Oneiromancer
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A bit easier once you get used to them. There's actually some strategy involved now, moving Beethro around a bit just to make them move so you know where they are. And moving very slowly with your sword always in front of you just in case a spider jumps out...it's kind of suspenseful, actually. More so, I think, than before.

Game on,

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TripleM
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Regarding information that hasn't been released yet:

Yes, I know that you haven't decided on a price yet.. but can you at least explain 'reasonable' Like, I have totally no idea whether we're in the 5 to 10 dollar range, the 30-ish dollar mark, the 70-100 dollar range.. its hard to tell with this sort of program in comparison to, say, a game from EA Sports or something.

Will you be releasing anything else before the games release, eg more screenshots etc?

Oh, and since (if I remember the other posts in this thread correct) theres some other type of tar that you haven't mentioned, does this mean that there may be some major features that you haven't told us about (eg monsters or elements etc)?



[Edited by TripleM at Local Time:12-08-2004 at 02:04 AM: (in case people were wondering why my price ranges were so high, I forgot to convert to US$ ]

ErikH2000
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There are some unknown things that are factors like if we will release a CD or only sell online. But the price is going to be something under $25.

-Erik

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Oneiromancer
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I have absolutely no knowledge of the price that anyone has in mind, but really you shouldn't expect it to cost more than a shareware game.

The things that haven't been mentioned we would like to keep as a surprise if we can...although of course as soon as DROD 2.0 is release anyone can see the new things in the editor and try them out immediately, even if they don't buy JtRH. Which is too bad but...you can't really do much about that. Personally I think it would be cool if one of the perks to pre-ordering JtRH would be to get DROD 2.0 early, but I'm not involved with that at all and so my ideas should be taken with a grain of salt.

Game on,

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TripleM
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Excellent. That just changed me from 'probably buying it' to 'definitely buying it' . Lets hope the $NZ/$US exchange rate stays the way it is!

[Edited by TripleM at Local Time:12-08-2004 at 09:17 PM]

TripleM
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Just thought of something - I have a dialup connection. I haven't actually bought shareware games before, and I could always get the mailed-out version (if one exists), but if I, say, happen to disconnect halfway through the download and had to start again, this doesn't mean I have to pay again right? Hopefully there'll be something which lets me download it fully.. without being able to fully download it several times, of course.

Oneiromancer
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There are several download managers that let you continue a download that has been disconnected.

Also, I'm not sure exactly how this will be done...because don't forget that the base DROD 2.0 program will be completely free. It will include the 3 level demo of JtRH, and have sell screens, etc., when you finish that demo. So either the full game will be included and you only have to unlock it with a key code when you pay for it, or you have to separately download and install the hold. I suspect it may be the second option, as this prevents hacking a bit better, and also the full hold will include audio files which could take up lots of space. A good idea would be to have those files be a separate download for dialup users. It is probably too early for anyone to say though.

Game on,

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TripleM
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Yeah - the ones that require a code probably don't last long before codes get throughout the internet. The thing about disconnecting is that, say, after paying for it do you only get 1 chance to click on a link to download it, or something. You probably wouldn't want to say you can download it as many times as you like; perhaps you would be able to download it over a 24 hour period after paying or something.

eytanz
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Well, whatever the technical mechanism is, Caravel isn't exactly a big nameless corporation - if you have a problem, I'm sure it will be resolved relatively quickly.

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Zaratustra00
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I'll go out on a limb and guess is only used in two rooms.

b0rsuk
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Tricky/paranoidal question about image floors... and copyrights

If I place image floor somewhere in my hold, and the picture happens to contain copyrighted drod image... do I go to jail ? The hold is distributed freely, after all.

Example: I could blend a picture into mosaic floor. The mosaic floor image would still be partially visible

This would be the case with pretty much all "fitting" images. Is it possible to make transparent image floor, which would be placed "over" copyrighted default floor ? All I'd had to do would be make sure the transparent image looks good on top of it, and custom image could be distributed without silly questions like this.
This way I could save my life. I hope the engine allows it.



[Edited by b0rsuk at Local Time:12-09-2004 at 12:28 PM]

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eytanz
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Are you talking about incorporating copyrighted materials in general? (say, using images from some other game?)

Or are you talking about incorporating copyrighted material from DROD:JtRH, i.e. incorporating images from the two level styles available only to paid customers?

It's up to Erik to decide the policies, but I'm betting that if you do either without permission from the copyright holder, then your hold will not be allowed in the holds area of the site.

By the way, "blending" images the way you suggest above would be pretty irrelevant for the purposes of copyright law. As long as you used copyrighted material, you're potentially in trouble, whether or not it's identifiable as such.

[Edited by eytanz at Local Time:12-09-2004 at 01:35 PM]

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b0rsuk
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eytanz wrote:
Are you talking about incorporating copyrighted materials in general? (say, using images from some other game?)

Or are you talking about incorporating copyrighted material from DROD:JtRH, i.e. incorporating images from the two level styles available only to paid customers?

Ne(i)ther

Let's just say I use image from level style available to everyone , not just customers. And make some changes, and use in my hold. After all, it's the easiest way to make sure it's going to fit.
Is this allowed ?

Otherwise I'd have to make every simgle floor image from scratch so there are no copyright issues. This case is obviously safe.

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ErikH2000
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Borsuk, there's grey areas here and I'm sure you could come up with some cases where you're in the spirit but not letter of law. In general, no, you won't be allowed to distribute any of the images from JtRH, even if they are the ones we are already distributing for free with the demo.

But when you get started on your hold, and you've had some chance to see what is possible to do with the editor, then just ask for permission to do whatever this grey area thing is. Incorporating graphics from the for-sale portions of JtRH is straight out, but other ideas that don't hurt Caravel will certainly be considered. Just be sure to ask about the specific thing you want to do.

If you make a hold with copyrighted material from somebody other than us, (i.e. "Beethro goes to South Park") we won't host it on DROD.net unless maybe you can show that you have permission to use the material.

-Erik

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b0rsuk
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Is Slayer really indestructible, or too smart to be killed ? In second case it would still be possible to kill him. You could spawn mimic on him, no matter hom smart he thinks he is.

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Rabscuttle
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If he sees you heading towards a mimic potion, he can always move his hook in the opposite direction to your sword and thus prevent the mimic from being placed where it would kill him.

Although with multiple mimics it might be possible to surround him.



[Edited by Rabscuttle at Local Time:12-12-2004 at 10:28 AM]

agaricus5
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The Slayer can be killed (in two rooms, I believe). Any object that can kill Beethro and isn't a monster can kill the Slayer, although the developers have taken pains to make sure that such objects cannot be found in the rooms with him, except when you are forced to use the object in a way that can't kill him.

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Fafnir
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If he can be killed in two rooms, what effect does killing him in one as opposed to the other have later (if any)?

[Edited by Fafnir at Local Time:12-12-2004 at 10:38 PM]

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eytanz
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There are two ways to answer that question - a game mechanic way and a hold-specific/story way.

Game-mechanic wise, the game doesn't know that the slayer is always the same character. As far as it's concerned, it's a game element as any other element and is present independantly in each room. So if you kill him in one room, nothing will change in any other rooms - he'll still be there.

As far as the official hold goes, we've taken steps to ensure that you can't kill the slayer and proceed - it's possible to kill the slayer but doing so in most rooms he's in will result in the room being unsolvable.

That said, we can't account for every possibility and brilliant idea the players have and I'm sure some will slip by ad discovered just like the 'neather kills were. In which case, the story does include an explanation for why the slayer will be back anyway, but I'm not going to say more about that.

Unlike the 'neather, there is no hard-coding of anything JtRH-specific about the slayer.

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Oneiromancer
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To expand upon what Eytan said: in JtRH there is only one Slayer, so we tried to make sure he was smart enough to not die by the sword, and also, storywise, smart enough not to enter rooms with things that can easily kill him...like mimic/decoy potions and bombs (unless as Eytan implied, using one of those would make the room unsolvable). However, in user-made holds, there is no such restriction. If you want Beethro to be able to kill the Slayer (as revenge, perhaps?) over and over and over again, feel free. But if you want it to be a story element, you will have to be careful to ensure his survival, like we did.

Game on,

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b0rsuk
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That's what I wanted to know - Slayer is technically killable. Kind of megagoblin, I think.

To keep the thread alive and feed my curiosity...
Do Wubbas move like common roaches when brained ? It would be fun to see roach is top of intellect for someone...


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bradwall
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b0rsuk wrote:
That's what I wanted to know - Slayer is technically killable. Kind of megagoblin, I think.

To keep the thread alive and feed my curiosity...
Do Wubbas move like common roaches when brained ? It would be fun to see roach is top of intellect for someone...

Wubbas move like Rock Golems

eytanz
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And brained wubbas move just like brained rock golems.

Which move just like brained roaches.

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AlefBet
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eytanz wrote:
And brained wubbas move just like brained rock golems.

Which move just like brained roaches.

There are actually some differences between brained golems and brained roaches. For example, if a brained roach can't move to the square it's directed towards, it will pick another. A golem will just sit there.

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b0rsuk
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How many roaches are there in JTR Hold ?

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Oneiromancer
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Lots.

Game on,

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Tim
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Are holds made with DROD:AE 100% compatible with JtRH?

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Oneiromancer
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Technically, yes, they should be. Although there does appear to be an issue with brained serpents, so we will be testing things as we come across them.

Since there is only one floor style with the free version of 2.0, and three styles if you buy JtRH, some aesthetic things won't cross over. However, even the main floor style has these "carpets" that you can place in the rooms to give them more personality...it's just the checkerboard and wall color and pit styles that are different. Well, some of the "carpets" are different too I think.

Basically, it is fully intended for every 1.6 hold to work functionally perfectly in 2.0.

Game on,

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Maurog
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Umm, what about diagonal grid doors like you got in Dugan's snake levels? JtRH won't treat them as one door, so will it like, translate this into a button which commands all of them, or will just the door that the button is physically linked to be switched? Is there a limit to how many doors a button controls in JtRH?

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rowrow
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Maurog wrote:
Is there a limit to how many doors a button controls in JtRH?

Was there ever.I remember in webfoots gunthro budkins tips,it said that u can do only 4.Is it true in the editor?

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