Announcement: Be excellent to each other.


Caravel Forum : Other Boards : Electronic Games : Braid
Page 1 of 3
23
New Topic New Poll Post Reply
Poster Message
Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Braid (+2)  
I'm shocked that there isn't a thread on this.

It's an XBLA arcade game, PC release later this year, and it's a puzzle platformer that is absolutely fantastic. Why are you still reading this? Go. Download it. It's incredible and brain-busting and beautiful, and the last level is a thing of genius.

____________________________
What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?
Click here to view the secret text

08-09-2008 at 07:40 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
lakibuk
Level: Delver
Avatar
Rank Points: 93
Registered: 03-26-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I am very interested in this game. Too bad i don't own a xbox.
Hopefully it's coming to PC soon.

____________________________
Karl
Blueskied Games (main site) - Gratis Spiele (german site)

[Last edited by lakibuk at 08-09-2008 11:52 AM]
08-09-2008 at 11:51 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Visit Homepage Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I bought it last night...partly because I saw you had, Matt, and I figured that was a good recommendation. I also did enjoy the demo, although I felt it didn't fully reveal the potential of the game. And overall, even with the $15 price, I really wanted to support indie developers on XBLA.

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
08-09-2008 at 04:20 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (+1)  
Oneiromancer wrote:
I bought it last night...partly because I saw you had, Matt, and I figured that was a good recommendation. I also did enjoy the demo, although I felt it didn't fully reveal the potential of the game. And overall, even with the $15 price, I really wanted to support indie developers on XBLA.

I pretty much bought the full version straight away, so I don't know if they put in any of World 4, 5 or 6 into the demo. I'd been following Braid for a while, because its creator has been fairly outspoken about game design in the more mainstream press and I've agreed with a lot of his thoughts.

The price comes about to avoid the scenario that befell another Live Arcade title, Space Giraffe, which is a Tempest-derived shooter made by the creator of Tempest, and whose first level partially consists of a giant, colour-shifting picture of a Microsoft games division executive. It didn't sell too well, although there are some who swear by it, and it was priced fairly low so the dude lost a lot of money. Microsoft were inclined to release Braid at 1200 fake Microsoft dollars, and the creator agreed because he figured that if the game was successful enough, he could always lower the price later, but if it was priced lower and only I bought it, then he'd go bankrupt.

Also, $15 in Australian dollars is a significantly more reasonable proposition. Most of our games are A$100.

Edit: I guess if the demo is kind of meh, I'll have to sell it. The basic premise is that it's a platformer, like Super Mario Bros., except that one button allows you to rewind time - essentially an unlimited undo. The game plays with this - each world features a different application for your time bending. You soon start to see objects that sit outside of time, so when you manipulate them and rewind, they don't rewind back. You can jump into a pit, grab a key that's outside time, rewind back to the top of the pit, and you're still holding the key.

Later worlds throw in more brain-breaking puzzles - one world maps time to horizontal movement, so as you walk right, time advances, and as you walk left, time rewinds. So if you jump on an enemy and bounce right, it stays alive because your jump is in a future that hasn't happened. Another world preserves what you did in the moments before you rewound, so there's two yous running around.

The actual gameplay, seeing as the rewind button takes the sting out of the platforming challenges, revolves around using your time powers to solve tricky puzzles and collect puzzle pieces. The puzzle pieces build a picture that reflects on the story of each world - the story as a whole is an allegorical reflection on time and obsession, but you can skip it if you want or if you find it tiresome. (It is interesting how it uses art, music and gameplay to push the story along, and it is convenient that the story isn't literal so it can get away with a subversion of Donkey Kong as a story element.)

And, as mentioned, the last level is a moment right up there with the best gaming has to offer, in my mind.

____________________________
What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?
Click here to view the secret text


[Last edited by Mattcrampy at 08-09-2008 05:49 PM]
08-09-2008 at 05:31 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
mrimer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 5056
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I'm anticipating the PC release with sweaty palms. I say sweaty.

____________________________
Gandalf? Yes... That's what they used to call me.
Gandalf the Grey. That was my name.
I am Gandalf the White.
And I come back to you now at the turn of the tide.
08-09-2008 at 08:32 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Mattcrampy wrote:
I pretty much bought the full version straight away, so I don't know if they put in any of World 4, 5 or 6 into the demo.
There's most of World 2, 2 levels out of World 3, and 1 level out of World 4 in the demo...not enough to "get" World 4, IMO. And it's really Worlds 4-6 that are truly innovative, so I think there really should have been at least one level from each world for people to get what is really being offered.

The best comparison to DROD is that many of the levels you think are impossible, but there definitely is a solution...you just need to start shifting those paradigms. Although I admit I still don't really "get" the mechanics of your shadow in World 5...not enough to get the most tricky puzzle pieces, at least. And the "trick" with the picture in World 2 was kind of unfair...I really only got it through pure luck...although realizing that each level was fully self-contained did help.

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
08-09-2008 at 09:25 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
lakibuk
Level: Delver
Avatar
Rank Points: 93
Registered: 03-26-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Mattcrampy wrote:
Later worlds throw in more brain-breaking puzzles - one world maps time to horizontal movement, so as you walk right, time advances, and as you walk left, time rewinds. So if you jump on an enemy and bounce right, it stays alive because your jump is in a future that hasn't happened.
This sounds crazy and great. Well written description of the game, btw.

____________________________
Karl
Blueskied Games (main site) - Gratis Spiele (german site)
08-10-2008 at 07:51 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Visit Homepage Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Snacko
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 448
Registered: 06-08-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I just finished this, the ending was incredible and even the epilogue has a few neat secrets that touch on the more realistic parts of the story.

I felt that this game was incredibly refreshing in both gameplay and storytelling stepping back from the conventional approaches of both and experimenting with what can be done with this art form, both actively challenging these conventions through the use of irony.

And now we're all sons of bitches, remember, there's a little Tim in all of us.

____________________________
Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions

[Last edited by Snacko at 08-10-2008 08:06 PM]
08-10-2008 at 08:02 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores Quote Reply
Znirk
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 613
Registered: 07-28-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Mattcrampy asked:
Why are you still reading this?
Mattcrampy answered his own question:
It's an XBLA arcade game
08-10-2008 at 10:08 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Mattcrampy wrote:
the last level is a thing of genius.
Mattcrampy wrote:
And, as mentioned, the last level is a moment right up there with the best gaming has to offer, in my mind.
Snacko wrote:
I just finished this, the ending was incredible and even the epilogue has a few neat secrets that touch on the more realistic parts of the story.
Okay, I beat the game the other night, and while the final world/level was fun, I guess I'm not exactly sure why there's so much praise in the above quotes. Is it the gameplay, the story, what? During one part I thought I was experiencing a bug, actually...the time rewind wasn't working like I expected and I eventually figured it was supposed to be that way, but it still seemed weird to me.

So what I would appreciate, actually, is a PM from Matt, Snacko, or someone else that thinks the last level/ending was the best thing ever to explain to me what I seem to be missing. Matt knows my XBL name, so he can see that I have all the non-speed-run achievements, but I'd rather not make it public otherwise.

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
08-11-2008 at 12:00 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Sillyman
Level: Smiter
Avatar
Rank Points: 339
Registered: 09-08-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Link me the PC demo as soon as possible.

____________________________
Who, me?
FNORD
08-11-2008 at 02:07 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Snacko
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 448
Registered: 06-08-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
For anyone who thinks they've beaten the game, know that there is a long and boring side quest that most likely involves completely arbitrary puzzles and deleting your save file left to complete. Have fun! :thumbsup

____________________________
Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions
08-11-2008 at 04:52 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores Quote Reply
hyphz
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 34
Registered: 01-02-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
What's so good about the ending is the "twist" that happens after the very last platform level. For me at least it was totally unexpected yet made absolute sense immediately afterwards, a kind of "ah!" thing. That isn't helped, though, by the fact it's also..
Click here to view the secret text

08-11-2008 at 05:08 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Snacko
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 448
Registered: 06-08-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
The alternate ending is somewhat different, and tragic in its own way.

____________________________
Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions
08-11-2008 at 05:50 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores Quote Reply
Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I need to think about it some more, but yeah, it seems like I was that guy in the art gallery just nodding and saying "ah, pretty picture" without actually understanding what he was seeing.

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
08-11-2008 at 08:49 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
a) I know your XBLA name? You sure?

b) I guess it is going to be kind of spoiled if you trigger the ending sequence and the game changes its rules in order to show you something, and the entire time you're thinking 'man, but I want to go up that ladder, why doesn't my rewind work?'

In any case, it definitely tops the King Dugan's Dungeon ending, in my mind, and there are certain similarities there.

____________________________
What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?
Click here to view the secret text

08-11-2008 at 11:45 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (+1)  
Oh look! Other posts. And here's an edit button. I forgot that existed.

Snacko wrote:
For anyone who thinks they've beaten the game, know that there is a long and boring side quest that most likely involves completely arbitrary puzzles and deleting your save file left to complete. Have fun! :thumbsup

They're not that arbitrary, except for one that repeats the treachery of images that's sadly not reflected in the plot, and one that's friggin' ridiculous. (They're hard, but certainly achievable.)

Znirk wrote:
Mattcrampy asked:
Why are you still reading this?
Mattcrampy answered his own question:
It's an XBLA arcade game

The Xbox 360 has certainly grown on me. The boxed games are fairly tiresome, with some interesting finds, but there's a lot of indie developers who are releasing downloadable titles on the system in an effort to find an audience. So there's a fair chunk of interesting games there.

I think a lot of developers are getting fed up with the PC market, with inconsistent hardware that interacts in unknown ways and a significant portion of the userbase that feels entitled to pirate a game and will use almost any excuse to weasel out of feeling guilty. The people who actually pay money have shown a clear preference for controlled platforms where less can go wrong, and for platforms that allow social experiences like unified friends lists and sharing of in-game achievements. This includes Steam, and Valve are seriously talking about a system that troubleshoots your games for you, which would basically be a killer app for Steam. Both Valve and Blizzard are adding external recognition of in-game achievements, something that Microsoft actually innovated on and something that I, and a lot of other players, have found to really enrich both the game and the social network around it. The high-score table is remarkably similar in this regard.

I don't think this is a bad thing, either - the platform providers for the hardcore games have been doing a better job than the casual portal sites ever did, providing both an outlet for indy developers to get an audience (the chief problem with developers just sticking their game up on a website) and incidentally resetting players' expectations on what a new, fun game has to look like. After so many years where it was the developers who could afford to get into retail stores and independents who mostly didn't get very far, it's the return of Apogee, except there's like five of them and they're all competing. In this sort of environment, indy developers have a chance to thrive like never before.

So, uh, buy an Xbox? (Although if you don't have a DS, buy that instead. At this point it's the best console out there, and it has a wide and deep variety of really great games - it's where both the roguelike revival and the adventure game revival started.)

____________________________
What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?
Click here to view the secret text


[Last edited by Mattcrampy at 08-11-2008 12:25 PM : tl;dr]
08-11-2008 at 12:05 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
hyphz
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 34
Registered: 01-02-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Snacko wrote:
The alternate ending is somewhat different, and tragic in its own way.

There's an alterate ending? Is that for having all the stars?

Edit: Whoa. I just saw it on YouTube. That's not just tragic, that's actually disturbing.

I guess it is going to be kind of spoiled if you trigger the ending sequence and the game changes its rules in order to show you something, and the entire time you're thinking 'man, but I want to go up that ladder, why doesn't my rewind work?'

Do you mean the very end? Rewind works normally throughout the "challenging" playable part of the ending that I could tell.. although it's the "Time and Forgiveness" style rewind, so you can't do anything with it you couldn't do without.

[Last edited by hyphz at 08-11-2008 04:39 PM]
08-11-2008 at 04:19 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Snacko
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 448
Registered: 06-08-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I think he means the very end of 1-1 when
Click here to view the secret text


____________________________
Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions
08-11-2008 at 08:09 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores Quote Reply
Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Mattcrampy wrote:
a) I know your XBLA name? You sure?
Considering I have you on my friends list, and I think it has to be mutual, I'd say yes. My assumption that it has to be mutual could be very wrong though.

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
08-11-2008 at 10:40 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Oneiromancer wrote:
Considering I have you on my friends list, and I think it has to be mutual, I'd say yes. My assumption that it has to be mutual could be very wrong though.

No, I have you, it's just that I forgot you. I have a reasonably large friends list, and I don't think I ever see you on.

____________________________
What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?
Click here to view the secret text

08-12-2008 at 05:19 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Mattcrampy wrote:
Oneiromancer wrote:
Considering I have you on my friends list, and I think it has to be mutual, I'd say yes. My assumption that it has to be mutual could be very wrong though.

No, I have you, it's just that I forgot you. I have a reasonably large friends list, and I don't think I ever see you on.
Considering the time difference, it's not surprising that you don't see me on much. I only remember seeing you active a few times. My friends list is rather short so I know who everyone is.

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
08-12-2008 at 12:30 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Snacko
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 448
Registered: 06-08-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (+1)  
Just got all the stars, damn that was a weird ending. Anyway, I think I've got a pretty good interpretation of the story. Note that this obviously has huge spoilers, don't read it unless you've either beat the game or have no intention of doing so.

Click here to view the secret text


What do you think?

____________________________
Director of the Department of Orderly Disruptions

[Last edited by Snacko at 08-13-2008 07:12 PM : Because I felt like it.]
08-13-2008 at 01:39 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores Quote Reply
eytanz
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2708
Registered: 02-05-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Snacko - how about using the secret tags?

____________________________
I got my avatar back! Yay!
08-13-2008 at 02:48 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Oneiromancer
Level: Legendary Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2936
Registered: 03-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Ah. I tried to avoid reading about the stuff I haven't unlocked, but referring to the first ending...I turned music off because I usually do when playing games...I have my mp3s playing on my speakers. So that's one reason I missed a huge hint about what was going on...I didn't hear how the music sounded different when you rewind.

____________________________
"He who is certain he knows the ending of things when he is only beginning them is either extremely wise or extremely foolish; no matter which is true, he is certainly an unhappy man, for he has put a knife in the heart of wonder." -- Tad Williams
08-13-2008 at 10:37 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Mattcrampy
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2388
Registered: 05-29-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I can't imagine Braid without the music - it's not just a soundtrack that plays over the game, especially when it's used to communicate the way time's moving.

Click here to view the secret text


____________________________
What do you call an elephant at the North Pole?
Click here to view the secret text

08-15-2008 at 08:30 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
slimm tom
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1228
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (+1)  
Extra! Extra!

For all people without XBOXes, Braid released on PC yesterday!

Get it on 1 of four distribution channels.

Greenhouse
Steam
Impulse
GamersGate
04-11-2009 at 11:00 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores Quote Reply
NiroZ
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 1302
Registered: 02-12-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
I kinda want to get it because I hate to miss out on anything, and I'm a sucker for the critically acclaimed. On the other hand, I've never liked tricky platformers, mainly because I suck at them. Indeed the only platformer I've ever finished was Iji, which I quite enjoyed. But mario, sonic, zelda (ok, not quite a platformer, but I see it like one), fancy pants, never really got me.

Hmmm.

04-11-2009 at 11:52 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
slimm tom
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1228
Registered: 10-14-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
Maybe the fact you can't die in Braid helps with the decision? There's no such thing as precision jumping with time rewind, so you can't really get stuck on the platformer aspect of the game.
04-11-2009 at 11:59 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores Quote Reply
Briareos
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 3516
Registered: 08-07-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: Braid (0)  
slimm tom wrote:
There's no such thing as precision jumping with time rewind[...]
My experience with last year's Prince of Persia (and to a lesser degree Mirror's Edge) says otherwise, but I guess it's close enough to not having to be very precise... :)

np: Radiohead - Airbag (Live at Bayside Embarcadero, San Diego CA (27.06.2006))

____________________________
"I'm not anti-anything, I'm anti-everything, it fits better." - Sole
R.I.P. Robert Feldhoff (1962-2009) :(
04-11-2009 at 05:02 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Visit Homepage Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Page 1 of 3
23
New Topic New Poll Post Reply
Caravel Forum : Other Boards : Electronic Games : Braid
Surf To:


Forum Rules:
Can I post a new topic? No
Can I reply? No
Can I read? Yes
HTML Enabled? No
UBBC Enabled? Yes
Words Filter Enable? No

Contact Us | CaravelGames.com

Powered by: tForum tForumHacks Edition b0.98.8
Originally created by Toan Huynh (Copyright © 2000)
Enhanced by the tForumHacks team and the Caravel team.