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ErikH2000
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Schik wrote:
Okay... Now that I've at least looked at a lot of the levels... I think this one might be too hard for my feeble brain. I'm pretty sure about 90% of the levels are actually impossible. :blink
No no, they are all possible.

It takes a while to get good at optimizing. The harder levels need to be done with less arrows or you end up tripping over your own complexity.

-Erik

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06-12-2003 at 04:34 AM
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Schik
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ErikH2000 wrote:
No no, they are all possible.
I'm sure they are, I was just joking. But only about the impossible part, the feeble brain part was 100% truth. But then again, there were times when I thought the same thing my first time through Dugan's Dungeon.

I'm sure I'll stick to it and keep going... but MAN some of them are tough. It would be nice if they were somewhat sorted by difficulty (unless they ARE, but that coincidentally happens to be alphabetical too).

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06-12-2003 at 12:40 PM
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Oneiromancer
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Here's another good puzzle game to check out, called Ultimate Spin Doctor:

http://www.the-underdogs.org/game.php?id=4452

It is a very unique game, and it is nice in that there are many difficulty levels. Child difficulty has no timer and everything moves at a sedate pace, while as you move up through Easy and Medium to Hard, the timer gets shorter and the pace gets much faster. And you get many more points too, of course.

Note: this is "abandonware", technically, although especially in this case I applaud you if you can find this game retail.

Game on,

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06-12-2003 at 06:01 PM
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eytanz
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icon Re: Other good puzzle games (0)  
By the way, re:motion madness - I'm hoping that Roland Curit still reads this thread, because, while it's a great game, it has to be one of the most strangely designed websites ever - it mentions mailing him in several places, but there is no email address, anywhere on the site, or in the game's helpfiles!

Also, it says one can download more levels on "certain sites" - anyone have any idea where one can find these sites?

[Edited by eytanz on 06-12-2003 at 07:13 PM]

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06-12-2003 at 07:12 PM
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curitre
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2 posts from me now. At this rate I will be a Legendary Smitemaster in no time.

Anyhow. Thanks for the insight, eytanz. I have added an email address to the registration page. I didn't want to add it to the game in case I change email addresses later.

As for the various newsgroups and websites where you can get more puzzles, well... that used to be true many years ago when I was pushing the game. I just threw the new web site together last week just so I could get version 3.0 out there. The text on the description page was a cut and paste from and earlier web site. I'll have to review the wording when I get a chance.

I appreciate all the feedback you gaming gurus are supply on both the game and the web site.


06-12-2003 at 07:36 PM
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Mattcrampy
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Seeing as how you're here -

Some explanation of the overall goal of the game would be good. It took me a while, I'm ashamed to say, to work out the point.

Also, are the 3 solution options save slots, or has someone come up with three different solutions for the puzzles?

Matt

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06-12-2003 at 09:26 PM
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curitre
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One thing I have never been good at is explaining things. I have been relying heavily on end-users figuring it out on their own. Maybe I should put together an online tutorial.

As for the three solution slots, that is so that you can work on creating a better solution (fewer arrows) without having to overwrite an existing solution.

In earlier versions, once you found a solution, the only way to optimize it was to use the same storage space, thus overwriting your existing solution.

Roland
06-12-2003 at 09:32 PM
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lucretia
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curitre wrote:
One thing I have never been good at is explaining things. I have been relying heavily on end-users figuring it out on their own. Maybe I should put together an online tutorial.
It really is a great game but I've had problems trying to explain it to other people (and had a lot of difficulty understanding it myself at first). The problem is that a lot of people won't give it a fair shot or try to figure out what to do which is a shame because I believe that this game would appeal to a lot of people. An online tutorial would be excellent.
06-19-2003 at 03:01 PM
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Re: Oneiromancer, I've become nicely addicted to Ultimate Spin Doctor. It's an excellent game when you need to kill a few minutes, and never becomes boring. The music is kind of annoying, but it's turn-off-able. Me, I like those clicks, clacks, and tocks that it makes. :D Almost as satisfying as the ka-ching of an old adding machine! :)

So if you have time to waste, download this game. Your time will be well-wasted. ;)

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06-19-2003 at 09:49 PM
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I'm sure many of you hard-core DROD-sters enjoy a variety of puzzle games, and assuming the popularity of Tetris, it's also a safe assumtion that many of you are familiar with the game and have a deep love and respect for it. But I'm telling you, fans... avoid Tetris Worlds like the plague.

I know it's an old game, but I just picked it up recently. Never was I more disappointed in a video game. Hell, I like Shadowgate on the Genesis more than this excuse of a game. It is an insult to Tetris fans everywhere. I want my $20 back.

Also, did anyone ever play Columns III? I never got the chance to see what it was like.

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06-25-2003 at 11:50 PM
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Mattcrampy
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I don't mind it so much, but then I didn't pay for it. :D My second-best deal, behind The Sims for A$1. That's about 66c US at the moment.

Although what I'm looking for is something along the lines of New Tetris - di anyone see that? It was an N64 game, and you had these projects that you built by getting an absolute motherlode of lines. It looked interesting.

I've been bandying around a few ideas for a Tetris clone, and I'll put it into practice when my DX skillz become more l33t.

Apologies. don't know what came over me.

Anything anyone wants to throw me? Something they've always thought would be cool in Tetris.

Matt

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06-26-2003 at 09:25 AM
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krammer
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You could finally create the DRODtris we have all been looking forward to for so long... ;)

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06-26-2003 at 11:04 AM
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Mattcrampy
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Mmmm... maybe...

Let me think about it. I'm going to have to create something a bit more interesting than Tetris with DROD tiles. Perhaps putting blocks in with DROD creatures, so if you release a roach, he'll run up to the top of the screen, serpents would go after blocks, goblins would run like roaches but avoid being under a block, brains would tweak the block movement as well as the creature movement, and maybe tar covers the blocks up?

Not sure what the Neather will do, but I'll come up with something nasty.

What I'll do is have junk move up from the bottom of the screen, including doors, potions and monsters, then at the bottom have the exit door.

Mimic potions would create extra blocks that could be placed anywhere, and invisibility potions would fade away the first few lines of blocks, but creatures would stop heading up.

I can even do doors - trapdoors on the floor would have to be cleared with a block on it, and red doors would clear when there were no trapdoors on the screen above the door. Green doors would be similar. Yellow doors would have orbs that would change every time you cleared a line - I could reenact the 8 Gates of Bill! :devil

My mind is reeling - I've got ideas up the wazoo!

Still can't work out how I'm doing blue doors though.

Matt

[Edited by Mattcrampy on 06-27-2003 at 05:28 AM GMT: Thought I should tell you about doors]

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06-27-2003 at 06:22 AM
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krammer
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Wow, and I was only joking...

But if you really want to do it then I would love to see something like this. Whether Erik likes it is of course another matter entirely, but I think the ideas are quite cool.

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06-27-2003 at 04:44 PM
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ErikH2000
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krammer wrote:
Wow, and I was only joking...

But if you really want to do it then I would love to see something like this. Whether Erik likes it is of course another matter entirely, but I think the ideas are quite cool.
Don't anybody get the wrong idea--I am only a control freak when it comes to the Caravel distribution of DROD. All other DROD-derivative projects, have my blessing and don't legally need it.*** Go forth and create!

-Erik

*** But people have to comply with the legal agreements associated with any source code or libraries they reuse from the Caravel DROD project. Easy to do.

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06-27-2003 at 05:19 PM
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trick
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Be sure to make it portable :P
06-27-2003 at 05:22 PM
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Yeah, we need some way to enjoy DROD when we're away from our computers. ;)

I find myself really liking this idea. Go DRODtris!

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06-27-2003 at 07:44 PM
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Malarame
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It isn't really a puzzle game, per se, but I recently found a program called Structural Engineering Challenge ( http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/method_comp/ ) and I've been having a lot of fun with it. You have to design structures that can withstand a certain amount of force, and the amount of force it has to withstand depends on the total weight of the structure. I like this kind of stuff, so I find it to be a lot of fun.

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06-28-2003 at 04:15 AM
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trick
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Seems like Pontifex 2. You build bridges and make things drive over them. It's commercial, tho, and i've only played the demo.

Also have a look at Construo. Not really a game at all, but great fun! But, it requires X.. Compiling it in Cygwin with XFree should make it work in windows :)

06-28-2003 at 11:57 AM
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Malarame
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trick wrote:
Seems like Pontifex 2. You build bridges and make things drive over them. It's commercial, tho, and i've only played the demo.

Also have a look at Construo. Not really a game at all, but great fun! But, it requires X.. Compiling it in Cygwin with XFree should make it work in windows :)
I also played the demo for Pontifex 2. It was a lot of fun, and similar in some ways to SEC.

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06-28-2003 at 03:43 PM
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mrimer
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I've been thinking about this for a while now and I've got some great ideas! (I hope!) I saw a Tetris-clone called "Puzzle Master" that gave me a lot of initial inspiration for a Tetris-like DROD game. It demonstrated that the Tetris playing field can be used for a lot more than just dropping blocks! Some modest screenshots can be seen at:

http://www.videogamereview.com/reviews/Nintendo_Gameboy/Puzzle/moreinfo_699.asp

and a review (if you're interested in the gameplay) at:

http://pocket.ign.com/articles/162/162326p1.html?fromint=1&submit.x=65&submit.y=13

Please take a quick look at the screenshots to get a vision for what could be put in a DRODTris.

Making elements work in a roughly DROD-like fashion might just work, and provide some original and refreshing strategic gameplay in a Tetris-environment rather than just random action.

In short, each "room" (one Tetris-like level) could be hand-crafted with certain elements placed to provide a strategic puzzle. Like walls, doors and orbs, tar, and monsters placed in certain ways.

Rather than dropping blocks, how about having Beethro standing in the top row of the room and dropping swords in various random configurations (one, two, or three/four connected together in a certain way). Beethro moves left and right, always positioned above the swords, as you maneuver and rotate the swords in their downward fall to land on something. Only those swords that are actually on something when one of the swords hits has any effect. Each "move" (dropping a block of swords), the monsters would try to move one step towards wherever Beethro is standing (according to their movement patterns) when the swords hit. You lose if a monster gets Beethro. You win when the room is clean of monsters (as you'd expect).

Now here are the elaborations to give it some meat! Dropping a sword on an orb would cause it to act. Opening and closing doors at the right times would be key to completing some rooms successfully. (Orbs and yellow doors don't go away when hit, just act as usual.) Tar needs to be hit at certain spots (as usual) to cause it to break as needed. Roach queens and tar mothers spawn only every so many moves (I'm thinking 10-20, but we'll have to get a feel for what works best based on "room size" ). Serpents are too tough, so they can't just move up (into "space" ) and eat you. Instead they just move back and forth on top of whatever objects they happen to be lying upon at the time (picture a side-view DROD, and how snakes would move there). Hitting a mimic potion allows placing a mimic anywhere, and it moves left and right as you do (its sword only points left and right). It, of course, stays around until stabbed. Green doors disappear whenever all monsters above them on the screen are removed. This would allow for multiple green doors opening at different times while playing the room.

You could have an overall DROD-like feel to the game, like a map screen for each "level" (set of rooms) where you select which room to play. New "rooms" would open up as old ones are cleared and you select which one to play next. (I'd expect most levels to feature only green doors, and maybe only the final one in a level would have a blue door that works basically like a green door.) Anytime you lose a room it gets reset and you go back to the map. It's probably also good to allow exiting play of a room at any time to return to the map.

I think this could be pulled off. I'd be excited to play a game like this (and design rooms)! Let's go for it!

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06-28-2003 at 05:59 PM
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bdcribbs
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Malarame wrote:
It isn't really a puzzle game, per se, but I recently found a program called Structural Engineering Challenge.

Fun program, horrid interface.

Took me a while to figure it out how to accomplish the target weights... right isoceles triangles are your friends.
06-29-2003 at 02:28 AM
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Mattcrampy
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My DRODtris idea is a bit more based on Tetris. There is a line about 1/3 of the way down, and when the highest piece is below this line, everything moves up. The playing field contains both DROD elements and regular 'blocks'. Beethro stands on the side of the screen and clears any rows. Blocks fall from the sky, occasionally including potions. The DROD elements move as normal, with various exceptions, and are killed by Beethro if you can trap them in a row. Trapdoors would act as unclarable blocks, but Beethro can clear half of it, depending on which side he's on. When you make a regular line, he does the other side. Of course, they'd move up, so it's no biggie.

What makes this difficult is if you put green doors or red doors in, of course. They'd probably go across the entire playing field, but I guess with a cunning layout they could go halfway across.

I like your map idea, but it may make things a bit long. My idea involves basically giving an entire level at once, with the blue door at the end blocking the stairwell (to which you feed a piece to exit the level), roughly corresponding to Dugan's Dungeon.

As for the 'Neather, well, I have two ideas, both as nasty as each other.

Matt

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06-30-2003 at 03:22 PM
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butsam
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Sierra's Dr. Brain series is awesome! I know they are not abandonware, unfortunately, but I think you can still get them all from Sierra for fairly cheap.

On another note, I can't stand Sierra since they changed management...talk about ruining a wonderful company.

Sam
07-09-2003 at 03:59 AM
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Mattcrampy
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Being a wayback Dr. Brain fan, I heartily suggest you go mainly fot the first three (the first two by the Sierra crew, and the first one that got shipped out, Lost Mind of Dr Brain). All three are very clever, and all three have different formats, which is nice.

The first one mainly concentrates on mathematics and logic, with some (but not much) in the way of word puzzles. The second is longer, harder, and contains a great mix of everything (including some chemistry!) These two are both in the style of Sierra's adventures, where you go from a starting point (with some deviation) all the way through to the end, following a mostly linear path.

The third one has a completely different design, with 10 puzzle 'areas'. Each one has a differnt theme, but they're basically the same type of puzzle, like 3D Consruction and Train of Thought. You solve a certain amount of puzzles, and your percentage meter goes up to 100% (faster on harder levels).

Bleh for my bad grammar.

Once you finish 9, the 10th opens up, and you finish that and you win. Once again, there's a fairly good mix, but a definite emphasis on logic and mazes.

I don't know about the most recent ones, but I'm inclined to think that it's not as good, simply because it's a different Sierra.

Bastards canned Space Quest 7. Oh well, there's always the fan version (Josh Mandel's writing it, so it's good enough for me.)

Matt

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07-10-2003 at 02:44 PM
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butsam
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There is a fan version of SQ7?!!! YAY!!!!!

In my opinion, Sierra IS Space Quest and King's Quest. So in my opinion, Sierra no longer exists. :(

Sam
07-11-2003 at 12:52 AM
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Mattcrampy
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As I've said, since Josh Mandel co-wrote SQ6, if the team are loyal enough I fully expect to be able to embrace the fan SQ7 as the sone Sierra didn't release. I want it burnt on a CD and in a box, if I can, but probably not.

Speaking of King's quest, and Josh Mandel for that matter, do a search for Tierra. Corny name, but they've put together a VGa remake of King's Quest 1 and 2 (2 is basically completely re-done), with Josh Mandel as King Graham (check your credits for KQ5. Guess who did Graham's voice?) KQ2VGA is worth a look, despite the fact they took my favourite bit out of the game. I loved opening up each new door. It was cool.

Matt

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07-11-2003 at 10:02 AM
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Oneiromancer
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I loved SQ6, although the puzzles were damn hard. I found out just a few weeks ago why...because Josh Mandel left the team and they had to finish it without really knowing where he wanted to go with everything. And I guess they almost forgot to include how to beat the copy protection in the box until he called in and asked how that part was going. It's all on some website somewhere.

I have downloaded both the KQ remakes, although I haven't played them yet. I beat the first one (the original, not the remake) a long time ago but never the second one. One of these days I will play the remakes...

Game on,

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07-11-2003 at 05:14 PM
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Mattcrampy
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Copy protection, copy protection... oh yes, that little bugger.

It was clever, but yeah. But the "other" copy protection puzzle, the one in the ship, was really really poor.

They knew what the general plot was going to be, but I reckon they were missing the middle bit. I think he was thinking they'd spend more time inside Santiago.

It's worth breaking open KQ2 original, mainly because they completely stripped out a lot of the puzzles in the original KQ2. The structure of the game is the same, but you'll find it just as hard because most areas (and indeed all the new ones) have new puzzles in them.

That, and for half of the puzzles what you're supposed to do is somewhat obvious anyway.

Matt

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07-12-2003 at 03:27 AM
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Oneiromancer
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As long as we're discussing Sierra games...

I played KQ 1, 5, and 6. I think I don't like the later ones especially, since it was really easy to totally screw yourself over and have to reload from an earlier save. The SQ games were much better at that. Of those, I played SQ 1 (official remake), 4 (first one I played), 5, and 6 (I loved the narrator!). I never played any Police Quest, but I did play Hero's Quests 1 (remake), 3, and 4. But 3 and 4 had some bad game-breaking bugs, which reduced my enjoyment of them. Someone recently remade Hero's Quest 1 in a rather more...bawdry manner. I only played a little bit, enough to get to the whorehouse. That was enough for me...although supposedly it is quite intelligent and well done. Perhaps some other time...

For other adventure games, my all time favorite is Grim Fandango. I also loved the Monkey Island games (played and beat all but the most recent one, "Escape From", just because I had to reinstall my OS and never started up again), Gabriel Knight 1, and I even enjoyed the book spin offs by Legend of Shannara, Companions of Xanth, and Death Gate. I remember playing Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy a very long time ago...scratch that, I tried to play it, but it was too damn hard. I never did play any Zork or any other text-based adventure game...they just weren't fun to me, even when that was all we had.

Enough nostalgia for now, I guess.

Game on,

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"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
07-12-2003 at 05:19 AM
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Caravel Forum : Other Boards : Electronic Games : Other good puzzle games
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