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DimWiddy
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That's odd. Anyways, here's a new replay for you of my room. Hope this works. It also seems to have removed all the checkpoints I added in this version of the hold, so feel free to add them yourself if you consider it necessary.

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11-09-2015 at 04:36 AM
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disoriented
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DimWiddy wrote:
That's odd. Anyways, here's a new replay for you of my room. Hope this works. It also seems to have removed all the checkpoints I added in this version of the hold, so feel free to add them yourself if you consider it necessary.


The demo still doesn't work, at least not for me.

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11-09-2015 at 04:53 AM
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DimWiddy
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What in the world? As far as I know, my original replay worked for jamesdenem, so I have no idea why it wouldn't work here. Jamesdenem, would you mind telling us if my original replay didn't work for you? If it didn't, then I might have a problem with something in the way DROD is set up for me. Could it be that I don't have CaravelNet, perhaps?

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11-09-2015 at 05:01 AM
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jamesdenem
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When I downloaded your hold, DimWiddy, and went to edit it, it showed up under your own player profile. I believe when you originally posted your hold, you may have accidentally used your own player profile to create the hold and demo.

The version I uploaded was under the Various Architects profile provided, which I guess is not compatible with your demo.

Also, truth be told, I didn't look at your demo, preferring to try to solve it for myself.

If needed, I could record a demo and upload it.

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11-09-2015 at 05:10 AM
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DimWiddy
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jamesdenem wrote:
When I downloaded your hold, DimWiddy, and went to edit it, it showed up under your own player profile. I believe when you originally posted your hold, you may have accidentally used your own player profile to create the hold and demo.

The version I uploaded was under the Various Architects profile provided, which I guess is not compatible with your demo.

Also, truth be told, I didn't look at your demo, preferring to try to solve it for myself.

If needed, I could record a demo and upload it.


Yeah, I did use my own profile by accident that time, but this time I used the Various Architects profile. I don't know why it isn't working. Perhaps it would be best for you to record a demo, since I don't want to clutter up this thread with me trying to get my replays to work. Thanks!

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11-09-2015 at 05:21 AM
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jamesdenem
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File: Variations 9 Demos.zip (2.7 KB)
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Hopefully these demos will work.

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11-09-2015 at 02:11 PM
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blorx1
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I hate to be this guy, but I kind of wanted to use a slightly different frame for my room that allows for the possibility of interdependence of adjacent rooms. I know this is definitely not what you're going for, but I kind of want to do it anyway.

Any architects who want to avoid the interdependence could easily avoid the issue by just cutting a couple holes in some walls, but I want to leave my room open to the possibility for the sake of seeing what happens.

If this seems okish, I'll post my room and if not, I can twist it back into a more normal room easily enough. Hopefully this is reasonable though.

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11-09-2015 at 07:29 PM
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Xindaris
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New demos work, jamesdenem, thank you. Also please remember if you push "Export all" you can get all the demos from the hold into a single file, which is the "lumped up" file that I'll need when all the hold's rooms are done.


blorx1, would you mind posting it and letting me take a look so I know what you're talking about? In theory we could call a pair of directly connected/related rooms a "room" with a single puzzle involving going between them, like that one place with the tar in DROD 1 level 24 but maybe not terrible like that pair-room is, and everyone could copy-paste both to vary it. I'm not sure if that's what you're talking about doing though.

Really the main point of the "framing" is so the player can pick which order they want to do the variations in.

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 11-09-2015 09:53 PM]
11-09-2015 at 09:47 PM
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Chaco
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blorx1, I think you could probably achieve a similar effect by using a staircase that goes to a new level entrance that is inside the same room, inside the frame. That would avoid any room boundary issues and make it easy to navigate a level without having to cross over passages.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 11-10-2015 01:26 AM : changed plural to singular to hopefully reduce everyone's workload in the future]
11-10-2015 at 01:25 AM
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blorx1
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What I was originally hoping the level to end up as would be a bizzare sort of mutliroom puzzle created by multiroom puzzle stitched together from multiple architects.

That idea is just kind of hard to implement and while I'd be interested in doing it, it's probably worth saving for some other experimental cooperative hold. So yeah, I'll probably just make something normal.

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11-10-2015 at 04:16 AM
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blorx1
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File: Variations 7 blorx1.zip (2.8 KB)
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Here's a room. It's solvable, but I don't know what you'll do with it. I'm sure you guys will think of something.

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11-10-2015 at 05:48 AM
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Chaco
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File: V7b1 Variations on blorxery 1E Victory.demo (14 KB)
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Here's a completely different way of solving the same blorx1 room. Not sure if it's intended, but maybe it'll be inspiration for making a different room.

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11-10-2015 at 05:11 PM
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Insoluble
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File: Variations 8 Insoluble.zip (2.9 KB)
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Okay, here's my attempt at a room. It's probably a lot easier than the others posted so far. It's also probably broken (well, it's intended to be somewhat open at least, but there may very well be a solution that's overly simple.)

EDIT: Sorry. Nuntar pointed out in chat that I have a bunch of extra rooms attached to this unnecessarily. Please feel free to get rid of those or ignore them completely. I just had them there to test out how the room would look like with multiple copies adjacent to each other.

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[Last edited by Insoluble at 11-11-2015 02:18 PM]
11-11-2015 at 02:48 AM
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disoriented
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Easy is good. It gives the other participants a chance to twist it in weird ways :devil

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11-11-2015 at 03:46 AM
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Xindaris
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Yeah, remember Easy Way/Hard Way/Harder Way/Hardest Way?

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11-11-2015 at 04:02 AM
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DimWiddy
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Nuntar, I was able to open the gate to the brain and have the Stalwart kill it, then just kill the Aumtlich and then the brain. Was that the intended solution?

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11-12-2015 at 02:00 AM
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disoriented
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[Post Deleted] Nuntar wrote:
Well that was a silly oversight. Let's see if this works better.

Remember to include your demo :)

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11-12-2015 at 03:33 AM
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Xindaris
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I have the idea of putting a "secret" room behind blue level-clear doors in each of the levels, and putting the "End hold" stairs in the level select place behind a mastery wall, so that players end the hold only after beating all of the levels.

How about if, when the levels have had all the 'normal' rooms added to them, the person who made the original version "decorates" the entrance (don't put an actual puzzle there, just some stylistic stuff), being sure to include a set of stairs somewhere, and adds/decorates the secret room (I don't think those should have puzzles either, but I'm open to opinions on that)?

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11-12-2015 at 04:27 PM
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Chaco
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Mastery doors only open after the hold is conquered, even if the player has conquered all the secret rooms.

It's probably simpler to just put blue doors and stairs in each of the existing level entrances the original architects made, then make a hub structure similar to other compilation holds or "levels to be done in any order" hold, have that be the main entrance level that people arrive at when they start a new game, and thus have the hold only conquerable once all the levels are done.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 11-12-2015 04:57 PM]
11-12-2015 at 04:49 PM
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Nuntar
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Indeed -- see Elemental Showcase 5.0 for an example of how it's done.

I fixed another US in my version of Chaco's room. Let's try this again ;)

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11-12-2015 at 05:18 PM
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Xindaris
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Really? I thought the mastery doors opened once the secret rooms were cleared regardless. Whoops!

But I want the player to be able to return to the hub without clearing a level or restoring, too. I don't recall the elemental showcase having that, but the advanced concepts holds did, so something like that would work.

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[Last edited by Xindaris at 11-12-2015 05:47 PM]
11-12-2015 at 05:46 PM
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Chaco
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File: V4C Reaching a Brain Behind A Gate 1N1E Victory.demo (1.6 KB)
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I'm not sure if I found something unintended, or just overcomplicated the room. Regardless, enjoy.

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11-12-2015 at 05:52 PM
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Xindaris wrote:
But I want the player to be able to return to the hub without clearing a level or restoring, too.


Having played through a few compilation holds I tend to agree with this. I'd rather players be able to do each level piecemeal and not have to clear a whole level before being able to return to the hub. One solution to this is to put two sets of exit stairs in each level. The first set returns you to the hub as normal. The second is behind and returns you to the hub in a way that allows you to kill a monster in a required room that is otherwise inaccessible. This is the way things were done in Advanced Concepts if I recall correctly.

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11-12-2015 at 06:06 PM
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disoriented
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Let's make some of the harder rooms unrequired (or secret), so the player can complete the hold first, then restore to try some of the trickier areas.

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11-12-2015 at 06:16 PM
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Xindaris
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So, just as some housekeeping, here's a progress report of what we've done so far (who's worked on each "numbered" hold):

#1: Xindaris,
#2: (nothing yet)
#3: Someone Else, Chaco, disoriented
#4: Chaco, disoriented, Nuntar,
#5: disoriented,
#6: (nothing yet)
#7: blorx1
#8: Insoluble
#9: DimWiddy, jamesdenem,
#10: jamesdenem, Xindaris,

I've actually built my variation of DimWiddy's but put off and until today forgot about the demo and exporting, whoops.

But in particular, it seems as originals go we're only missing Nuntar's (unless I skipped a post somewhere) and Jacob's; Nuntar has worked on Chaco's original so I know they're around. I haven't seen Jacob in this topic yet at all so I might send him a PM soon to see if he remembers this/noticed the link here.

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11-18-2015 at 10:51 PM
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Chaco
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I've also already built variations for all rooms except #2 and #6. I'm holding off on posting them until my number comes up in the sequential order for each level, though.

If anybody wants me to do that anyway, go ahead and ask.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 11-18-2015 11:22 PM]
11-18-2015 at 11:21 PM
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DimWiddy
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Chaco wrote:
If anybody wants me to do that anyway, go ahead and ask.


I'm very interested in seeing your variation for my room (#9)!

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11-18-2015 at 11:35 PM
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Chaco
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File: Variations 1 Xindaris v2.zip (4.1 KB)
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Alright, here they come!

Here's Variations #1 (Xindaris), with a demo. The new room is in 2E. Some simple changes, but effective in making the room play differently.

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[Last edited by Chaco at 11-19-2015 12:08 AM]
11-18-2015 at 11:45 PM
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Chaco
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File: Variations 5 disoriented v2.zip (4.2 KB)
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Here's Variations #5 (disoriented), with a demo. The new room is in 1N1E. Features a new use for the snake cages.

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11-19-2015 at 12:09 AM
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Chaco
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File: Variations 7 blorx1 v2.zip (2.9 KB)
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Here's Variations #7 (blorx1), with a demo. The new room is in 2E. This room features a mimic, and a goblin that has to be held still - the problem space is both smaller and bigger at the same time, but hopefully it should become clear what principle is necessary here.

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11-19-2015 at 12:11 AM
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