mauvebutterfly
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 776
Registered: 05-03-2015
IP: Logged

While Beethro is standing on a hot tile, he can turn to strike an orb or monster and the strike will process before he dies. However, other entities, such as soldiers, will turn to strike their target and die without actually striking their target. This actually matters, because if Beethro pushes something that then pushes him, he can survive turning on hot tiles.

Is this bugged behaviour? Should one standard apply to all entities? There are three possibilities here as I see it:



(1) Leave it as is. This is the easiest option, since nothing needs to be done. This would just be another example of player turn processing being different than that for other entities.

(2) Both Beethro and other entities strike before dying. This could potentially break rooms/demos that depend on guards/soldiers/mimics dying before their hit is processed.

(3) Beethro turning while on a hot tile results in death before his hit is processed. This would prevent Beethro from multi-pushing himself on hot tiles and would make him consistent with other entities in this regard.



I suspect that (1) is what will end up happening since it wouldn't require any additional dev work and doesn't risk breaking anything.

If a change was going to be made, I'd argue that (2) probably makes the most sense.

The important thing for me personally is to know whether this behaviour is considered a bug or not, since I have designed a room around this behaviour. If the dev team decides on (3) then my room would no longer work, so I would like to know if this is a possibility before publishing the room.

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106th Skywatcher

Someone Else
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2358
Registered: 06-14-2005
IP: Logged

I think that you're underestimating the change this would be. I'm pretty sure that changing this in any way would break nearly every room with hot tiles.

The real answer is that hot tiles kill Beethro at the end of the turn, but other entities on their turn. It needs to be this way otherwise monsters would continue to block the space for the entire turn even after they get fried.

(3) is worse, as then Beethro is the only entity that can't be pushed on hot tiles.

mauvebutterfly
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 776
Registered: 05-03-2015
IP: Logged

Well, that settles that. Thanks. I won't worry about this behaviour potentially being changed then.

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106th Skywatcher

Dragon Fogel
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 2584
Registered: 06-21-2014
IP: Logged

I'm confused as to what you mean.

Changing "entities die immediately on their turn" to "entities with weapons have the effects of their weapons processed on their turn and then they die if they didn't move" would not have the drastic effects you suggest. It would, however, potentially cause breaks in rooms that involve entities with weapons on hot tiles, which would still be pretty significant so I would personally be against changing it.

And I don't see how making Beethro *also* die immediately without his weapon being processed would break anything, other than no longer allowing him to be rescued by pushing (including a setup that lets him effectively push himself) if he doesn't move.

But other entities would still be able to push him if there was an open tile for him to move into, and would fail to push him if there wasn't. It's just that he'd have to move into the tile that would let him be pushed, and couldn't just wait. This is weird, but not any weirder than some of the current consequences of move order on hot tiles - a mimic can push a clone that moves later than the mimic and save it, but not one that moves earlier.