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DGM
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icon The Dungeon (Partial editor for testing) (+10)  
As this is the only place I know of where people have ever heard of "Tower of the Sorcerer," I thought you all might like to know that I'm working on a puzzle game done in the same style. The alpha demo is ready to go, and contains a 10-level tutorial dungeon and a 10-level real dungeon.

EDIT: I now have my own site for the game at: www.dungeon-games.com

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[Last edited by DGM at 06-08-2007 04:04 AM]
01-22-2007 at 01:11 AM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (+1)  
On another forum, a user with a slower computer complained about the demo's speed. Hence I've tweaked the demo to run faster and changed the link in the first post to point to the new version.

If you tried the first demo and found it unbearably slow, please try this new version and let me know if it runs any faster. If the last version worked fine for you, you needn't bother with this one as there are no gameplay changes.

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01-22-2007 at 06:29 PM
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mrimer
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (new, faster version) (0)  
DGM, cool game! :thumbsup As I wrote before here somewhere, I like this game style a lot. I completed both the Tutorial and Main game. Below are some comments. You've probably already noticed, considered, or have plans for all of these, but I'll just throw them out anyway.

+:good, -:bug, ?:optional fix

+ It's good to have the monster stats and fight predictions onscreen at all times
+ I like having 15x15 rooms
+ The bribe system is cool. I'm hoping there's an item added that will let you reestablish credibility with innocents after losing it (or, say, you regain this automatically by beating each 10th level boss), so this interesting game mechanic isn't a one-shot deal for an entire dungeon
- Orb of Shielding -- when picked up, the monster stats boxes on the bottom aren't updated
- In L4 -- the sword power up scroll is called a "Scroll of Healing" in the text, but should be "Scroll of Attack" or something.
? Stairs -- when standing on one, I'd prefer they don't (re)activate on wall bump
? Tutorial end -- I'd prefer this go back to main menu automatically rather than exit game
? I'd like more than two save slots. Also, when loading, I'd like to see what each slot is storing w/o me actually loading it.
? Would like a confirmation prompt to exit when pressing ESC. (I'm used to pressing ESC to exit the menu choices, not space, and it's shocking to lose progress because I automatically hit the wrong key.)
? Title screen - would like one rather than just dialog box on startup

I'd like to play more of this!

Also, would you point me to the other forum(s) where you're expoing your game? I'd like to see what other discussion takes place about your game or Tower of the Sorcerer in general.

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01-22-2007 at 07:20 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (new, faster version) (+1)  
mrimer wrote:
DGM, cool game! :thumbsup As I wrote before here somewhere, I like this game style a lot.

Thanks! Yeah, translation and interface issues aside, I'm surprised TOTS is virtually unheard of. I haven't seen anything else quite like it.


+:good, -:bug, ?:optional fix

+ It's good to have the monster stats and fight predictions onscreen at all times

Agreed. If I had more room, I'd have included projections for what the fight costs would have been after gaining x additional offense and/or defense points (something I always wanted in TOTS).


+ I like having 15x15 rooms

Technically 13x13, as the outer walls are just there to clearly demarcate the playing area and are impenetrable. But that's still 48 more tiles to play in than TOTS's 11x11 rooms.


+ The bribe system is cool. I'm hoping there's an item added that will let you reestablish credibility with innocents after losing it (or, say, you regain this automatically by beating each 10th level boss), so this interesting game mechanic isn't a one-shot deal for an entire dungeon

Becoming a murderer was actually intended to be permanent, so definitely no free and automatic reset. However, I suppose I could include a scroll type that does the job. The mana cost would have to be sufficiently steep, though... Getting the merchant's gear without having to gather the money first is a big advantage.


- Orb of Shielding -- when picked up, the monster stats boxes on the bottom aren't updated

Are you sure? I just re-ran the tutorial to check this and the fight cost updated properly.

To clarify: the monster's mana-kill stat doesn't change, just as its offense stat doesn't change when you increase your defense. Only the fight cost (right column) changes.


- In L4 -- the sword power up scroll is called a "Scroll of Healing" in the text, but should be "Scroll of Attack" or something.

Whoops! Behold the dangers of cut-&-paste. That should have been "Scroll of Enchant Weapon." I changed the text, so it should be correct after the next version gets released.


? Stairs -- when standing on one, I'd prefer they don't (re)activate on wall bump

That's sort of intentional, so that you can turn around and go back if you can't step off the stairs safely (floor 46 in TOTS had a Magician right by the stairs up). However I agree that it's way too easy to bounce back and forth by accident. Maybe I can end or delay movement right after taking a flight of stairs so you have a chance to stop or change direction.


? Tutorial end -- I'd prefer this go back to main menu automatically rather than exit game
? I'd like more than two save slots. Also, when loading, I'd like to see what each slot is storing w/o me actually loading it.

Some of this - the save slots in particular - came about because I didn't make those parts of the game until after I realized I needed to scrap the code and restart. After that it was a question of getting something playable out the door so I could start getting feedback without spending days fleshing out something that was going to get thrown away and replaced soon anyway. Thus I took the path of least resistance and used Game Maker's built-in message menu (which only allows 3 buttons) for these things.

The final version will have many more (perhaps unlimited) saves.


? Would like a confirmation prompt to exit when pressing ESC. (I'm used to pressing ESC to exit the menu choices, not space, and it's shocking to lose progress because I automatically hit the wrong key.)

I might be able to manage that.


? Title screen - would like one rather than just dialog box on startup

See previous statement.


Also, would you point me to the other forum(s) where you're expoing your game? I'd like to see what other discussion takes place about your game or Tower of the Sorcerer in general.

Certainly. The only other forum I've posted the game in so far is the Game Maker forum (Game Maker 6.1 is the IDE I used to make this). The site is at:
www.gamemaker.nl

The thread for the demo is at:
http://forums.gamemaker.nl/index.php?showtopic=271042&st=0&p=1882528&#entry1882528

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01-22-2007 at 08:20 PM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (new, faster version) (+1)  
I like this so far. One bug: I can't save with the keyboard. I can click on the "S", but I can't get the cursor on it with the arrow keys. Otherwise, I agree with mrimer, especially about ESC. :-O
01-22-2007 at 08:45 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (new, faster version) (0)  
michthro wrote:
I like this so far. One bug: I can't save with the keyboard. I can click on the "S", but I can't get the cursor on it with the arrow keys. Otherwise, I agree with mrimer, especially about ESC. :-O

I see what you mean. I'm not sure why that's happening, but I'm looking into it.

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01-22-2007 at 08:52 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (new, faster version) (+1)  
Got it. Somehow the save button had been flagged as a 'solid' object, causing it to deflect the cursor.

It's been fixed, so the next version should handle it properly.

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01-22-2007 at 09:10 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 3, now with bug fixes!) (+1)  
Version 3 is up. Changes are as follows:

Added simple title screen.

Corrected the name of the "Scroll of Enchant Weapon" (used to read "Scroll of Heal")

Hitting the walls no longer causes you to retake the stairs.

Fixed bug that prevented you from selecting the save button with the keyboard.

Conquering either dungeon returns you to the main menu rather than ending the game.

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01-22-2007 at 11:28 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 3, now with bug fixes!) (0)  
I apologize, but I couldn't implement an exit confirmation for the escape key. Or rather I could, but Game Maker apparently has a very disturbing bug that made me decide not to.

When I switch off the default option to have ESC quit the game, it also shuts off all the normal ways of ending the game as well, namely selecting 'close' or hitting the 'x' button at the upper-right corner of the window. The documentation says that the 'x' button should have the same effect that I program ESC to, but in fact it stops doing anything.

I don't know what's going on, but since this isn't coming from my code I can't fix it. And I don't want to risk messing anything up this way. So, sorry guys, but no exit confirmation.


EDIT: Here's what I can do. When I redo the code, I'll add an auto-save feature that kicks in every time you open a menu. You'll still have to reload, but you won't lose any progress.

Would that help?

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[Last edited by DGM at 01-23-2007 02:06 AM]
01-22-2007 at 11:33 PM
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zex20913
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 3, now with bug fixes!) (+1)  
This TotS genre game does very well for what it is. I like the new elements (ranged attack, bribe system, mana points), and appreciate the homage to TotS in the first room. One thing you might want to consider, instead of negative mana, is a health depletion instead of a mana depletion when you have 0 mana. I'm sure you already have though, and dismissed it. Another: You have a finite amount of helping lips. Maybe you could create some other lips that don't disappear after they speak? I have no idea if that's possible, but it would save corridor space (not that that's needed) in the tutorial.

Both dungeons are totally completable, and if you like TotS, you'll like this too. I'd hate to see what Larrymurk can do with this sort of game. Drive me crazy, probably.

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01-23-2007 at 04:12 AM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 3, now with bug fixes!) (+1)  
Good news, everyone! You'll be delivering a package to the murderous Robot Santa at his base on Neptu -

Oops, wait. Wrong group. Let's try that again.


Good news, everyone! After asking for some help in the Game Maker forums, I've been handed a way to make the game window work properly with the default escape function turned off. I still don't understand why it doesn't work like the documentation says it should, but you guys will get that escape confirmation after all.

New version will be up in a few moments.

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01-23-2007 at 02:04 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (+1)  
Version 4 is up. Changes:

You are asked to confirm when quitting the game by pressing escape or otherwise closing the window.

Graphics fix: while in battle, the stat panel was showing the mana symbol instead of the offense symbol. Corrected.

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01-23-2007 at 02:15 PM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (0)  
Just wondering: Is there going to be plot? Right now, I'm just a dude in a dungeon. Is there any reason for it? Kidnapped princess? Glory? Lost a bet?

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01-23-2007 at 09:10 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 3, now with bug fixes!) (0)  
zex20913 wrote:
I like the new elements (ranged attack,

Ranged attack is not actually a new element. Some (though not all) of the red magicians in TOTS did this.


One thing you might want to consider, instead of negative mana, is a health depletion instead of a mana depletion when you have 0 mana. I'm sure you already have though, and dismissed it.

Yeah, I plan to keep negative mana. I might also do an item that lets you buy something on credit, so you may see negative money as well.


Another: You have a finite amount of helping lips. Maybe you could create some other lips that don't disappear after they speak?

This will be fixed when I redo the code. My plan is to have magic mouths work the same way the scrolls in DROD do.

I'm finishing up a mock screenshot, then I'm going to make a big post explaining my plans for the redo and see what you all think. So details will be forthcoming shortly.


Just wondering: Is there going to be plot? Right now, I'm just a dude in a dungeon. Is there any reason for it? Kidnapped princess? Glory? Lost a bet?

The current plan is to have an editor so that people can make and share dungeons, rather than having only the one like in TOTS. There won't be any scripting (nothing that can arbitrarily change the puzzle on the player), but I plan to have options for dialogue. So there can be plot.

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01-23-2007 at 09:54 PM
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Syntax
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (0)  
Well, I've just played through the entire 20 levels and let me just say... this is *excellent*!

I've never played "Tower of the Sorcerer" but have pretty much played most 8-bit games out there and this is melancholy at its best. Thanks for a great evening and I look forward to more :)

Playability wise, I'd only suggest a "Are you sure?" dialogue when attacking a neutral. I would never do such a thing but accidentally killed the last one I intended to trade with.

As has been mentioned earlier too, the Escape button should maybe be less terminal.

Just a couple of thoughts...
01-23-2007 at 10:29 PM
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DGM
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Syntax wrote:
Well, I've just played through the entire 20 levels and let me just say... this is *excellent*!

Thank you!


Playability wise, I'd only suggest a "Are you sure?" dialogue when attacking a neutral. I would never do such a thing but accidentally killed the last one I intended to trade with.

You mean an innocent? Unless you've already killed one, a menu pops up when you walk into one. How did you get into a fight with an innocent without being given a chance to back out?


As has been mentioned earlier too, the Escape button should maybe be less terminal.

That's already been fixed, as noted earlier in this thread. Just download version 4.

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01-23-2007 at 10:57 PM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (+1)  
Okay, as I've been saying I plan to start over on the code, both so that I can apply what I've learned from the ground up and so I can make some significant changes now that I've gotten a feel for how this game handles. So if you have anything to say about what the game should be like or care to poke any holes in my ideas, this is the time to speak up.

Here's the big list:

1) EDITOR

You'll get one. So you can make plenty of dungeons for each other to play, just like in DROD.

The current plan is to have no scripting - so no unfair hidden surprises for the player - but otherwise you will be free to design your own monsters, levels, magic items, and so forth. You can also add dialogue to your monsters, change the base values of consumables and determine how powerful the player will be when the game starts.


2) COMBAT SYSTEM

I'm not happy with the way the offense stat is overwhelmingly important compared to the other stats. I added mana and made all those stat-affecting scrolls so that the player would have some choices, but as it stands you just can't afford to skimp on offense. If you do, you'll be stopped by monsters you can't touch.

So here's the new system I'm considering: offense and defense no longer determine how much damage you do per blow. That will be a fixed amount. Instead, they will determine how often each combatant gets to strike.

Combat will proceed in rounds, and each combatant will have a counter. Each round, each side adds their offense to their counter. When your counter equals or exceeds your opponent's defense, you make an attack that round and your counter resets to 0. You can make 1 attack per round at most.


3) BRIBE SYSTEM

In the Game Maker forum, someone suggested that I expand the key/door system to allow the use of quest items for getting certain monsters out of the way. While it actually makes far more sense to use the bribe system for this, it's otherwise a great idea.

Instead of asking you for points from your stats, a monster will be able to ask for collectibles. They may ask you to give up precious magic items. Or they may ask for quest items that are worthless to you, but which you'll have to move Heaven and Earth to get for them (you'll still be able to express your dislike of fetch quests by gutting them, of course).


4) TRAITS

Existing traits will be expanded on a bit.

FACTION TRAITS) Instead of just having innocents, you can have up to four different factions in a dungeon. Each one will work just like innocents do now: kill a member of a faction, and they all become unbribable.

You can combine this with the expanded bribe system to make the player choose sides in a conflict between factions. Just give unbribable members of each side something the other side wants...

MASTER/SLAVE TRAITS) I don't plan to implement multi-tile monsters (like the octopus and dragon in TOTS), as there's not much you can do with them that you can't do with single-tile monsters. The one special thing you could do, though, was kill the octopus' head and have the rest of the body die immediately. That's a mechanic with potential.

Thus, the master and slave traits. There will be 4 of each (like with factions), and each master trait will correspond to a different slave trait. If all the masters of a given type are removed from a level, all the corresponding slaves will disappear as well. If the slaves also have faction traits, this will not count as killing them.

RANGED ATTACK) Will probably change to work as soon as you step next to the monster, rather than when you try to walk into it. Will probably be renamed as well, to avoid confusion if I later decide to introduce something that really works at range.


5) COLLECTIBLES

Some ideas I'm considering:

SCROLL OF ALTER SELF) Alienated everyone through indiscriminate slaughter? Longing to go back to those sweet, halcyon days when angry mobs of people you've wronged weren't trying to kill you on sight?

Well, now you can! Just use one of these babies and in no time you'll look like a brand new person. Literally. Specifically you'll look like someone who isn't, you know, a murderer.

Resets your standing with all factions when used.

SCROLL OF VISIONS) Give yourself the power to see ahead. After using one, you can travel one level higher or lower than you've normally reached. You won't be allowed to exit travel mode on those floors - so this won't get you past obstacles - but you'll have much more information to plan your moves with.

Each additional scroll you use will increase the range of this power by 1 level in each direction.

CREDIT CARD) Passive item. Will probably be given a less anachronistic name later. If your money reserves aren't already negative, you can go negative to make a bribe. But for each point below 0 that you go this way, you lose an additional point.


6) DISPLAY

Someone in the Game Maker thread made a screenshot of my game, which I've snagged and modified for my own sinister purposes. Specifically, so I could show you guys how I plan to change the displays:
http://dungeongames2.com/testScreen.PNG

You can see that the old text and command panels are gone, and most of their space has been merged into the title display at the top-right. This space will serve as the new text panel. When there's some particular text to display - such as when you step on a magic mouth - it will appear here. When there isn't, it will show the title, dungeon name and level as normal. The numbers in parenthesis are the lowest and highest levels you can reach via travelling (first set of parenthesis) and the highest and lowest levels you can see through visions (second set).

The stat panel is unchanged, aside from being moved down a bit.

Below the stat panel is a new panel showing (from left to right): how much damage you do per hit, how much the mana drain from a monster's hit is reduced by, the range of your visions, and your standing with each faction. Our intrepid hero can still deal with the blue faction, but has managed to tick off just about everyone else.

The key panel is unchanged, except for being slightly smaller.

Ditto for the collectibles panel.

The command panel has been expanded. Instead of having to hit a button to move the cursor to the collectibles panel, both panels can be treated as a single menu now.


7) INSERT YOUR FEEDBACK HERE

Okay, feel free to disect not only all of the above ideas, but anything else I didn't mention. Like the color scheme, for example... Does the red-yellow-green-blue pattern actually help anyone, or should I drop it?

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[Last edited by DGM at 01-23-2007 11:52 PM]
01-23-2007 at 11:24 PM
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mrimer
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (0)  
DGM wrote:
Like the color scheme, for example... Does the red-yellow-green-blue pattern actually help anyone, or should I drop it?
Quick comment on this. I think it would be more intuitive if reversed. Similar to danger levels shown often in games, movies (and maybe even real life :P), blue is safest, then green and yellow, while red is most dangerous. Also, hotness of salsa/hot sauce comes to mind. BGYR seems to be a more common ordering from mild to extreme.

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01-23-2007 at 11:57 PM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (+1)  
I like the color scheme. It is rather useless for monsters, with the stat boxes at the bottom, but it works well with doors, and also as an overarching theme. So I'd leave it in.

The faction idea sounds really good. I think I'd like the scroll to reset ONE faction. Resetting all gives the potential for mass killing followed by a safety. Or perhaps the mana cost can go up for each innocent killed, no matter the faction.

The *new* combat system feels a little bit weird. Maybe you can do some odd things with monster abilities, like Def=(Player's offense minus 1), so you have to raise a Defense stat to get by. Also, how about a ranged spell for the character? Cast it and choose a direction to send, like, a fireball or something.

The editor sounds good. I'm personally not into building too many levels, but I know some people are, and allowing that offers much more gameplay.

For the credit card, how about a credit limit instead of "no negative!"? This allows for more pathfinding through bribery.

The master/slave thing sounds good as well. Basically, I recommend any expansion of the bribery system and the faction system. They're good elements as they stand (stood?) in the demo, and improvement should not be frowned upon. Just don't overdo it. I'd say one new factor per 10 levels should be sufficient (if not more than.)

It sounds like it's coming along smoothly though, and I'm looking forward to the finished product.

Edit: Mike has a really good point with the color. I like the fact that the color is there, and the order of the colors doesn't matter too much to me.

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[Last edited by zex20913 at 01-24-2007 12:11 AM : mrimer crash.]
01-24-2007 at 12:09 AM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (0)  
mrimer wrote:
Quick comment on this. I think it would be more intuitive if reversed. Similar to danger levels shown often in games, movies (and maybe even real life :P), blue is safest, then green and yellow, while red is most dangerous. Also, hotness of salsa/hot sauce comes to mind. BGYR seems to be a more common ordering from mild to extreme.

The only problem there are the money items. Copper is reddish, and it would be counter-intuitive to have it be worth more than gold or platinum.

I'd either have to come up with some unusual currencies, or exempt money from the color scheme.

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01-24-2007 at 12:40 AM
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DGM
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icon Re: New puzzle game based on "Tower of the Sorcerer" (version 4, quit confirmation added) (0)  
zex20913 wrote:
The faction idea sounds really good. I think I'd like the scroll to reset ONE faction. Resetting all gives the potential for mass killing followed by a safety.

I can put in both effects and let the dungeon-maker choose whatever works best for him.


Or perhaps the mana cost can go up for each innocent killed, no matter the faction.

Technically, there won't be an innocent trait anymore. You could use one of the faction traits that way, but you could just as easily create a guild of thieves and assassins (who wouldn't care how many innocents you slaughtered). So kills would have to be tracked by faction.


The *new* combat system feels a little bit weird. Maybe you can do some odd things with monster abilities, like Def=(Player's offense minus 1), so you have to raise a Defense stat to get by.

I'm open to suggestions. Just as long as the combat stats are more balanced with the others rather than having to be a top priority.


Also, how about a ranged spell for the character? Cast it and choose a direction to send, like, a fireball or something.

It's possible. It would have to either be a one-shot kill or lead immediately into a fight with the target, though. I don't want individual monsters to survive in a damaged state, as that would complicate things with the result panel when there are multiple monsters of the same type in a level.


For the credit card, how about a credit limit instead of "no negative!"? This allows for more pathfinding through bribery.

That's one way of doing it. There still has to be some penalty for using the credit, though, or you may as well just give the player a lump sum of cash and be done with it.


Just don't overdo it. I'd say one new factor per 10 levels should be sufficient (if not more than.)

Well, that may be a good metric for an introductory dungeon made by me. But what a customer does with his dungeons will be out of my hands.

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01-24-2007 at 12:52 AM
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Let me throw another idea for a new combat system at you guys. What if I just throw out defense entirely and just have a single 'combat' stat? Each round, you do your combat stat in damage to the other guy. Period.

Collectibles could modify this, of course, just as the Orb of Shielding does with mana drain. But no stat. This would have the side benefit of letting me eliminate a line from the stat panel (and a section from each monster entry) and use the space for something else.


P.S. Hey mrimer, was/is the Orb of Shielding really messing up on you?

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01-24-2007 at 02:53 AM
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DGM wrote:
P.S. Hey mrimer, was/is the Orb of Shielding really messing up on you?
No, I think it was just what you described above (i.e. it's fine).

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01-24-2007 at 04:26 AM
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The money could be recoloured separately from the other objects - a coppery colour, a silvery one and a gold one (and maybe a gem of some sort) would be no less intuitive methinks, whereas having the colours reversed for monsters would be more intitive as mike says.

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01-24-2007 at 07:28 PM
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BeefontheBone wrote:
The money could be recoloured separately from the other objects - a coppery colour, a silvery one and a gold one (and maybe a gem of some sort)

Copper-silver-gold-gems was what I orginally wanted to use, but I also wanted to stick with the color scheme.

As I noted before, I could just come up with strange names for the coins to disassociate them from the metals. Funny currency names seem to work for DROD. But it would only be worth the trouble if more users prefered Mike's scheme than the current one.

Hmm... This might be a good subject for a poll, but I don't want to flood the 'Electronic Games' forum with multiple threads about one game. Is there a suitable place for such a thread?

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01-24-2007 at 07:49 PM
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I just won the game. Really cool, and a lot of fun. Obviously, the 10-level dungeon you have just scratches the potential, but even so it was really enjoyable.

Not really much new to add on what was said above. I didn't have much of an issue with the current color scheme, but I can see that a reverse one would be more intuitive.

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01-24-2007 at 08:12 PM
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As for your new suggested combat system - I don't think it's a good idea to combine offense/defense - having two stats is better than having just one, because that allows for more strategy and tradeoffs. How about, however, instead of having offense/defense, you have something like power/speed? Where power determines how much damage you do per hit, and speed determines how often you attack?

This has two benefits:

- A high speed will reduce the damage you get, so it gets some of the ability of speed.
- On the other hand, if you meet a monster you can't kill, you could defeat it by either increasing power, OR by increasing speed. So, neither ability dominates as much.

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01-24-2007 at 08:32 PM
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eytanz wrote:
As for your new suggested combat system - I don't think it's a good idea to combine offense/defense - having two stats is better than having just one, because that allows for more strategy and tradeoffs.

First, even with the simplified combat there's still much more room for trade-offs than there was in TOTS. Combat, keys, bribes, magic items... The trade-offs are just happening at a higher level - between combat and other things rather than mostly within the combat system.

Second, I don't think I'm going to take defense out entirely. It will just be treated the same way that mana drain reduction is. You can still raise it through collectibles if the dungeon-maker (Architect? Dungeon Master?) puts such items in, there just won't be potions scattered all over the place. And monsters can still have defense so you can have monsters who can't be beaten through normal combat. It will just be set to 0 for most monsters.

Third, I played around with that mock screenshot to see what I could do with the extra space. I like the results.

I'm still open to arguments, but I'm leaning towards doing this.

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01-25-2007 at 12:09 AM
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eytanz wrote:
I just won the game. Really cool, and a lot of fun. Obviously, the 10-level dungeon you have just scratches the potential, but even so it was really enjoyable.

Glad you enjoyed it. :)

Not really much new to add on what was said above. I didn't have much of an issue with the current color scheme, but I can see that a reverse one would be more intuitive.


There definitely seems to be a trend in favor of Mike's version, so it looks like the color scheme will be changing. Just have to figure out what to do with the currency.

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01-25-2007 at 12:13 AM
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I like it alot! Nothing to report that hasn't been said, but it works and it is fun!
01-25-2007 at 05:10 PM
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