eytanz
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A pressure plate is like an orb, except that instead of hitting it with a sword, you need to step on it; it doesn't block anything's movement (except perhaps serpents)

Basically, orbs have the following limitations: they block Beethro and monsters, and they need the sword to be pointing in a certain direction. These are good for many puzzles, but it makes it difficult to have puzzles which involve Beethro opening and closing doors while fighting big hordes.

Some of these puzzles can be created using trapdoors and red doors, but these are limited in that they can never close a door, all the red doors open simultaneously, and that trapdoors block beethro and most monsters' movements once you step off.

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Oneiromancer
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Yeah, I think this would be a good idea. Also it would be cool if on one of the tilesets the pressure plates were almost invisible to make some real "traps" on those levels. Hey, it's not much different than spiders...once you know that they're around, they are pretty easy, but you can get surprised the first time.

Game on,

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agaricus5
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I'm not sure, but I think someone has already put this idea forward on the Sourceforge tracker.

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noman
Level: Master Delver
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Well it's a great idea. But i've a question:

How will they be triggered:

1)everytime you step on the plate
2)every turn you stand on a plate
3)everytime you step off a plate
4)everytime you step on or off a plate

Maybe more solutions should be available for the mapbuilder.

And i've another question:

Can they be triggered by monsters?(i assume yes)

mfg. noman

[Edited by noman on 07-25-2003 at 06:49 PM]

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krammer
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Every time you step on would be best. Every turn on the plate makes sense in terms of the physics, but if they were set to toggle you couldn't stand on the plate for long or the doors would be opening and closing all the time.

Actually, maybe that would be more fun. I dunno. What does everyone else think?

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trick
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
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krammer wrote:
Every time you step on would be best. Every turn on the plate makes sense in terms of the physics, but if they were set to toggle you couldn't stand on the plate for long or the doors would be opening and closing all the time.

That's how the orbs work, so it would be more consistent if the pressure plates did this too.

I don't think they should activate when stepping off, tho.

- Gerry

Oneiromancer
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Well, basically the pressure plates would be like orbs in that they either only open, only close, or toggle a door. Thus, if you step onto and then off of a toggle plate, it will work twice. Personally, I don't think that a toggle plate should toggle if you wait a turn on the plate, but that's just me. I also am not fond of plates that would activate upon leaving the plate, since that would add unnecessary confusion. It is probably best to have the action be intuitive: you step on the plate, and something happens. When you step off, it reactivates, and you have to step on it again to make it work.

But now that I think about it, this is actually slightly different from orbs. If you walk into an orb, while your sword is on it, the orb will be struck again. Also, when you wait with your sword on an orb, it will continually activate. So my vision of pressure plates is different than how orbs work, what noman is implying is that perhaps they should work the same as orbs...if you wait on them, they should continuously activate. However, I still think they shouldn't activate once you step off them (perhaps if you wait on a plate you can imagine Beethro jumping in place to reactivate it).

Game on,

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levelthirteen
Level: Master Delver
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If this were implemented, about half the rooms in level 25 could be rewritten without the 'neather.

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Scott
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I would think thats stepping off should leave it in the last state rather then toggling. Step on open door, step off door stays open. This is how I would think they should work.

Also can orbs and pressure plates work on the same doors or are pressure plate doors a different colour?

Mister
Level: Master Delver
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Basically, we can have four behaviors for each three actions: open /close/toggle/none on step in/step out/wait.

The game can allow only some combinations, or leave it to the architect to not use weird setups such as "open on step in, toggle on step out, close when wait".

By filling a room with plates that only "close on wait", it is possible to force Beethro to keep moving, without turning his sword. Of course, assuming that monsters don't activate the plates. Maybe it will be better to implement two types of plates: one that anyone can activate, and another that only Beethro can.

[Edited by Mister on 08-04-2003 at 05:58 PM]

billbuckner
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I really would like a monster activated plate that deactivated when it stepped off. It would pose some really mean timing puzzles.

zex20913
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I don't think we want to get too devious with this idea. The purpose is to attract people to the game, not deter them. The overall objective of the game is to know what will happen after every move Beethro makes. Having the activation when stepping off is counter-intuitive, and I don't think it should be in for Beethro, let alone monsters. I'm wrestling with the idea of toggling when Beethro stands on the plate, because there's the counter-intuitiveness again, but it would separate the plate's function from the orb's a bit more than simply step-on activation. But definitely no monster step-off activation.

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ErikH2000
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zex20913 wrote:
Having the activation when stepping off is counter-intuitive, and I don't think it should be in for Beethro, let alone monsters.

If stepping off always caused the opposite thing to happen as when you stepped on, perhaps it would be intuitive. In the editor you would only be allowed to specify actions for activation, because deactivation actions (when you step off) are implied. Open -> close, close -> open, toggle -> toggle. Also, the animation and sound effects would support the idea that you push the plate down and after stepping off, it pops back up.

-Erik

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Mister
Level: Master Delver
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Shouldn't it be "toggle -> nothing" more intuitive?
Also, "close->nothing" and "open->nothing" seems ok, too.

The open->close and close->open behavior only make sense if monsters activate the plates. Maybe some behaviors for "monster plates" and others for "Beethro plates"?

ErikH2000
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Mister wrote:
Shouldn't it be "toggle -> nothing" more intuitive?
Also, "close->nothing" and "open->nothing" seems ok, too.

I guess I don't understand you. I visualize the pressure plate as some sort of springy button. While you stand on it, something with the doors happens. When you get off, it pops up again to its original state and whatever happened with the doors is also returned to its original state. So following that logic, if a door were opened after you got onto the plate, it would close (return to it's previous state) when you got off. And if it were closed, then it would open when you got off.

The open->close and close->open behavior only make sense if monsters activate the plates.

Oh, I don't know about that. How about this scenario?

Beethro wants to get into a chamber that has a closed door as its entrance. There is a pressure plate some distance away from the chamber that opens the door. But following my rules, Beethro can't simply stand on the plate and then go through the door, because as soon as he leaves the plate, the door closes. Beethro can use the plate to let a roach out of the chamber he can't get into, and then guide the roach to the plate. The roach stays on the plate due to the positioning of walls between it and Beethro. So the door is kept open by the roach and Beethro can get in.

Maybe some behaviors for "monster plates" and others for "Beethro plates"?

I would argue for consistency because it helps the player be able to predict what will happen.

-Erik

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