×The rooms 1N 1W and 2N 1W were well made, but very annoying when I stood in the wrong place and got killed by a few hundred tar babies. I was wondering, because I cheated a little by saving some tar behind me when I was in the long section of tar to stop tar babies from attacking from behind, is it possible to do it by clearing the tar entirely, or is the method I used the one required?

Eytan

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I got my avatar back! Yay!

Tscott
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agaricus5 wrote:
re: 3N 1W

Click here to view the secret text

×I used the roaches in 3N 1W to get rid of the serpent because I couldn't get the wraithwing to do what I wanted, but I'd like to ask if it is possible to do it using the wraithwing.

agaricus5 wrote:
re: 1N 1W, 2N 1W

Click here to view the secret text

×The rooms 1N 1W and 2N 1W were well made, but very annoying when I stood in the wrong place and got killed by a few hundred tar babies. I was wondering, because I cheated a little by saving some tar behind me when I was in the long section of tar to stop tar babies from attacking from behind, is it possible to do it by clearing the tar entirely, or is the method I used the one required?

eytanz wrote:
It's a really nice hold - I'm stuck in 2N, though; I just can't seem to figure out how to do it. The checkpoint placement seems entirely unhelpful, but maybe I'm going about it the wrong way.

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
IP: Logged

File: ImpossibleCubes ver2.hold (11.1 KB)
Downloaded 70 times.
License: Other
From: Unspecified

I've been busy. Here's a new version of the hold "Impossible Cubes". With it you get 8 brand new rooms to solve (plus one new boring room to walk through ), a slightly different room ordering, and minor improvements to a few existing rooms. Also a few scrolls have been added/removed.

As before the rooms vary in difficultly, but my goal was to make each room fun. Hopefully, if you played the first version you won't mind playing through a few rooms again.

If you're currious about the "improvements" minor spoilers follow:

The Entrance:


2N:


1S 1W:


Snake/Queen:


Enjoy!

[Edited by Tscott on 07-19-2003 at 07:05 PM]

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

eytanz
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2708
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I get a "file corrupted" error when I try to download this hold. By any chance did you use the hold copying function before exporting? Copied holds are always corrupted in build 29.

____________________________
I got my avatar back! Yay!

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
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I did, darn it. Sorry about that- I didn't realize. Would copying and pasting each room to a new (uncopied) level solve this?

[Edited by Tscott on 07-19-2003 at 06:49 PM]

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

eytanz
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2708
Registered: 02-05-2003
IP: Logged

Probably. Personally, I'm waiting for build 30 before releasing the next version of my hold.

____________________________
I got my avatar back! Yay!

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
IP: Logged

Ok, I made a "non-copied" version of the hold. See if the above file works now. Otherwise I may have to wait for build 30 too.

[Edited by Tscott on 07-19-2003 at 07:25 PM]

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

eytanz
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2708
Registered: 02-05-2003
IP: Logged

It works.

____________________________
I got my avatar back! Yay!

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
IP: Logged

I'm looking for imput on this level. Anyone bother to play through it again? In sleeping on it, I've decided I've got a couple things I want to change in a "final" version of this (I'll try not to do that until DROD1.6 get it's final version).

First, 1S 1E (the room with the 4 interlocking squares of stagnant tar):
I plan to change the force arrow to a green door and place a couple more tar babies on the other side. This will allow easier movement back and forth after the room has been solved, in case someone missed a room or two before this. (It will also stop Beethro's constant laughter as you kill newly created tar babies while trying to solve the room).

Second, 1N 2W (the room just below the "whirlwind" room):
I don't like it. It seems like 3 or 4 half thought out ideas tossed into a room. Any ideas for improvements? Or did you happen to like it as is? As of now, I expect to tweak this room (or maybe scrap it entirely and do something else in a future version).

I'm also wondering what your thoughts are on...

Do the alcoves improve 2N (the top "pipe" room with tar mother, queens and eyes)?

Were you able to find "outside the box" without too much trouble? (I questioned having these rooms required even though they're sort of hidden)

Did you like the "whirlwind" room as much as I did?

What were your experiences with the stagnant tar rooms (the tar squares you had to try to cut your way through)?

Any rooms you thought were too easy? Too tough?

Any other thoughts?

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
IP: Logged

I just uploaded what I hope will be the final version of this hold. You can find it attached to the top post. Only a few things have changed:

1N2W - I totally scrapped this room and replaced it with another. As I said above I didn't care for how my first attempt came out. (Also, the new room is a lot tougher than what was there before.)

2W - Replaced the brains with wraithwings. I know, that sounds odd. Because of the force arrows, the brains weren't affecting room movement much anyway.

1S1E - Added a green door to make going back and forth easier after solving, just in case the player missed a room before reaching this point.

Added a few demos that'll play from the DROD menu.


So if anyone bothers to play this hold again, let me know what you think. (In particular, if 1N2W is an improvement, or if anything needs fixing.)

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged

Well, I just finished playing through the newest version. My thoughts:

The overall design could be improved. It wasn't until I got to 2W that I realized I had missed 2N 1W, so I had to backtrack all the way there (at least you were kind enough to take that possibility into consideration). Then when I got to the exit I realized there were secret rooms that were required...I don't know if you planned it that way or not. I know the Happy House secret rooms weren't required, so they remained secret for me until I found out they existed. Anyway, backtracking for secret rooms isn't a big deal, but backtracking for required rooms can be annoying. It doesn't break the hold, of course, since I can get there, but it's something to think about. One other thing: I liked the whole "plumber" thing and the rivers of tar, but they kind of clashed with the whole "cube" motif. Perhaps it would be better if you split this hold into two, one focusing on cubes and the other dealing with the "tar spill".

And I know you said in your other hold's thread that this was your first attempt, but I'll make other comments pretending I didn't hear that.

Specific rooms (or groups of rooms):

2N: I cleared this room by killing the right brain, killing the other brain, then going after the mother and then mopping up the queens and everything else. Took me a few tries, but not too bad.

3N and 3N 2W: I liked these mini-puzzles...good practice for 1S 1E.

1N 2W: that queen behind the red door is a "timer", eh? You know you don't have to right-click to get the room stats, you can also hit the Enter key... I bet you could do something more to make that queen more of a timer for the room, that you have to do it quickly or you're screwed...the room is trivial once you leave the upper right portion.

2W: did you intend for the goblins to be killed within their section? I pulled them into the queen's area and blocked them with roaches...made it pretty easy.

1S 2W: clever, good variation on some of the themes in this level.

1S 1W: using the alcove to the left of the bottom checkpoint I was able to kill of the initial wave of roaches, making this room pretty trivial. Which was okay with me, really...I didn't want this room any harder!

1S: this room was really easy, but it looked like it was intended to be a lot harder. Is this the case?

1S 1E: this room was fun, I liked looking ahead to see what to do, but then halfway through I was able to easily get to the outside and kill both tar babies, without having to go into the rightmost chamber. Was this intended?

1E -- 2N 1E: clever rooms, I almost solved 1E using the 1N 1E method before I decided "to hell with it" and used the mimic potion. Then in 1N 1E I couldn't kill the serpent because I was trying to use the bottom left corner. When I tried the top left corner it worked on the first try. Stupid serpents. 2N 1E was almost a joke though...perhaps it should be the middle one.

3N 1E: I wanted to kill the queens after hitting the orb, but decided that discretion was the better part of valor and went back and killed the brain. I was just getting attacked from both sides. Is it required to kill the brain first, or were you able to do it last?

Now to the secret rooms:



Whew...I think I am DROD'ed out for a few days...

Game on,

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
IP: Logged

Oneiromancer wrote:
The overall design could be improved. It wasn't until I got to 2W that I realized I had missed 2N 1W, so I had to backtrack all the way there (at least you were kind enough to take that possibility into consideration). Then when I got to the exit I realized there were secret rooms that were required...

So, you're the player that's been giving me nightmares after making this hold? I'm aware of those two paths being the only forks in the path to the exit, and as you noted I've been sure to make a path back if needed. Perhaps adding a scroll in 1N1W to suggest the player go north first would help? As for the 'secret' rooms I debated making them not required, but I wanted every player to find them and I thought the breakable wall was fairly obvious (I guess not?). Maybe, adding a note to the scroll in the whirlwind room to be sure to check "outside the box" after solving?

1N 2W: that queen behind the red door is a "timer", eh? You know you don't have to right-click to get the room stats, you can also hit the Enter key... I bet you could do something more to make that queen more of a timer for the room, that you have to do it quickly or you're screwed...the room is trivial once you leave the upper right portion.

I didn't want to do anything too evil in this room. This is the room I just replaced and I wanted to keep it on the same difficulty level as the rest of the rooms in the hold. I toyed with having 25 queens in the lower left box, but I didn't want to overwhelm non-expert players. I figured timing the approch to roaches in the 'second layer' was enough of a challenge here.

2W: did you intend for the goblins to be killed within their section? I pulled them into the queen's area and blocked them with roaches...made it pretty easy.

That's mostly how I do it to.

1S: this room was really easy, but it looked like it was intended to be a lot harder. Is this the case?

I guess. I was trying to make a room where it was impossible to attack the tar for several growths. Not too hard, but sort of interesting. For an extra challenge: Try to solve it without breaking the breakable wall (and leave through the east exit of course).

1S 1E: this room was fun, I liked looking ahead to see what to do, but then halfway through I was able to easily get to the outside and kill both tar babies, without having to go into the rightmost chamber. Was this intended?

1E -- 2N 1E: clever rooms, I almost solved 1E using the 1N 1E method before I decided "to hell with it" and used the mimic potion. Then in 1N 1E I couldn't kill the serpent because I was trying to use the bottom left corner. When I tried the top left corner it worked on the first try. Stupid serpents. 2N 1E was almost a joke though...perhaps it should be the middle one.

I like the third one where it is mostly because

3N 1E: I wanted to kill the queens after hitting the orb, but decided that discretion was the better part of valor and went back and killed the brain. I was just getting attacked from both sides. Is it required to kill the brain first, or were you able to do it last?

I've never killed the queens before the brain. I'll have to try that challege sometime.

[Edited by Tscott on 10-01-2003 at 12:27 AM]

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged

File: I level one of one 1S Victory.demo (1 KB)
Downloaded 47 times.
License: Other
From: Unspecified

Tscott wrote:
Perhaps adding a scroll in 1N1W to suggest the player go north first would help?

Yeah, it can't hurt. Or maybe a scroll from the plumber saying this is the way to the end, like he was leaving bread crumbs for himself.

As for the 'secret' rooms I debated making them not required, but I wanted every player to find them and I thought the breakable wall was fairly obvious (I guess not?). Maybe, adding a note to the scroll in the whirlwind room to be sure to check "outside the box" after solving?

You know, it's like you said in the other topic...I had played the whirlwind room in Happy House and so I just moved through this one quickly...I didn't even look for the breakable walls until I got to the end and knew I missed something. Even on my treks back and forth to get the room I missed before.

1S: this room was really easy, but it looked like it was intended to be a lot harder. Is this the case?

I guess. I was trying to make a room where it was impossible to attack the tar for several growths. Not too hard, but sort of interesting. For an extra challenge: Try to solve it without breaking the breakable wall (and leave through the east exit of course).

While killing the first set of tar babies it grew once; then it grew one more time before I was able to kill the mother. It's all about Beethro placement. Here's a demo.

Anyway, looking forward to more from you whenever you get the time.

Game on,

[Edited by Oneiromancer on 10-01-2003 at 12:42 AM GMT: Demo lost when previewing]

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams

Scott
Level: Smitemaster
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IP: Logged

File: I level one of one 3N1E Victory.demo (2 KB)
Downloaded 47 times.
License: Other
From: Unspecified

Oneiromancer wrote:

3N 1E: I wanted to kill the queens after hitting the orb, but decided that discretion was the better part of valor and went back and killed the brain. I was just getting attacked from both sides. Is it required to kill the brain first, or were you able to do it last?

I killed the brain last. Attached a demo.

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
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I just made a couple minor changes to the hold and uploaded that version. I've added a scroll in room 1N1W as discussed. Also, I've made the secret areas not required, and changed the wording of the bottom scroll in room 1N2W to hint that there may be something to find.

Oneiromancer wrote:
While killing the first set of tar babies it grew once; then it grew one more time before I was able to kill the mother. It's all about Beethro placement. Here's a demo.

That's almost the correct way to solve my challenge for that room. The intended solution for this room was to have the player go around to the other side and break in through the breakable wall- I discovered your solution much latter during one of my playtests.



____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

LordKinbote
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 56
Registered: 10-01-2003
IP: Logged

I'm enjoying this hold.

A question about a room, though...



Keep up the good work!

EDIT: Of course, right after I post this comment, I go up one room and see what you did. Never mind, never mind, this is why I should finish a level before I post.

[Edited by LordKinbote on 10-03-2003 at 09:56 PM]

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
IP: Logged

Don't worry about it. I'm glad you like it so far.

At least this gives me a chance to comment on how cool I think your user name is... "No other object has be missidentified as a flying saucer more often than the planet Venus."

____________________________
And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"