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chinook
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icon Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
It just seems to me that as bandwidth gets more easily available and cheaper, and while CaravelNet remains basically the same, that I could see it becoming a free feature of DROD games.

I had bought it for a while, but didn't play DROD very much at the time (life). Now, when I want to play DROD, I don't have it, which is typical. (Just like my xbox360 Gold membership, currently, sits idle.)

Has this ever been discussed? Sorry if it has, but a cursory search made it seem like it hasn't been.


I figure with some of the recent changes to the staff of Caravel, this might be something that could be considered. Or maybe this is an absurd idea, hahaha.

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02-19-2009 at 01:00 PM
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Blondbeard
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (+1)  
Perhaps a better idea would be to be able to pause a CaravelNet conection. At any time you may use a pause-option in the settings in order to pause your CaravelNet conection for a minimum of one week. When one week has passed you have the option to whenever you want enable the CaravleNet conection again, with as much time left on it as you had before you paused it.

I realize this might be hard to implement, but it would be a nice feature if you are going on vacation for a couple of weeks, or for some other reason do not have time/motivation to play DROD.

That being said. I do not think this is in any way necesary. It would just be a nice bonus :)
02-19-2009 at 01:24 PM
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agaricus5
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
chinook wrote:
It just seems to me that as bandwidth gets more easily available and cheaper, and while CaravelNet remains basically the same, that I could see it becoming a free feature of DROD games.
Caravel.net is probably quite an important source of revenue for Caravel Games, and probably pays somewhat for the costs of keeping our site and forum running. Plus, the features that it comes with (most significantly, joining the online demo/score competition) are things that it seems are still desirable for people to buy. So, in terms of Caravel's business model, I would have thought that the subscription system is actually quite a good thing; it's a desirable extra functionality whose absence doesn't necessarily detract from the game.

I had bought it for a while, but didn't play DROD very much at the time (life). Now, when I want to play DROD, I don't have it, which is typical. (Just like my xbox360 Gold membership, currently, sits idle.)
Saying that, though, I agree with the point you are implying; it would be nice if Caravel.net subscriptions didn't expire if you aren't actively using them. I think this is just the sort of thing that might put people off actually subscribing, since you can't really predict if you'll end up not being able to use your subscription later on and if you do end up in that situation, it would be a waste of money.

I wonder. Would it be possible to implement a system whereby you can manually (but reversibly) deactivate your subscription in your profile for a period of time? People who then become absent in the DROD community will still have a chance to pause their subscription until they are able to return.

Of course, I can see how such a feature could be abused (you could turn it on and off repeatedly only when you want to upload demos), so a possible solution might be a system whereby after deactivating and reactivating a subscription, you cannot then deactivate it again for some fixed period, for example, 2 months. Or alternatively, we could set a maximum number of times you can deactivate and reactivate your subscription.

Edit: Oops. Post collision!

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[Last edited by agaricus5 at 02-19-2009 01:36 PM]
02-19-2009 at 01:36 PM
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Syntax
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
A takeaway burger, chips and drink costs as much here as a year's subscription. I can see why it might be off-putting at the stage of paying for it (parting with ones cash is always tough), but I think paying for Caravel is an easy ongoing way of supporting the game we all love.

Also, the fact it's so utterly cheap surely puts it within anyone's reach. For the younger players, just offer to wash the car or do the dishes for a week in exchange.
02-24-2009 at 07:25 PM
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chinook
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
I don't think it's prohibitively expensive at all. I just think it would be a great selling point for the games if they were always connected to CaravelNet and always free. Many, many other games do things like this. I am not saying that DROD should or even CAN (for free), but that it would be a great feature to have.

It's not that I don't want to spend 12 bucks on it, because I do, but with my on-and-off relationship with PC video games, I may be spending that money and never utilizing it once in a given year.

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02-24-2009 at 10:34 PM
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Syntax
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (+1)  
I definitely get your point and I like the idea of pausing the subscription.

I just feel that because it's so cheap, that ought not be necessary.

I also feel that DROD attracts a rather niche group of players and that means a more tight-knit community with a more supportive attitude which may be lacking in other games offering free extras. After all, everything you can do with Caravel is doable without it (apart from the scores and certain demographics I guess).
02-24-2009 at 11:11 PM
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13th Slayer
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
agaricus5 wrote:
chinook wrote:
It just seems to me that as bandwidth gets more easily available and cheaper, and while CaravelNet remains basically the same, that I could see it becoming a free feature of DROD games.
Caravel.net is probably quite an important source of revenue for Caravel Games, and probably pays somewhat for the costs of keeping our site and forum running. Plus, the features that it comes with (most significantly, joining the online demo/score competition) are things that it seems are still desirable for people to buy. So, in terms of Caravel's business model, I would have thought that the subscription system is actually quite a good thing; it's a desirable extra functionality whose absence doesn't necessarily detract from the game.

I had bought it for a while, but didn't play DROD very much at the time (life). Now, when I want to play DROD, I don't have it, which is typical. (Just like my xbox360 Gold membership, currently, sits idle.)
Saying that, though, I agree with the point you are implying; it would be nice if Caravel.net subscriptions didn't expire if you aren't actively using them. I think this is just the sort of thing that might put people off actually subscribing, since you can't really predict if you'll end up not being able to use your subscription later on and if you do end up in that situation, it would be a waste of money.

I wonder. Would it be possible to implement a system whereby you can manually (but reversibly) deactivate your subscription in your profile for a period of time? People who then become absent in the DROD community will still have a chance to pause their subscription until they are able to return.

Of course, I can see how such a feature could be abused (you could turn it on and off repeatedly only when you want to upload demos), so a possible solution might be a system whereby after deactivating and reactivating a subscription, you cannot then deactivate it again for some fixed period, for example, 2 months. Or alternatively, we could set a maximum number of times you can deactivate and reactivate your subscription.

Edit: Oops. Post collision!
For that i think that way - why not just take away one day of membership every once you login to caravelnet via DROD? Not more than once a day that is.
02-25-2009 at 01:41 PM
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agaricus5
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
13th Slayer wrote:
agaricus5 wrote:
Of course, I can see how such a feature could be abused (you could turn it on and off repeatedly only when you want to upload demos), so a possible solution might be a system whereby after deactivating and reactivating a subscription, you cannot then deactivate it again for some fixed period, for example, 2 months. Or alternatively, we could set a maximum number of times you can deactivate and reactivate your subscription.

Edit: Oops. Post collision!
For that i think that way - why not just take away one day of membership every once you login to caravelnet via DROD? Not more than once a day that is.
I did consider that, but as I mentioned, that could be very easily abused if you were not a big forum user. You would simply turn off CaravelNet, play loads of rooms, then upload them once a week, say. You could easily extend your usable subscription time by several times at least.

Syntax, I agree with you about the idea of CaravelNet's low cost, but I'm not sure whether the food analogy is entirely appropriate, since CaravelNet's a luxury while food is a necessity. Blasphemy!.

I appreciate $12 is a very small sum (to most people with access to DROD), but I would nonetheless feel a bit reluctant to spend it if I felt that I might not be able to benefit from CaravelNet due to not being around. I guess it would be like buying a meal you were then unable to eat; you do not benefit from what you paid for, and the food goes to waste at the same time. I would personally pay more for a subscription I could pause; I guess one might consider it a basic form of insurance.

But, really, this is me just being nitpicky because I have the opportunity to voice my opinion. I would buy CaravelNet anyway if I thought it was worth $12 (£9?) compared to other things I could get for the same sum.

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02-25-2009 at 02:06 PM
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Syntax
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
agaricus5 wrote:
Syntax, I agree with you about the idea of CaravelNet's low cost, but I'm not sure whether the food analogy is entirely appropriate, since CaravelNet's a luxury while food is a necessity.
Well for me Caravel is a necessity... without it, I would stop playing DROD and I don't want to stop.

And the food analogy was chips and burger... that's not *necessary* food :)
02-26-2009 at 12:24 PM
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agaricus5
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (+1)  
Syntax wrote:
agaricus5 wrote:
Syntax, I agree with you about the idea of CaravelNet's low cost, but I'm not sure whether the food analogy is entirely appropriate, since CaravelNet's a luxury while food is a necessity.
Well for me Caravel is a necessity... without it, I would stop playing DROD and I don't want to stop.

And the food analogy was chips and burger... that's not *necessary* food :)
:lol

If I had any mod points right now, they'd be yours. Your warped logic is testament to the fact that I clearly don't play enough DROD.

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02-26-2009 at 12:33 PM
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ErikH2000
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (+2)  
chinook wrote:
It just seems to me that as bandwidth gets more easily available and cheaper, and while CaravelNet remains basically the same, that I could see it becoming a free feature of DROD games.
There's a lot of costs involved.

The server itself, with a terabyte or so of bandwidth, low-end hardware, dedicated usage, and root-level access is about $150/month. The server cost has actually gone up--not down. Although there are many cheap server offers around, flaunting bandwidth deals, they tend to be inappropriate for the needs of a custom-developed online service like CaravelNet.

A large number of the support requests (most?) deal with CaravelNet functionality. Schik, and to a lesser extent, me put in large amounts of time over the years to keep the servers running. Even small features like sending people an e-mail with their CaravelNet key with a modicum of reliability have taken hundreds of hours to set up. And there's no component of the system that you can ever just say "that is done, it will never have to be dealt with again." Drivers need updating, external mail hosts change their anti-spam rules, hard drives crash, entropy happens.

None of the people that worked on the above stuff were ever compensated for their time with an amount of money that reflected the market value worth of their services. The $12/month figure isn't based on what the whole system costs Caravel. It's based on a rough guess at perceived value of the service, another rough guess of the optimal point on the supply/demand curve, and the satisfying round-numberedness of charging a buck a month. Mike may wish to change it in the future to something else, of course.

-Erik

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03-12-2009 at 08:09 PM
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ErikH2000
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I forgot to mention that Jamie Jones and Mike Rimer also put in time maintaining the servers and solving different problems that came up.

-Erik

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03-12-2009 at 08:10 PM
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The Architest
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icon Re: Will CaravelNet ever be free? (0)  
I would buy 1 years CaravelNet Membership , if Smitemaster Battlation would be avaible to play! Yay for TRBS! ;)

And I would buy anyway , when I would get some money! :P
03-14-2009 at 09:15 PM
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