dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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WTH++ is a game where I'll make up a program with different characters that makes little or no sense, and I'll tell you what it outputs. You have to figure out the structure of the 'code' by the example programs I give. Here's the first one:

(*******)
(*****)moo
(**)moo
@?

This program outputs the letter F.

(***)
(**)ack
$?

This program outputs the value 5.

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TripleM
Level: Smitemaster
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Interesting.

Are we meant to just try to guess how it works straight off, or to try and post our own programs and find out what they output, if anything?

Bobbob
Level: Roachling
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An attempt to (probably incorrectly) refine TripleM's guess:

dreamisle
Level: Goblin

Rank Points: 23
Registered: 05-13-2005
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You guys both got a couple parts right. Here's what you figured out correctly:

Once this one is figured out someone else can have a go at making a problem for others to solve.

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[Last edited by dreamisle at 08-12-2005 02:06 AM : forgot something]

stigant
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[Last edited by stigant at 08-12-2005 02:15 AM]

dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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That's right too, now you just need to figure out what the ? character does.



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stigant
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Hmmm, ok...


Personally, I liked


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dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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Yup, you got it, but that second one did sound a lot better. Now your turn to try one if you want.

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stigant
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Ok, I got one, but it'll take some time for me to post a program... its a bit more complicated.

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stigant
Level: Smitemaster

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Program:
i
bs
$$??
c
$
?$??
c
$!
bs
$$???
c
!!
bs
!!!!
bs
s
c
$$$
c
????
bs
????
bs
$$??^
i
c

Output is:
+1
0
220
311
1
321
32
0
30
001
002
1
21
-1
000

I hope that's just the right amount of confusing (and also that I got the output correct).

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dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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Haha, wow, at first glance I think I may have some info about your program: I have no idea



Is it stack based like mine or totally different?

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stigant
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you are correct about bs and c (although you have some way to go before you figure them out). i is something I threw in at the last minute. I'll provide some more examples of i later, though if you understand the rest of the code, you'll be able to make a pretty good guess at what i does from the first example.

It is not stack based like yours.

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trick
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
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Looks like ..



This is fun

- Gerry

stigant
Level: Smitemaster

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ok heres some more code. The intent here is that you'd tack it on to the end of the snippit above. Then, in addition to the output above, it will generate the output below as well.
Also, I'm going to start putting more symbols on a line to conserve space. I'll tell you now that white space is meaningless (ie using a space instead of a newline doesn't change the program)

Program (continued):
bs $$!! c bs
$??$?? c bs
$! c bs
$$! c bs s
??$$$ c bs
$$$ c bs
$$$ c bs i

Output
0
000
2 <--- oops, sorry
000
21
000
321
000
321
31
001
321
002
321
000
0
+2

Edit: sorry, the output was flawed (compiler error). I removed the last 2 lines, and the 3rd line should be 2, not 1.

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[Last edited by stigant at 08-12-2005 09:24 PM]

dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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Wait... there are 17 characters (bs, i, c) but 19 lines of output? Whoa, this is deeper programming than I thought would take place when starting this game.

I'm completely drawing a blank. Wanna post a slightly smaller program or give one more tiny hint?

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[Last edited by dreamisle at 08-12-2005 09:06 PM : new ideas]

stigant
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1. You were correct about the number of lines of output.

2. None of the code creates loops, in the sense that execution never jumps back up to a previous line of code or instruction.

3. You may be thinking too mathamatically and/or computer-languagy. This IS a language, per se, but its not a general purpose language. I'm pretty sure its not Turring complete, and I don't think you can really do much in the way of general arithmetic with it.

Here's a shorter example (again assuming you tack it on the end, but you can analyze this one without the other two):

Program:
bs c ^ c ^ c ^ c i s

Output:
0 000 001 002 000 -2 31

I'll do another one if nobody makes any progress, but I think it will give it away.

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stigant
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I'd like to make a suggestion: perhaps the game-master should post a program + output to get the ball rolling, but the other players should post their own programs using the same symbols. Then, the game-master will post the output (or compile error or something appropriate if something is wrong).

Also, if people have lost interest in my language, I can reveal the answer and somebody else can start a program.

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dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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Can you show me output for these two programs?

BS I C

and

BS $$!! I C

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stigant
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Well, if you start them from the beginning:
BS I C ==> 0 +1 000
and
BS $$!! I C ==> 0 +1 000

if you had run
BS $$!! BS I C
the output would have been:
0 2 +1 000

BS $$ C !! BS I C ==> 0 020 2 +1 000

BS $$ C $ C $$ ! C BS ! C BS ==> 0 020 001 001 1 001 21

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dreamisle
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$ adds 1 to the middle digit of what C outputs, and ! moves it to what BS outputs? I'm starting to get the idea, kind of? I think...

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stigant
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Hmmm, $ doesn't always increment middle digit of C. ! and BS are related but not how you think:

BS C ! BS C ! BS C ! BS C $ BS C $ BS C $ BS C ==>
0 000 1 000 21 000 321 000 321 010 321 020 321 001

BS C ? BS C ? BS C ? BS C ? BS C ==>
0 000 0 100 0 200 0 300 1 000

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dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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! adds the next digit in numerical order to the front of BS? Still can't tell what exactly $ does, but is C's output in base 3 or 4 or something? I think ? Increments the 'hundreds place' of C but after 3 it increments BS by one? Is BS like an overflow for C's output?
I'm trying to give a valiant effort but if you get sick of my stupidity feel free to post the answer and start a new one.

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The Hold of Knowledge is a hold I'm working on with a lot of scripting elements that piece together some great puzzles for ya. Check out the tester versions!

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[Last edited by dreamisle at 08-14-2005 08:23 PM]

stigant
Level: Smitemaster

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You're getting there, but missing a few crucial ideas.

The language was designed to keep track of the state of a baseball game.
$ = strike
? = ball
! = hit (one ! per base run)
^ = out
c prints the current Count (# balls followed by # strikes followed by # outs)
bs prints the current base runners (31 would represent a runner on 3rd and a runner on 1st. 0 represents no runners)
s prints the score
i prints the inning (+3 = top of the 3rd or -6 = bottom of the sixth etc)

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dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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Ahhh, I see. I guess thats what happens for me since I don't like sports... nice idea though. Try another one?

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The Hold of Knowledge is a hold I'm working on with a lot of scripting elements that piece together some great puzzles for ya. Check out the tester versions!

stigant
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OK, but I don't have any ideas for a new language at the moment. Feel free to post one, and I'll guess.

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dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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([[>]*[[v]+[^]]])
(v)(X)(#)
(@)

(@)(X)(#)([[o]*[[<]+[^]]])

([[^>]*[<^]]-[v>])(#)(X)

All of these output 60.

And some infinate loops that will be easy to figure out.

I suppose these could be stack based but they're designed to only have 1 data value at a time.

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stigant
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ok, it looks like < and > and @ must be some sort of skip to or goto instruction. Perhaps > means go forward one instruction, < means go back and @ means go to the beginning.

I'm assuming that parens and brackets are some sort of grouping mechanism that must be balanced.

what is the output for (X)? Is it nothing? the program just halts?

What is the output for
([X])

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dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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With (>) and (<) You're close. Not necessarily one instruction, but close to what you have.
With (@) you're wrong. I'll post another example in a second.
With (X) you've got it right, the program just halts.

([X]) has no output and continuously loops, but...


And here's two more continuous loops, but this one keeps spitting out 1 and 2:

(>)([<v])(#)([v])(@)

But this one has no output:

(v)
(^)



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The Hold of Knowledge is a hold I'm working on with a lot of scripting elements that piece together some great puzzles for ya. Check out the tester versions!

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[Last edited by dreamisle at 08-15-2005 12:56 AM : added one more program]

TripleM
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By the way, I am still thinking about this, so its not just two people participating. Stigants one completely baffled me, but it was absolutely brilliant..

One thing - when you said 'all of these output 60', am I right in assuming there are 3 programs there? Ie the first one is one program, on three lines?

dreamisle
Level: Goblin

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Yup, 3 programs. 3 lines, 1 line, 1 line.

____________________________
The Hold of Knowledge is a hold I'm working on with a lot of scripting elements that piece together some great puzzles for ya. Check out the tester versions!