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mauvebutterfly
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icon Re: Twisty Little Passages (0)  
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averagemoe wrote:
I just know that someone is going to try to recreate all these puzzles in DROD:RPG.

Maybe, but I don't think they'd be very good in RPG based on what we've seen here. It looks like there is intended to only be one exact solution, which takes out the fun of optimising that you'd see in RPG. It would be a fairly simple matter to port over though; I just don't see the point of doing so. Let it exist as a separate medium as it was originally intended to be.

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01-27-2019 at 06:08 AM
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mrimer
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ErikH2000 wrote:
It might be worth explaining the calc in just one location of the book, even tucked in an appendix. I agree there's some satisfaction in knowing the numbers aren't arbitrary.
Appreciate the suggestion! Trying to think of how to get this right, so it's not too much, not too little information.

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01-28-2019 at 04:41 AM
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mrimer
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File: TLP Book tutorial puzzle prototype v3.pdf (10.5 MB)
Downloaded 11 times.
License: Public Domain
icon Re: Twisty Little Passages (+1)  
Refined some borders and coloring on the TLP 1-4 puzzle spread. Removed an unnecessary column from the damage tables.

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Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.
01-29-2019 at 03:46 PM
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ErikH2000
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mrimer wrote:
Refined some borders and coloring on the TLP 1-4 puzzle spread. Removed an unnecessary column from the damage tables.

Nice.

Just noticed that I missed part of the puzzle -- the skull is a queen roach. I think my eye just read the skull as decoration flavor.

I think the icon for the queen roach could be more representative. Maybe an outline silhoette of the first roach icon. The skull seems like a generic indicator of death or danger.

-Erik

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01-29-2019 at 04:01 PM
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mrimer
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ErikH2000 wrote:
Just noticed that I missed part of the puzzle -- the skull is a queen roach. I think my eye just read the skull as decoration flavor.

I think the icon for the queen roach could be more representative. Maybe an outline silhoette of the first roach icon. The skull seems like a generic indicator of death or danger.
Ah, I appreciate you mentioning that. I was thinking of using a skull icon as a common representation of a boss monster. I plan to have a legend of common icons at the start of the book, e.g., key, lock, elixir, and boss.

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Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

[Last edited by mrimer at 01-29-2019 10:46 PM]
01-29-2019 at 10:27 PM
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Pinnacle
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What's the overarching structure like? Is it essentially a linear sequence of puzzles or are there things like alternate exits leading to bonus puzzles or branching paths?

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01-30-2019 at 04:44 PM
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mrimer
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Pinnacle wrote:
What's the overarching structure like? Is it essentially a linear sequence of puzzles or are there things like alternate exits leading to bonus puzzles or branching paths?
Great question! Kieren and I considered both approaches and decided on a linear series of puzzles, with a focused, cohesive story line and progressive building of concepts/elements on other elements. We concluded this would provide the strongest puzzle design and narrative experience, which feels like the right approach to focus on for players at large.

I'm excited by the possibilities of alternative paths to bonus areas, though my impression is that these would need to be designed extremely carefully to avoid compromising the core puzzle. If we get into stretch goals in the campaign, we could definitely consider bonus puzzles included in this way.

Would love to hear your thoughts on what you'd like to see.

____________________________
Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

[Last edited by mrimer at 02-03-2019 04:10 PM]
02-03-2019 at 04:00 PM
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mrimer
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While there's still time to make additions, I'd like to hear your thoughts on any puzzle mechanics you'd like included.

____________________________
Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

[Last edited by mrimer at 02-03-2019 04:34 PM]
02-03-2019 at 04:34 PM
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bbb
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Interesting concept.

I can think of two simple mechanics for creating bonus puzzles.

1. Each puzzle has different colored keys. Individual puzzles can have hard solutions which allow collecting extra keys, which can be used in special puzzles.

2. I'm not sure how preserving stats between puzzles will work. Suppose most puzzles can be solved one way which will result in specific stats at the end. After finishing a puzzle series, send the player back to the start with for example an extra key. This would allow breaking the original puzzle, but would allow reaching bonus goals. Designing puzzles which solve both ways can be interesting.

If it is still relevant, I would be interested in designing and/or testing puzzles.
02-04-2019 at 01:46 PM
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mrimer
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bbb wrote:
I can think of two simple mechanics for creating bonus puzzles.

1. Each puzzle has different colored keys. Individual puzzles can have hard solutions which allow collecting extra keys, which can be used in special puzzles.
Thanks for sharing your ideas! I'm not sure I understood this first one. Would you please elaborate?
quote:
2. I'm not sure how preserving stats between puzzles will work. Suppose most puzzles can be solved one way which will result in specific stats at the end.
Yes, exactly. We've designed the puzzles with a single valid solution in mind, so stat carryover is according to that expectation, which keeps it simple.
quote:
After finishing a puzzle series, send the player back to the start with for example an extra key. This would allow breaking the original puzzle, but would allow reaching bonus goals. Designing puzzles which solve both ways can be interesting.
I hadn't thought of that. It does sound interesting!
quote:
If it is still relevant, I would be interested in designing and/or testing puzzles.
Thanks for the offer. I'll PM you.

____________________________
Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

[Last edited by mrimer at 02-04-2019 01:55 PM]
02-04-2019 at 01:55 PM
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bbb
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1. In the context of DRODRPG, you could have 4 levels with no backtracking. The first would have only yellow keys and doors, the second only green keys and doors, and the third only blue keys and doors. The final level would be a bonus level where you spend the keys for a final score. If it is not a final level, you can lose all keys after the fourth level.
02-04-2019 at 05:32 PM
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mrimer
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bbb wrote:
1. In the context of DRODRPG, you could have 4 levels with no backtracking. The first would have only yellow keys and doors, the second only green keys and doors, and the third only blue keys and doors. The final level would be a bonus level where you spend the keys for a final score. If it is not a final level, you can lose all keys after the fourth level.
Ah, I get it! Neat idea.

We're generally planning for there to be a single correct solution for each puzzle (at least in this book -- it's always possible, based on success, that the formula could be expanded in future works).

I'm trying to think how this concept could work under this constraint. Your ideas?

____________________________
Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

[Last edited by mrimer at 02-04-2019 06:25 PM]
02-04-2019 at 06:25 PM
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bbb
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icon Re: Twisty Little Passages (+1)  
If having a unique solution is a strict rule, the other idea is probably better. Otherwise, it should be possible to design a puzzle such that all solutions finish with the same character stats, while allowing multiple paths with optional bonuses.

Obviously, not all puzzles have to have a bonus.

And regarding the skull image for a boss Erik mentioned above, maybe draw a roach queen representation in the skull. Then it will be clear both that it is a boss, and what type of monster it is.

[Last edited by bbb at 02-04-2019 08:53 PM]
02-04-2019 at 08:27 PM
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mrimer
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I appreciate the feedback!

It is possible, but rather difficult, to design alternative paths that end up the same. I have a concern that adding multiple paths to victory might water down or confuse the puzzles, which I would see as a larger negative to the experience than the benefit alternative solutions might provide.

None of the iconography is final, and I'll try making some changes to make information clearer. I'll also try to get some good testing in with physical prototypes prior to the campaign.

That said...while a lofty goal, I'm not sure it's going to be possible for the iconography alone to serve as a replacement for reading rules and instructions.

____________________________
Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

[Last edited by mrimer at 02-10-2019 03:58 PM]
02-10-2019 at 03:56 PM
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mrimer
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I'm working toward running the KS campaign for TLP in the month of May (assuming the necessary preparation is done by that point).

Prior to that point, I'd like to prepare some physical prototype demo books for review/preview sites.

Would anyone here, who publishes LPs or game reviews, be interested in receiving a prototype demo copy for purposes of providing a published written or video review that I could reference in the campaign?

____________________________
Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

[Last edited by mrimer at 02-10-2019 04:03 PM]
02-10-2019 at 04:02 PM
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