Announcement: Be excellent to each other.


Caravel Forum : Caravel Boards : Contests : I challenge you...To a Duel! (Not me personally...you'll see.)
Page 1 of 2
2
New Topic New Poll Post Reply
Poster Message
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon I challenge you...To a Duel! (+2)  
I came up with this contest idea while thinking.

Many of us are architects. Many of us play DROD. Many contests are based around these themes. But competition has been limited to high scores, for the most part, and there really hasn't been any one-on-one competition.

This will change that.

Dueling Drodders.

This will be set up in single-elimination tournament style. This requires a power of two to play. I think 8 is the likely number, but hopefully we will get 16 or more players.

Each round, you will make a one-room hold, based on a theme of my choosing. You must submit a demo to me, along with your hold. My email is (my username, yes that thing with the numbers)@yahoo.com. I did it like that for spam. If you can't figure it out, you will quickly lose this contest. You must have "DROD" in the subject line. This is just so I can keep this organized.

To keep it fair and balanced, I will not be playing. You will be paired off in sign-up order, with 1 playing 8, 2 playing 7, and so on. Each round, the seeding will be reset using the same ordering, but eliminating those who lost. Each pair will play each other's holds. The winner of each round will be determined by completion, then deathcount, then movecount, then democount, then time taken. This means that if you both complete it, and both players have the same deathcount, I look at the overall movecount. Golf scores here--fewer is better in all cases.

New Rules! You may not use scripting to cause any sort of delay. This includes cutscenes, open door on move..., or anything that resembles a delay, with scripting. I will make this subjective. If you think it might break this rule, don't do it. Other elements are perfectly valid. I just don't want a "guess which turn the door opens!" contest.

"Cheating" is possible. You are on an honor code to give an accurate account of your playing the hold. Karma will come back to bite you if you don't.

You must take a screenshot of your "Hold Totals" image, for completion to be granted. If you do not complete the hold, you lose. If both of you fail to complete the hold, you are both eliminated, and somebody will get a bye.

Things you must submit to be eligible for each next round:

1. A screenshot of your Hold Totals, for your opponent's hold.
2. A demo of your solution to your opponent's hold.
3. Your new hold for the next round. Whether it will be used or not depends upon your survival in the previous round.
4. A demo of your new hold, showing it is possible.

If even one of those is missing by the time the next round starts, you lose automatically.

For this first round, you will have until the end of June 14th to sign up and submit a hold with a demo (no need for #s 1 and 2.) Each round after the first will last one week.

At the end of each round, I will post all relevant information in one file.

This round's theme is: Disconnected Gel and Gel Mothers.

Oh, and the winnings.

1st place: +40
2nd place: +20
3rd and 4th place: +10

All units are in mod points. Happy dueling! (Feel free to ask questions as well.)



____________________________
Click here to view the secret text


[Last edited by zex20913 at 06-05-2007 03:41 PM]
06-04-2007 at 08:13 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Bobpie
Level: Delver
Avatar
Rank Points: 54
Registered: 04-26-2007
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
I hope sign up is here.
cause i am sooooooo in :w00t
06-04-2007 at 10:07 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
NiroZ
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1277
Registered: 02-12-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
quote:
zex20913 wrote:
1st place: +40
2nd place: +20
3rd and 4th place: +10

All units are in mod points.

So you will spend X amount on their posts, or you will mod them up to that amount?

____________________________
Instead of pouring in more
better stop while you can
making it sharper
won’t help it last longer

-Lao Tzu

06-05-2007 at 03:39 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
I will attempt to do the former, but notify if I must do the latter.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-05-2007 at 03:48 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Dex Stewart
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 355
Registered: 01-19-2007
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
I'm in and hope for a lucky #7 :).
06-05-2007 at 04:47 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Kevin_P86
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 534
Registered: 06-28-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Sure, sounds fun.

I just have one question: With your current scoring system, it seems everyone is simply encouraged to make as long of a room as possible, since a seemingly important criterion is movecount. So if I make a room that can't be completed in less than 100,000 moves, whereas my opponent's room can be completed in significantly less (even 2,000 - a rather long room), that's probably enough to ensure I can't possibly lose, assuming I can complete my opponent's room. No?

____________________________
+++++[>+++++<-]>[>+++>++++>+++++<<<-]>.>+.>-------.<++++.+++++.
06-05-2007 at 05:01 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
You also have to submit a demo, and the second tiebreak (aside from completion) is deathcount, not movecount.

But yes. Game theory has its place in every competition.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-05-2007 at 05:37 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Kevin_P86
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 534
Registered: 06-28-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
quote:
zex20913 wrote:
You also have to submit a demo, and the second tiebreak (aside from completion) is deathcount, not movecount.
So perhaps I'm just not understanding it, so let's try to clarify: When you say "movecount" (and, likewise, deathcount) does that just include my moves (deaths) taken to complete my opponent's room? Or is it my total movecount (deathcount) on both rooms (mine and my opponent's)?

____________________________
+++++[>+++++<-]>[>+++>++++>+++++<<<-]>.>+.>-------.<++++.+++++.
06-05-2007 at 05:40 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
I am only counting the results from your opponent's hold.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-05-2007 at 05:51 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Kevin_P86
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 534
Registered: 06-28-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
quote:
zex20913 wrote:
I am only counting the results from your opponent's hold.
In which case, I can make a room that takes no less than 100,000 moves to complete (more importantly, longer than my opponent's room), and make excessive use of backspace and 'r' such that I can complete my opponent's room without dying, and have what no way of losing. Correct?

____________________________
+++++[>+++++<-]>[>+++>++++>+++++<<<-]>.>+.>-------.<++++.+++++.
06-05-2007 at 07:02 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Hmm...I would like to say yes, but then somebody may make a poor room with a script that opens a door on move number 61,231,523. And I don't want that. I am adding a rule prohibiting "scripting delays". See the first post.

Aside from scripting delays, yes. Any non-scripted movecount fitting the requirements is acceptable. But keep in mind that your opponent may be doing the same thing, and that you must submit a valid demo.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text


[Last edited by zex20913 at 06-05-2007 08:07 AM]
06-05-2007 at 08:01 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Tahnan
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 2437
Registered: 11-14-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Here's something to note: it's not hard to cheat to get a remarkably low time and no deaths. Simply play a room, taking as long as you want and dying as much as you want, optimize to your heart's content. Then select "new game" from the play menu, and play the hold quickly and cleanly. No deaths, short move rate.

I have no problem with the idea of an honor code--"if you really want to cheat, it's on your conscience, but you're going to hell"--but I think it needs to be clear up-front that (a) cheating is possible and (b) you're on your honor not to do it.

That aside, I fear the incredibly painful holds people will make, since there's a huge incentive here to build a room that's possible but very, very hard. "Perfection"-style lynchpin hard; or careful hold management hard. (You might want a rule about having to include checkpoints. Or: it might be interesting to make the hold anyone-edit, and allow each competitor to experiment freely and use unlimited undo on their way to finding a solution.)

I shan't be competing, myself, but not because I think it's a bad idea; I'll in fact be watching avidly. I just don't think I'm a good enough architect to create an interesting room on short notice.
06-05-2007 at 09:19 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
silver
Level: Smitemaster
Rank Points: 913
Registered: 01-18-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
just an aside - maybe an idea for a different/future contest, when I read this, I kind of envision something like liar's dice, or a bidding war -- you start with a pool of "resources" (ala Unfortunate Architect, but updated to include JtRH and TCB elements) and bet the opponent you can 'beat' them with some subset of those components. then the opponent can say, "try it" or lower the number of elements.

i.e. under a highly simplified playing field
A: I bet I can beat you with 1 brain and 32 roaches, 1 serpent, and 3 orbs
B: I bet I can beat you with 1 brain and 32 roaches, and 2 orbs
A: I bet I can beat you with 1 brain and 32 roaches, and ONE orb.
B: try it, sucka.
then A has to submit a room in X hours or lose, then B has to submit a winning demo in X hours or lose.


____________________________
:yinyang

[Last edited by silver at 06-05-2007 02:32 PM]
06-05-2007 at 02:28 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
@Tahnan--A very good point. I shall add that honor code, as the competition part has not yet started.

I also feel that one week is enough time to beat any room. I could be totally wrong, but I do look forward to seeing the difficult rooms people come up with.

ALSO ADDING AN EMAIL RULE, which I previously forgot to mention.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-05-2007 at 03:40 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Neather2
Level: Smiter
Avatar
Rank Points: 405
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Count me in. I'm still busy, but i can found time to the next days.

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.
06-09-2007 at 06:55 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Neather2
Level: Smiter
Avatar
Rank Points: 405
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
A thing, if i have understood good, we must build a room-hold based on your theme. My opponent's must build 1 more. I need to complete the opponent's turn with a demo of my solution and the score, and my opponent's too?

I need send to you the solution of my room. Correct? :)

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.

[Last edited by Neather2 at 06-09-2007 06:58 AM]
06-09-2007 at 06:58 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Geiler Hengst
Level: Delver
Rank Points: 64
Registered: 03-15-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (+2)  
ok...

i love the idea of a contest with 1v1 system and several rounds, but i really dont like the judging system. There are simply too many ways to abuse it.

Just make an incredible hard and long room, where each and every little mistake can finish you of and the other one has no chance to solve it whatsoever. You on the other hand can record a demo in the editor so u can go backwards as many times as you want.

Why dont you take at least the difference between the movecount of both opponents? Like Opponent A submits a hold with a demo of 2000 moves, and beats B's hold in 7200 moves. Opponent B on the other hand needs 7100 for his hold and 2200 for A's

This would give B a score of 200 moves surplus and A one of 100. This would make it rather uninteresting to produce long rooms as they are easier to optimze for the builder himself and doesnt give any bonus.

Hope you get/like my idea
06-09-2007 at 03:40 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Oh man. I wish I had thought of that scoring system before creating this. It sounds a lot better/uncheatable than mine.

If I run this again, I'd probably use that instead.

@Neather2: Yes, you must
1. Create a room, based on the theme.
2. Solve that room, and send a demo.
3. Beat your opponents' room, and send a demo, and a screenshot of your hold totals.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-09-2007 at 10:27 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Neather2
Level: Smiter
Avatar
Rank Points: 405
Registered: 07-18-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Thanks zex. I hope to the game start soon! :)

____________________________
Nothing to say. I just play the game. And you, sir, should play it too.

Conspiracy, my new hold, has just been released.
06-10-2007 at 07:37 AM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Okay. The current matchups are:

1. Bobpie v. Neather2.
2. Dex Stewart v. Kevin P86.

Since only 4 people showed up, I feel that I may need to change the mod point distribution a bit...I'll keep the same ratio, no matter what. And I'm still undecided.

Anyway! I expect your holds to be in my inbox (check first post for email) by next Thursday, even though they were supposed to be in today.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-15-2007 at 07:38 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 954
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Can I try?

I could either:

1- Challenge someone else when one comes
2- Fight the last person remaining.

Also, when this contest ends, can you make a 'unlimited' duel game like I did with Jeff_ray Says?

____________________________
I make Let's Plays too!
Click here to find out my LPs' progress, and find out what I plan to tackle next!

Currently playing:
Click here to view the secret text


My Holds:
-Completed:
Click here to view the secret text

-Work in Progress:
Click here to view the secret text

06-15-2007 at 09:19 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
The only way I will allow you entry is if you persuade one of the people who signed up to give you their spot (this goes for any and all who feels this way.) Both you and the person who was originally signed up must send me a PM saying as much.

I may do this in FG as well, after this is done. But I would hold out for more people than just 4.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-15-2007 at 09:57 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Lst6
Level: Master Delver
Avatar
Rank Points: 211
Registered: 05-05-2006
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
I think this link is relevant to allow Jeff_Ray's entrance (And yes, I confirm it's true since he said that to me too)

____________________________
What a wonderfull world Internet is :)
Miscellanious:
Back in Spain, but I wish it were not THAT hot here.
Things related to the Bar:
Click here to view the secret text

Working on: NOTHING
Accomplishments i'm proud of:
-Solving the bar riddle
06-15-2007 at 10:04 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
zex20913
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 1721
Registered: 02-04-2003
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Hmm...okay. In the spirit of competition and whatnot, Jeff may submit a hold. If Neather2 does not submit an entry, Jeff will have taken his spot.

____________________________
Click here to view the secret text

06-15-2007 at 10:50 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 954
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Can you tell me how many rooms are allowed per hold?

____________________________
I make Let's Plays too!
Click here to find out my LPs' progress, and find out what I plan to tackle next!

Currently playing:
Click here to view the secret text


My Holds:
-Completed:
Click here to view the secret text

-Work in Progress:
Click here to view the secret text


[Last edited by Jeff_Ray... at 06-15-2007 11:11 PM]
06-15-2007 at 11:11 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dex Stewart
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 355
Registered: 01-19-2007
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
quote:
zex20913 wrote:
Each round, you will make a one-room hold, based on a theme of my choosing.


*ahem*
06-15-2007 at 11:14 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Jeff_Ray...
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 954
Registered: 05-16-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Thanks. Well, you know, I try not to search each tiny letter for the answer, because of my eye problem. Anyways, the room along with the screen and demo should come packed by Sunday.

____________________________
I make Let's Plays too!
Click here to find out my LPs' progress, and find out what I plan to tackle next!

Currently playing:
Click here to view the secret text


My Holds:
-Completed:
Click here to view the secret text

-Work in Progress:
Click here to view the secret text

06-15-2007 at 11:30 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts High Scores This architect's holds Quote Reply
Dex Stewart
Level: Smiter
Rank Points: 355
Registered: 01-19-2007
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Oh well, I sent my hold.

Unfortunately, I have been blocked in bed with a very nasty cold (hopefully only that) for the last ~36 hours, so I whipped something together, which is... quite easy (: .
06-20-2007 at 08:47 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Neathro
Level: Delver
Avatar
Rank Points: 41
Registered: 04-24-2007
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
Suggestion:

How about a rule that says the hold maker must not have any gaps between movement/waiting that are longer than X seconds? That might solve the UU (unlimited undo) problem?

Just an idea.

____________________________
This is not a signature, it is a
collection of randomly selected
words. Teaspoon.
06-21-2007 at 05:29 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts Quote Reply
Kevin_P86
Level: Smitemaster
Avatar
Rank Points: 534
Registered: 06-28-2005
IP: Logged
icon Re: I challenge you...To a Duel! (0)  
How is there an unlimited undo problem? It isn't possible to record demos from the editor anyways, so any demo submitted by an architect will be recorded outside of the editor, in the same circumstances as the opponent playing it (i.e. without unlimited undo).

____________________________
+++++[>+++++<-]>[>+++>++++>+++++<<<-]>.>+.>-------.<++++.+++++.
06-21-2007 at 08:05 PM
View Profile Send Private Message to User Send Email to User Show all user's posts This architect's holds Quote Reply
Page 1 of 2
2
New Topic New Poll Post Reply
Caravel Forum : Caravel Boards : Contests : I challenge you...To a Duel! (Not me personally...you'll see.)
Surf To:


Forum Rules:
Can I post a new topic? No
Can I reply? No
Can I read? Yes
HTML Enabled? No
UBBC Enabled? Yes
Words Filter Enable? No

Contact Us | CaravelGames.com

Powered by: tForum tForumHacks Edition b0.98.8
Originally created by Toan Huynh (Copyright © 2000)
Enhanced by the tForumHacks team and the Caravel team.