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MartianInvader
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icon DROD Construction Crew (+6)  
There's an old Smitemaster's legend:
"There once were two architect brothers, Throtto and Filkin. They were very close, and did nearly everything as a team, including making holds. Despite this closeness, they still were of somewhat different temperments. How, you ask? Well, if you wouldn't interrupt my story with these questions, I could tell you a lot more easily, couldn't I? For one thing, Filkin would sleep all day, then wake up at sundown and work through the night. Throtto, on the other hand, would generally sleep all night and work during the day.

"Now Throtto, you see, was something of a Delver's best friend. He loved making his holds so easily conquerable that most delvers could do it with their eyes closed (in fact, several delvers were badly injured when they actually tried these holds with their eyes closed and walked too quickly into walls). Filkin, on the other hand, liked his holds fiendishly diabolical, amazingly difficult, and generally the bane of delvers everywhere. His favorites were when he could get away with making a hold completely unconquerable.

"When Throtto and Filkin made their holds together, the same thing would happen every night. While Throtto slept, Filkin would sneak in and change a few things to make the hold unconquerable. And every day, Throtto would sneak into the hold whild Filkin slept and, with a few more changes, make the hold conquerable once again..."



I haven't posted on these forums in a while, but I was looking at the "kill the kitten" thread and came up with what could be a really fun game. Basically, it's similar to "kill the kitten" except instead of putting together a picture bit by bit, it puts together a DROD hold. Here's the rules:

- We start with a hold file that has one, nearly-empty, ridiculously boring room (just the side walls, a roach, and a green door).

- The next poster then adds something to the room to make it impossible to complete (force arrows, unreachable monsters, unavoidable death, undroppable red doors, or whatever).

- The following poster then takes the new hold, and must change it a bit more to make it once again possible (a way around the force arrows, some trick to get to the monsters, an extra wall that lets you avoid the aforementioned death, etc.)

- This process then continues: People keep adding things to make the room alternatingly impossible then possible.

- Once a room is pretty "full" (and possible), a poster can declare it complete and add a new room to the hold. When a poster makes a new room, it should be empty, except for the standard walls around the sides, some exits, and/or some green doors. People then start adding things to this room.

- If this goes well, we could end up with a really nice hold!

Other guidelines and rules:

-When you post, make sure to attach the new hold file. You can also attach a screenshot, but I'll try to keep a screenshot of the current room at the top of the thread as updated as I can.

-Try not to add too much to the room in any one post. After all, the whole point is collaboration and unpredictability. While you can add more than just a monster or two, I think it'd be best if you kept your addition to one basic idea that makes the room impossible or possible again. Use your judgement.

-If two people reply to the same room at roughly the same time, then both changes are incorporated and the next person has to deal with them both to make the room once again possible/impossible. If there's no way to incorporate both changes (e.g., the posters put two different monsters on the same square), then the first poster's change gets precedence.

-As much as possible, try to make your change by adding things to the room, not taking them away. If you must remove part of someone else's contribution (e.g., someone added a bunch of force arrows to make a monster completely unreachable and you want to make the monster reachable), try to remove as little as possible (Just one arrow instead of all of them. Better yet, leave the arrows and add a mimic potion!)

-At some point, someone may want to make additional entrances to rooms and have them only be possible from that entrance. This is fine, but then we need to be sure later on that those entrances are accessible.

-When you edit the hold, make sure it's named "under construction", and delete any "originally authored by" text in the description. Otherwise, we'll have reeeeeeally long descriptions that are just a bunch of author names, and people's hard drives will get cluttered with a bunch of different versions of the holds.

That's all the guidelines I can think of for now. So without further ado, I give you the starting hold!


EDIT:
New Rules - Added as the situations come up:

-I've started changing my old posts from attaching the hold to attaching a displayed screenshot of the room. That way, newcomers to the thread can see the progression without having to import a bunch of holds. If we have a few posters doing this to their old posts, I think the thread will be a lot more fun to read. Make sure there's a hold file for the most recent version, though, so people can download it for editing.

-Despite our best efforts and (ahem) unquestionable intelligence, once in a while someone will post a hold that's supposed to be unconquerable, but in fact has a solution. In this case, tell the poster how the room is conquerable (or upload a demo), and give them a chance to update their hold to become truly impossible. If they don't fix their post within 12 hours of their error being pointed out, someone else can edit the hold further to make it unconquerable.

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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 11-13-2005 04:51 PM]
11-08-2005 at 04:10 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (0)  
Here's the full room as of 12/02/2005, 12:50AM:
(Hold file should be posted at the bottom of the thread)

Room Status is:
Conquerable?



(Those mimic-looking characters don't do anything except stand there.)

Change history: Oh man, I've lost track. Crumbly wall lets out the rock golems that were unkillable without becoming trapped, though pit maze lets the mimic reach the pit that prevented killing the goblin made smart by the brain that lets you kill the roach in the corner and serpent that require the decoys that could kill the evil eyes which cut off the crumbly-wall exit that allowed Beethro to drop the red door, and the serpent can't be bombed even after the first bomb closes the door and cuts off the fuse despite orthogonal squares letting Beethro avoid hitting the orb that closes the door that cuts off the bomb that kills the serpent that would be unkillable after Beethro drops the trapdoor that saves him from the mud baby.



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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 12-01-2005 10:52 PM]
11-08-2005 at 04:12 PM
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Alneyan
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (0)  
Halph? Is that you? I guess not.

One mud baby was added just left of Beethro. No screenshots should be required this time.
11-08-2005 at 04:31 PM
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Insane
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
First the hold.
It is impossible since you have no way of killing a roach 180° behind you.

-Insane
11-08-2005 at 04:33 PM
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (0)  
double post. should i delete mine since i was after you?
11-08-2005 at 04:33 PM
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Alneyan
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (0)  
First come, first served usually, so my hold should be the one to use. Nothing prevents you from editing my own hold, though.

Of course, we did exactly the same thing, so it doesn't matter this time around, but hey.
11-08-2005 at 04:38 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (0)  
Yeah, I forgot to say what happens with a double post. I'll add the following to the rules above:

-If two people reply to the same room at roughly the same time, then both changes are incorporated and the next person has to deal with them both to make the room once again possible/impossible. If there's no way to incorporate both changes (e.g., the posters put two different monsters on the same square), then the first poster's change gets precedence.

Also, since screenshots can be bulky, I'm going to take away the recommendation that everyone post a screenshot, and instead just update the shot at the top of the thread as often as I can.

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11-08-2005 at 04:48 PM
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stigant
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Added trap door under beethro

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11-08-2005 at 05:00 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  


Oh dear. Drop that trap door and you'll never be able to kill the serpent in the corner.



Edit: Off to class for a while, so the screenshot at the top will be stuck on this room for a few hours. Don't let it stop the game though!

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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 11-08-2005 09:42 PM]
11-08-2005 at 05:14 PM
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Alneyan
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Canny delvers bring bombs with them.
11-08-2005 at 05:26 PM
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stigant
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Too bad there's an orb to close the yellow door there.

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11-08-2005 at 05:31 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  


Thank goodness for those orthogonal squares! Beethro can -just- manage to avoid hitting that orb now.

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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 11-08-2005 09:46 PM]
11-08-2005 at 08:38 PM
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Thwarted again!

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11-08-2005 at 08:48 PM
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Jeff_Ray...
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Oh no :P

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11-08-2005 at 09:36 PM
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Alneyan
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Beethro isn't going to get through the Twin Swords before the bomb goes off.

Wait, I forgot something very obvious, so the room is still beatable. Now it's better, though my solution isn't exactly elegant.

[Last edited by Alneyan at 11-08-2005 09:57 PM]
11-08-2005 at 09:49 PM
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Maybe, but a delver has more than one trick in their pockets!

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11-08-2005 at 09:58 PM
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stigant
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Too bad you need that snake to kill the goblin!

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11-08-2005 at 10:15 PM
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Jeff_Ray...
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A problem: you can strike the orb from outside!



Please fix this!

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11-08-2005 at 10:18 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
I think we should say "No more characters" starting now. It could get very annoying to have to go through a bunch of scripting commands in order to know how the room works.

Also, the room has been completable for the last 3 turns. Shame on you two! Your changes therefore don't get added to the "change history"!

Anyways, here's an update to make it impossible: How will Beethro get through the red door?



EDIT: Oh dear! I've posted on top of someone else. Updated hold with both changes implemented is on its way!

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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 11-08-2005 10:36 PM]
11-08-2005 at 10:21 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Okay, here's the hold with all changes in. Current status is impossible.

Please be careful when you post to make sure the room is actually impossible when it should be and possible when it should be. The last three changes all left the room as conquerable. Failure to oblige will result in severe finger-wagging.

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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 11-09-2005 01:00 AM]
11-08-2005 at 10:29 PM
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Your eyes are weak or what? A wall crumbled!

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11-08-2005 at 10:35 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Your addition of the mimic was unneccesary. The room was conquerable with just the crumbly wall.

But now, all sorts of baddies have combined forces! You can blow up the serpent, kill the goblin with the mimic... but the crumbly-wall exit from the trapdoors is no longer safe! What's to be done??



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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 11-10-2005 04:21 PM]
11-09-2005 at 12:52 AM
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Jeff_Ray...
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
Something about the simplest!

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11-09-2005 at 11:17 AM
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Jeff_Ray...
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Can we upload an changed hold twice?

BTW don't let the game die plz?

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11-09-2005 at 08:00 PM
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Alneyan
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I'm sorry, I am the one who created the whole "solveable" thing. I uploaded an updated hold, but my previous hold had already been download (and used afterwards) in the first few minutes of its life.

Unless I screwed up again, the room is now impossible to complete, as you would need just one more fateful turn to make it. Feel free to set the serpents on me if you *can* beat it.

Apparently can be beaten. Disregard this transmission.

[Last edited by Alneyan at 11-09-2005 08:46 PM]
11-09-2005 at 08:23 PM
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (+1)  
i can beat it. i will soon send a serpent on you.

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My Holds:
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[Last edited by Jeff_Ray... at 11-09-2005 08:28 PM]
11-09-2005 at 08:28 PM
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Alneyan
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Rats. How do you beat it? Disregard my update then.

Bleh, it really was obvious.

[Last edited by Alneyan at 11-09-2005 08:47 PM]
11-09-2005 at 08:45 PM
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Jeff_Ray...
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I've used the mimic on the tar mother, a decoy on a eye, and another on the goblin.

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11-09-2005 at 08:55 PM
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MartianInvader
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (0)  
Well, it looks like Alneyan doesn't want to post an updated version of is hold, so I'll post an unconquerable one.

There may be a couple decoys, but you would need to place them by the snake in one corner and the roach in another if you wanted to get through this room in one piece!

Edit: Curses! Doom has made a fool of me by beating the room! Here's an update which is -hopefully- unconquerable for real.

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[Last edited by MartianInvader at 11-10-2005 05:35 PM]
11-10-2005 at 04:13 PM
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icon Re: DROD Construction Crew (0)  
Ha! I beat your unconquerable room, MartianInvader. (This is the first room that I tried, so I can't say anything about earlier ones)

You don't need to place a decoy in the NE corner, because the last trapdoor can be dropped with a mimic.

:)

[Last edited by Doom at 11-10-2005 04:24 PM : typo]
11-10-2005 at 04:23 PM
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