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Caravel Forum : DROD Boards : Holds : sam 8 (easy)
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2.1/10 (34 votes)
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Author Name:sam
Submitted By:sam3212
Hold Name:sam 8
Theme:easy
Author's Difficulty:
Number of Levels:5
Number of Rooms:40
Number of Monsters:2177
Version:DROD: The City Beneath (3.1)
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Hold Karma:0 (+0 / -0)
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File: sam 8.hold (34.6 KB)
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icon sam 8  
easy
11-20-2007 at 07:01 PM
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CuriousShyRabbit
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
After many software struggles on the HA end, here it is, finally!

This is Sam's hold that was approved by the HAs.
11-20-2007 at 07:07 PM
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bflatjeff
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icon Re: sam 8 (+1)  
I took a look at this, but I'm turned off instantly. I'm sorry, I'm just not going to play that ridiculous first room, with the busy work of travelling around to an unholy number of pressure plates. This one is not for me.

BbJ

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11-21-2007 at 05:31 AM
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Tahnan
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
bflatjeff wrote:
I took a look at this, but I'm turned off instantly. I'm sorry, I'm just not going to play that ridiculous first room, with the busy work of travelling around to an unholy number of pressure plates. This one is not for me.
I've cited it before: Tahnan's First Rule of Architecture: Don't Irritate the Player. This is indeed pretty tedious. (Though not as tedious as it looks at first.)

[EDIT: It turns out we were being unfair. You may think the first room is tedious, but oh, you won't understand tedium until you've seen the rest of the level.]

[Last edited by Tahnan at 11-21-2007 07:59 AM]
11-21-2007 at 07:37 AM
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Tahnan
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
...you know, as long as I'm complaining: I'm still only on the first room or so of level two, but:

* There've been a lot of really tedious rooms. Tedious in the sense of "there's no challenge here, nothing to figure out, just a whole lot of walking through them in irritatingly twisty paths".

* Then there's the random scripting. In the entrance room on Level 2, there's this "lock" that needs a key, not that there's any indication of that until you walk up to it; and the room-clear door that's (a) disguised as a tar door via extremely dark lighting, and (b) actually a room exit via scripting...that's really irritating. (See Tahnan's First Rule, above.)

* The fact that the entrances all have their default "entrance [number]" names suggests a serious lack of attention to detail.

I don't want to sound like I discourage new architects from exploring the possibilities of hold creation. It's just that I can't help wondering what kind of feedback Sam got on this hold--did anyone tell him that it's irritating and a little under-cared-for? Did he not put it out there for people to advise him; did he put it out there, but get no feedback; did he get feedback, but ignore it?

We've just had such a slew of high-quality holds show up here that seeing one this, well, this bad is all the more notable.
11-21-2007 at 10:33 AM
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reyll3
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Wait...i found a real "secret" read the secret text to know about it.
Click here to view the secret text

But...
Click here to view the secret text

Sam...could you fix that?

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11-21-2007 at 05:30 PM
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NoahT
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Sam, for future reference, you might want to consult this post for tips on good architecture.

-Noah

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11-21-2007 at 05:54 PM
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bomber50
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icon Re: sam 8 (+1)  
I've mastered this hold.

In it, there are hundreds of errors, glitches and bad designs.

Including..

Long, Tedious, Boring Rooms
Q+W rooms
Unknown Scripting (Teleporters, Seep + Wraithwing Player Roles)
Strange Scripting (Cutscenes in the entrance?)
Repeated Scripting (Missing "End" scripting)
Grammatical Errors (Captilization, L 1, etc.)
Darkness
Things on the edge (0,0 , for instance)
Repeated Puzzles
Lengthy Paths
Pointless Elements

I give this hold 3 brains and a 1 for fun.

The only reason anyone will probably bother playing this horrible hold is for highscores.


[Last edited by bomber50 at 11-22-2007 12:10 AM]
11-22-2007 at 12:09 AM
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Anson
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Sam, You participated in Werthimire city, right?
Then i think your a little experianced in scripting?
There are some holds with Scripting us puzzles, you could become a person who makes scripting puzzles!
Such as The Sunken Pyrimid, and Pelchlo's puzzles, plus, if you learn from other hold and play them, stuggling, yeah.
But you'll get more experiance,
I'm not telling he's bad but still. Was your 8th hold like this?
Or first hold?



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Please, I admire Guthix, I solve problems, I fix rules too. I used to be a Scoundril, Complaining about the forums, But now i changed.
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11-23-2007 at 09:30 AM
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MeckMeck GRE
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Anson wrote:
Was your 8th hold like this? Or first hold?

It's his first hold published on the holds board. On the architecture board you can find almost a dozen small holds made by him. He once released a whole bunch of them there.
12-16-2007 at 11:41 AM
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jbluestein
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Playing through this hold, I feel like I'm trapped in the Monty Python Cheese Shop sketch, which of course ends with the phrase "I was deliberately wasting your time."

Sorry...this hold did nothing (good) for me.

I give it 1 brain of difficulty and a 2 for fun.

Josh

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10-29-2009 at 02:37 PM
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Odyssey
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Ditto what jbluestein said. The entrance doesn't give that much of an appealing look, I must say - opening all those doors left me really bored. There is some puzzle element to this, but mostly hack and slash.

Good effort, but needed to be completely cooked in the architectural oven. I'm sure most would agree, too - the bar for the number of "1-rating" votes is maxed out.

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[Last edited by Odyssey at 11-01-2009 04:49 PM]
11-01-2009 at 04:48 PM
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BarryScott
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icon Re: sam 8 (+2)  
beginnign of hold is easy but the rests dificult. i dont understand, whys it 2 brains? i vote 7 and 10 for fun :?
11-07-2009 at 10:43 PM
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12th Archivist
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
BarryScott wrote:
beginnign of hold is easy but the rests dificult. i dont understand, whys it 2 brains? i vote 7 and 10 for fun :?
It was rated so lowly because people don't like random events occurring such as spontaneously morphing into a seep. They also don't like to hit an endless list of pressure plates over and over again. These things in a hold the people here call "tedious". The other holds on the holds board have none or very little of that, and are considered to have much higher quality by the people here.

Aside from that,
:hi to the forums, BarryScott! This is just of the many, many holds on the holds board. Check them out, they're all fun.

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Check out the DROD Wikia project here!

[Last edited by 12th Archivist at 11-08-2009 12:45 AM]
11-08-2009 at 12:44 AM
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blorx1
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
I wonder who this knew mysterious 1 voter is I know I mastered this this accursed hold and rated it a 1 fun and 1.5 brains.
I think the 1 voter's name starts with a B though ;)

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11-08-2009 at 04:50 AM
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Jatopian
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
12th Archivist wrote:
This is just of the many, many holds on the holds board. Check them out, they're all fun.
A penchant for overstatement, you have.

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Make your pressure plates 3.0 style!
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11-08-2009 at 06:06 AM
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Samuel
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Is there really any point in commenting on this hold when its creator has been inactive for two years?
Samuel.

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11-08-2009 at 06:18 AM
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Jatopian
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icon Re: sam 8 (+1)  
Of course - other people still see it on the Holds board and play it.

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11-08-2009 at 10:32 AM
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12th Archivist
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icon Re: sam 8 (+1)  
This is the last particularly bad hold I'm going to comment on for a while.

L 1: Entrance Not fun stepping on all those pressure plates.
L 1: Once North Dropping dozens of trapdoors. No challenge.
L 1: Once South More trapdoors. Even less of a challenge.
L 1: Once East There was no point in taking that journey.
L 1: Once West More running dozens of corridors, this time as a wraithwing instead of a seep! It's very easy to get trapped in one of the walls. Bad, bad scripting.
L 1: Once South (2nd time) The orb puzzle took no brains to figure out. Now, I just have to run through a few more corridors as a different player role. [sarcasm]Real fun.[/sarcasm]
L 1: Once North Once West I'm very happy I could Ctrl-5 my way through that room. Really, what was the point of that room?
L 1: Once North Once East With the force arrow placement, this room becomes trivial. It would have been an OK room, if not for the corridor waltzing.
L 1: Once South Once East Again, the force arrow placement makes the start and middle of this room insanely easy. Then comes the mindless Q-ing and W-ing to clear the monsters. Easy, kind of relaxing, but also trivial and boring.
L 1: Secret Room That's right, there is a secret room on this level. Easy, brainless hacking away at monsters.
L 1: Once South Once West The exit! Finally!
L 2: Entrance That puzzle was not fun.
L 2: Thrice North Cutting tarstuff. A lack of checkpoints and an overstock of carelessness makes this room very annoying. Oh yes, more long corridors.
L 2: Once West There's some buggy scripting in this room, as I could get both the big key and the 3 key, whatever that is. Also, the speaker can be killed.
L 2: Once East Easy. Oddly enjoyable, though.
L 2: Once South Once East Who scripted those citizens to follow the player when he bumped into them? Certainly not sam. Or was it?
L 2: Once South The scroll was really, really, confusing. I went left anyway.
help: Entrance A tutorial on teleportation? The transport only works once.
help: Once North So far, the colors that indicate transport capabilities are inconsistent.
help: Twice North "How". No idea.
help: Thrice North :blink I'm really confused now.
L 2: Once South (2nd time) The puzzle was easy, the corridor trek was boring, and the transports are unpredictable.
L 2: Once South Once West Easy puzzle. Confusing cutscene-induced Turn jumps that make walking through hot tiles impossible, half the time.
L 2: Twice South Once West Easy, albeit interesting puzzle. The pit-trapdoors used in the southwest portion of the room make the room look a bit unprofessional. Also, the room is boring by the last chamber.
L 3: Entrance Unusual for sure.
hotel: Once South ??? Why is there a hotel here? I'm getting really, really confused now.
L 3: Once East I'm glad I stumbled on the scripting spot early on. Really, though, there should be some designated spot to differentiate normal terrain from a scripted location.
L 3: Once South Twice East I don't even think what the citizen said was English, broken or otherwise.
L 3: Secret Room That room took me a while to solve. In my opinion, the best puzzle of the game so far. It looked really ugly, though.
L 3: Twice South Once East That was weird. Gel babies would work just as well as these custom characters.
L 3: Twice South Thrice East Finally! It's the hold exit! Woohoo!
L 3: Mastery Room Perhaps the most confusing, and ugly, room in the entirety of the hold. Easy to conquer, but rather pointless.

And I am done with the hold! Since I conquered it, mastered it, and conquered the mastery room (therefore, post-mastering it), I think I can finally make a fully educated opinion on this hold. In short, it's not fun. It's tedious, boring, and confusing all at the same time, with a very small number of fun or interesting rooms. This is my final opinion on the matter:

0.5 brains
1 fun
0/100 approval rating (avoid this hold)

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Check out the DROD Wikia project here!
06-13-2010 at 06:52 PM
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west.logan
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icon Re: sam 8 (0)  
Sam,

First the good:
The effort put into making the hold is admirable. There is a huge variety of components, being able to play as various creatures was a bonus (though buggy perhaps) and overall it was interesting.

However, there were many seemingly pointless "puzzles". Backtracking or having to cover a huge, huge train of red tiles just to get something to open was tedious. There was one set of yellow doors in particular where you had to open one, then go around and open another, which would allow you to open a third, then back to the first set and open another, the second, etc. etc. These aren't that fun. You know you have to get to the last one eventually and it's just mindless repetition to get there.

The scripting was interesting (making events happen so the bridge would be built, for example) and there were a couple of rooms I had to think a little bit about but overall it's not something I would be able to recommend. It looks like you had fun though and learned a bit as you were going, certainly more than I know!

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05-25-2011 at 06:45 PM
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