ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

Several people have already played through DROD: Journey to Rooted Hold displaying a freakishly overdeveloped smitemastery that leaves me speechless. I haven't even played through the whole game yet. Actually, now that things have died down a bit, I can play without worrying so much about things still left to fix, and its much easier to relax and enjoy it. For the growing crowd of experts that have run the gauntlet at breakneck speed and are searching around for something else to do, I give you...

...The Smitemaster's Selection

For each season of the year, we will present a new official hold built to high quality puzzlecrafting standards and fulling adhering to Eighth story canon. Everyone on CaravelNet will get the hold for free. You'll just go to your list of available holds and download it.

Spring 2005 Smitemaster's Selection

Sometime within the three months comprising Spring, we'll deliver an updated version of King Dugan's Dungeon to everyone on CaravelNet. It will be largely the same as the hold distributed with DROD: Architects' Edition, but there will be some additions. I expect that Beethro may have a few things to say in this update, as will the 'Neather. Perhaps there may be a few side passages that you missed on your first (or seventeenth) trip down.

Summer 2005 Smitemaster's Selection

We haven't planned a release for summer yet, but several respected authors are working on ambitious holds using the DROD 2.0 engine that shipped with Journey to Rooted Hold. "What about me?" you demand. "I want my hold to go on Smitemaster's Selection!" Okay, okay, I'm getting to that... just give me another few minutes to send this other post.

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

TripleM
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1377
Registered: 02-05-2003
IP: Logged

:O

wackhead_uk
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 352
Registered: 06-21-2004
IP: Logged

Finally this update is up. Now I can go and complete JtRH!

Wiz
Level: Goblin
Rank Points: 15
Registered: 05-13-2005
IP: Logged

i'm shivering 'cause of expectation ^^

silver
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 915
Registered: 01-18-2005
IP: Logged

almost there... I think you might mean "quiver with antici... pation".

gods help me for bringing THAT up here.


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rowrow
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 432
Registered: 08-17-2004
IP: Logged

When is the new kdd coming out? When it does, can someone please post about it? I don't want to get it way too late. I am waiting for everyone to say "Huh? It came out a long time ago!"

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B'hakhgra Du S'tra Moth'ness Ti!

Tscott
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 382
Registered: 02-10-2003
IP: Logged

Huh? It came out a long time ago!



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And I can recall our caravel: a little wicker beetle shell with four fine maste and lateen sails,
its bearings on Cair Paravel. O my love, O it was a funny little thing to be the ones to've seen.
-Joanna Newsom "Bridges and Balloons"

Sarngate
Level: Delver

Rank Points: 33
Registered: 01-09-2004
IP: Logged

Spring 2005 Smitemaster's Selection

Sometime within the three months comprising Spring, we'll deliver an updated version of King Dugan's Dungeon to everyone on CaravelNet.

Which three months comprise Spring in your part of the world?
How will we know when the Smitemaster's Selection has been made available?
Apologies for my impatience

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Don't eat with your mouth full!

ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

Without getting into arguments about what months comprise the various seasons, I'll just tell you within which months the various releases will probably be made:

January/February/March - Winter Smitemaster's Selection
April/May/June - Spring Smitemaster's Selection
July/August/September - Summer Smitemaster's Selection
October/November/December - Fall Smitemaster's Selection

We'll basically plan one release for each quarter of the year and give it the seasonal title for color, if not accuracy. Unless we miss our own deadlines, King Dugan's Dungeon will come out in June. I admit that is pretty close and there is a lot of other DROD stuff going on right competing for time. So it is possible it comes out in July and gets called "Summer 2005 Smitemaster's Selection".

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

b0rsuk
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 489
Registered: 11-23-2003
IP: Logged

So you have to pay for KDD now ? I think that's cheap.

If I export KDD from AE and release JTRH version myself, does it put me to the jail ?

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http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20051128/adams_01.shtml

ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

Somebody already did exactly what you suggested and it isn't a problem. KDD was released as public domain with AE. Do whatever you like with that KDD distributed with AE--my permission isn't even needed.

The KDD for JtRH has improvements to it that make it something separate. So there's going to be new voices, new rooms, and aesthetic improvements.

I'm a little dismayed that you are so quick to gripe. Our actions aren't taking anything away from you. If enough people demanded that KDD for JtRH must be completely free, even with improvements, we would simply leave you with the AE version and move on to something else.

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

b0rsuk
Level: Smiter

Rank Points: 489
Registered: 11-23-2003
IP: Logged

Yes, I know AE is public domain.
Then I put exporting KDD somewhere on my ever-expanding ToDo list.

I just know few people who would like to play KDD, but can't really stand AE graphics. Now I know that if I don't do it, I can't expect free KDD for JTRH.

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http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20051128/adams_01.shtml

silver
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 915
Registered: 01-18-2005
IP: Logged

ErikH2000 wrote:
Somebody already did exactly what you suggested

http://www.drod.net/forum/viewtopic.php?TopicID=6188

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Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged

I had a message here regarding my concerns about KDD being released as 'premium content'. I've removed it because rereading it, it looks too much like I'm trying to stir up a public fight, which wasn't what I was trying to do at all. It kind of reminds me of waking up in the morning and getting to see all the damage you did the night before when you didn't know what you were doing.

Ironically, the cold light of day is at this very second shining through my window. It's getting in my eyes.

I also think the words 'premium content' pretty much sum up my argument, so I figure to avoid an unintentioned fight, I'll just remove it.

I've been attempting to be very careful in the last couple of months not to represent myself as part of Caravel, or being qualified to speak for Caravel. This is partly because I don't interfere in Caravel's decisions unless specifically asked, and want to reflect that in my postings, and partly because I figure if I set this up ahead of time, I have plausible deniability when you all start shaking me to make secrets come out.


[Edited by Mattcrampy at Local Time:05-28-2005 at 10:47 PM]

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What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?

Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged

I'd like to point out that there are several reasons for a KDD release to be for CaravelNet subscribers only. First, there were 8 room styles in Webfoot and AE...2.0 has 1, but those who bought JtRH and have CaravelNet get 3 floor styles. It doesn't do much justice to KDD to only view it in one floor style. Second, one of the best reasons to have KDD released for 2.0 is to be able to compare high scores for it. But only CaravelNet enabled people have their high scores uploaded anyway. Third, the plan is to have lots of speech by Beethro, all voice-acted (hopefully by the same guy), as well as for the 'Neather and perhaps a goblin or two, and maybe even other stuff. In addition, there would probably be some additional hidden rooms and (total speculation here) maybe even an extra level for Masters. All this extra media content means that it should be a Smitemaster's Selection, because it's not going to be something as simple as just exporting the hold and maybe fixing a bug or two (like the inability to backtrack to that one room on Level 8 and other things).

However, having said that, it does appear that it would be in the best interest of everyone to release 2 versions of KDD: a basic export, such as is already available on the Architecture board, but with a bit more care to make sure it works perfectly, and to fix the bugs. Nothing more, nothing less, just something that can be played just like in AE or Webfoot. Then, the SS version of KDD would be released, with all of the extra bonuses. Since only CaravelNet people can upload high scores, once this version is released, only demos from the SS version will be accepted on the high scores pages (until then, the bare-bones version would have high scores enabled). Ideally all the original room demos and scores would be converted perfectly, since the addition of scripted speeches shouldn't affect the demos.

This is all my opinion, a suggestion for what could be done; I'm not trying to speak as an official representative. I'm not sure how possible all of the high score conversion is; I would think that as long as the name is kept the same, then DROD would just see it as an upgraded version and would check the demo integrity as usual.

Game on,

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"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams

mrimer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 5120
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

Oneiromancer wrote:
This is all my opinion, a suggestion for what could be done

Yes, this sounds rather close to what we're planning.

I'm not sure how possible all of the high score conversion is; I would think that as long as the name is kept the same, then DROD would just see it as an upgraded version and would check the demo integrity as usual.

FYI, hold matching is more sophisticated than just matching the name. There's an ID system that marks each created hold as unique. It is possible to import player progress from one version of the same hold to another, but just creating another hold with the same name won't match. In fact, the name is irrelevant.

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Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.

Tablesaw
Level: Delver

Rank Points: 33
Registered: 05-14-2005
IP: Logged

Will Smitemaster's Selection holds remain available after their release, or will they only be available in the seasonal window?

The way people in the know have been talking about the King Dugan's Dungeon Grandmaster Flash Remix, it seems that they're going to be permanent, but I haven't seen the question answered specifically.

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It's the saw of the table!

Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged

I'm sure I saw something mentioned, but I can't find it. I'm not going to speculate with what I know, since that's only ever ended in tears.

No, seriously, it happens all the time. You could set your watch by the amount of times I'm wrong.

(Which probably means I'm covered no matter what I say - if I say something, it's to be read that I'm always wrong and thus it should be the opposite, and if I'm right, well, no problem.

Except I just said that, which means it's wrong. Damn.)

____________________________
What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?

Wiz
Level: Goblin
Rank Points: 15
Registered: 05-13-2005
IP: Logged

i apologize deeply for my vocabulary actually i won't stay cause i need to whip myself anyway,in my opinion KDD being improved is fair enough to be for suscribers only,'cause if you play drod a lot you'll appreciate the work caravel did (particullary on JtRH) and as long as i'm concerned i did buy JtRH because i strongly support the developping of drod,and,unless you appreciate this work as well as i do,you won't be thrilled to play spefically THAT hold,hence you wouldn't give your support anyway.I as a player am particullary satisfied with how drod world works,you get access to lot of things and if you are particulary enthusiastic you can buy the final product,and besides,it really isn't THAT expensive.(Im sure you guys had a hard time creating the game )

about the highscores,that got out of my mind : i suggest 2 pages being created,and people scoring on one or the other version can't score on the second ; that may be be heavy to set up but i think it's fair

[Edited by Wiz at Local Time:06-05-2005 at 06:42 PM: forgot the highscore thingy]

eytanz
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2708
Registered: 02-05-2003
IP: Logged

Tablesaw wrote:
Will Smitemaster's Selection holds remain available after their release, or will they only be available in the seasonal window?

I don't know the official answer (though I'd be very surprised if it's no), but I can tell you that, personally, I won't be making any smitemaster's selection holds unless I can be assured that they'll remain available - I don't want to put a lot of hard work into a hold to have it disappear after 3 months. I think many other authors would feel the same.

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I got my avatar back! Yay!

gamer_extreme_101
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1939
Registered: 03-07-2004
IP: Logged

As a complete non-Caravel employee, I'm going to take a stab in the dark that they will always be avaliable in the new CaravelNet download area on the main page. The one thing iI don't know is what will happen when you subscription expires, but I'm sure that you could email Erik and get it from him.

Remember, though, this is only my two cents, and my opinions do not have any hard evidence to back them up.

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--That guy with a million different aliases since he doesn't like this name anymore.

ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

gamer_extreme_101 wrote:
they will always be avaliable in the new CaravelNet download area on the main page.

Yeah, it should be like this. There are no plans to hide Smitemaster's holds away after they are released, and I can't see any way that it would help us. So really there's no need to worry about it.

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

gamer_extreme_101
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 1939
Registered: 03-07-2004
IP: Logged

So, if you are using that method, that means that if you aren't a subscriber to CaravelNet at the time a hold is released, you will be able to pick it up when you join CaravelNet, or will the holds you get be limited to the time you buy a subscription?

____________________________
--That guy with a million different aliases since he doesn't like this name anymore.

ErikH2000
Level: Legendary Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2794
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

gamer_extreme_101 wrote:
if you aren't a subscriber to CaravelNet at the time a hold is released, you will be able to pick it up when you join CaravelNet

This one.

-Erik

____________________________
The Godkiller - Chapter 1 available now on Steam. It's a DROD-like puzzle adventure game.
dev journals | twitch stream | youtube archive (NSFW)

Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster

Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged

Oh Maggie. I was right for once.

Hence demonstrating that I say wrong things all the time - including the fact that I'm wrong all the time. It's a brainbender.

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What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?

Malarame
Level: Master Delver
Rank Points: 220
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged

Mattcrampy wrote:
Oh Maggie. I was right for once.

Wow, that's not something you see everyday. Quick, someone take a screenshot so we remember this!

This whole thing is a great idea... I can't wait until we have a few releases. Plus, at the rate I complete holds, I'm never going to have to wait between finishing one hold and starting the next. I'll probably always have at least one on deck.

____________________________
Matt O'Leary
Webb Institute
Class of 2007

"I never forget a face, but in your case I'll be glad to make an exception."
-Groucho Marx