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Daverd
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File: Dick of a Hold Part II.hold (3.1 KB)
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icon My first upload (Dick of a Hold Part II) (+3)  
I just made this hold for a friend and thought maybe others might enjoy it. It's only got four puzzle rooms so it's pretty short, but I think it does some interesting things.

This is the second in a two-part series. I haven't uploaded the first one yet, maybe I will at some point.

Sorry for the hold name, it's kind of a running joke between me and my friend.
01-04-2019 at 03:23 AM
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Insoluble
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File: Dick of a Hold Part II.demo (20.4 KB)
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icon Re: My first upload (Dick of a Hold Part II) (+2)  
Neat hold so far. I've attached some demos you can take a look at. There are unintended things you can do in each room (mostly, killing the slayer), but some of these are not so bad. The slayer appears in all these rooms, but only appears to serve a real purpose in the final room. There are several fairly well known methods for killing slayers these days so I just used those to avoid having him pester me. There is also a real scarcity of checkpoints. I'd recommend adding some to each room in locations that you are pretty sure the player can walk past when solving the room optimally, but can skip if they want to.

1W: This was probably my favorite room. I'm not usually a fan of tight timers, but in this case I like how you could logically reason out exactly what you needed to do in order to trap the queen at (8,8) and that there was a separate trick that you can also logically reason out in order to get the tar mother in time.

It is possible to solve the room by trapping the queen elsewhere then manipulating her to (8,8) afterwards for the kill (I recorded both solutions as separate demos). You can probably prevent this by including more force arrows trapping the queen in other parts of the room, but would need to ditch the slayer as well since the slayer can be manipulated to stab the queen in these areas. the slayer doesn't add too much to the room since he can both be killed and since the first solution requires fairly precise movements for which the slayer isn't really an issue.

I'd recommend adding checkpoints around the two tunnels, and probably in row 8 somewhere.

1S1W: A fairly standard horde room. Some people enjoy being pestered constantly by the slayer while you try to solve a room, but many of us don't, so it's nice that you can just dispose of him. I like the snake mechanism used to make sure the player has to survive a few waves. It did go on for a tiny bit longer than I would have liked, but that kind of thing is subjective. Checkpoints around the snake stabbing areas (say, (11,6) and (15,13) would be greatly appreciated.

1S2W: Really nice multi-mimic puzzle. I enjoyed working on this, but it's not too hard to do the two mimics separately just by leaving the spear mimic towards the southern end of the room. Still, to optimize the room players will probably have to coordinate them. I like that the pickax mimic and his mirror can both go on either plate adding some flexibility to the room.

As it is, players who play this room can get a trivial #1 score just by exiting since there are no monsters or anything. This will make it so that the room automatically doesn't record high scores on the high score table, which is a shame. I'd encourage you to put a conquer token in the room at (31,4) on the last yellow door. That way the player can't just place a mimic on it and must step on it to exit the room to the north and the high score should actually reflect the most efficient solution.

I would also recommend using trapdoors instead of force arrows on the two weapon tokens, as the weapon tokens are pretty hard to read with arrows on top of them. This could also use a checkpoint or two in less out-of-the-way spots. Say maybe (22,11) and maybe one in each of the mimic areas.

2W: This was a fairly straightforward slayer manipulation room. There are some fairly common techniques for slayer manipulation that you can use to get him on the pressure plate without needing either the spear or time token. You need the time token for the second plate though naturally. I suspect you intended for me to use both time clones to manipulate the slayer, possible with the use of the spear to stab him. I'm not sure if there's any way to enforce that though unfortunately. This is also a room that would need a conquer token or at least one enemy to avoid players getting a trivial #1 score.

All in all this was an nice set of rooms though. Especially the first and third room. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing more architecture from you!

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[Last edited by Insoluble at 01-04-2019 04:58 AM]
01-04-2019 at 04:48 AM
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Daverd
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icon Re: My first upload (Dick of a Hold Part II) (+2)  
I watched your demo and you managed to break pretty much all of the rooms in ways I hadn't intended, so well done there. :) I'll take your suggestions into advisement, especially about the conquer tokens. Thanks for the feedback!
01-04-2019 at 12:31 PM
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Daverd
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File: Dick of a Hold Part II.hold (3.1 KB)
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License: Public Domain
icon Re: My first upload (Dick of a Hold Part II) (0)  
Here's version 2.

I added more checkpoints to rooms 1 and 2, added roaches to 3 and 4 (I prefer this over conquer tokens), made room 2 less of a grind by removing one roach and giving less spawn space to another, and added force arrows to room 4 to prevent your solution, which I consider a loophole to my intended one.

I decided to leave your alternate solution to room 1 as viable, because I thought it was clever, and I like to reward that. It's also suboptimal in terms of number of moves, so I don't really consider it a loophole.


01-05-2019 at 03:23 AM
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Chaco
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File: chaco_the_dick.demo (6.4 KB)
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icon Re: My first upload (Dick of a Hold Part II) (0)  
Here's some demos for version 2. Most of what I'd like to say has been covered by Insoluble already but here's some extra comments:

1W: As mentioned, if you want to prevent using the Slayer to kill the roach queen you'll need something more robust. Having a separate little force arrow trap with a roach in it that the Slayer has to be used for might be the simplest method.

1S1W: I did this room the long and boring way. Definitely not going to win any highscores with this method but at least it's easier than manually stabbing the rattlesnake. Creates some other issues with roach bottlenecking though.

1S2W: Easiest room in the hold, if you kill the Slayer. Leaving him alive doesn't make this room harder, just more annoying, but it would be possible to enforce with a Slayer cubicle as with 1W.

2W: It's probably a good idea to add a green door to the north edge of the room so the player has to kill the roach to escape. Otherwise people will still trivialize the highscores for this room by leaving to the north, then coming back in and killing the roach and leaving.

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01-06-2019 at 09:55 PM
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